What you're saying is really ridiculous. Do you "kill, rape, torture, lie, deceive" when you listen metal!? Does Katatonia(and lots of other bands) have such a concept!? Plus, Christianity orders you to "turn the other cheek", in Islam it's "an eye for an eye"...Wanderer said:
Why does "Omerta" end suddenly.......??
- Thread starter waz416
- Start date
Wanderer
Decayed Smile
No i did not mean that.I mean all religions have the same logic.Sorrow is a bad feeling in all of them too kill,torture are just examples.To feel sorrow,To torture your self are sins in all religions.
Jinn
Saint
Alustriel said:
Actually, They do.
The first Four Caliphs after Prophet Muhammad all deemed music Forbidden, as did Muhammad, except on special holidays such as Eid.
Mainstream Islam [Sunni] also forbids music.
Shia [Shi'ite] does allow certain forms of music as worship.
There are many other sects but you get the idea.
and another thing, Please don't tell me I need to look at Islam.
I'm a volunteer at WhyIslam.org and a Da'ee for the same website.
...and where in the HELL does Turkey come into all this???
The Scourge
Suicide Machine
dg
Member
Lion in a Cage said:
What are you talking about?? If the Cd has a defect and the "real" song ends after 3:31, then why the hell would Peaceville would have included the defect version in the Black Sessions Boxset??? Mine ends after 2:56...
Does this 3:31 version really exist or did you dream it??
Jinn said:
Some facts about all religions are very questionable as we see... Some rules of religions were determined according to the circumstances of the time that religion appeared. In modern countries where most of the population is Muslim, music is something quite away from being forbidden. Such things can only be a matter of a caricature, if an extreme event takes place. Those who say or imply that music should be forbidden and is a sin are isolated from the society. Theirs is forsooth bigotry, which can't be related with Islam and any other sensible religion.
When you said "your leaders..." I thought that you think we are (people of Turkey) devoted to and ruled by some dusty mullahs that don't exist nearly for a century. There are lagal punishments for such people.
Also it is great that you have an interest.
As you guess I am too sensitive to subjects that are "sensitive". I see that you are too. Thanks for this.
As I said before, there are no rules or commands against music in the Holy Koran, and since there aren't it'd either mean that such rules never existed or it was only a one-time thing, like Alustriel said. I think its total bullshit, and was probably made up by wahabi leaders for their personal benefit. The "wahabi" sect was reassambled by the english in the beginning of the 20th century to harm the Ottoman Empire and stir middle-east to make way for the jews. The British royal family were under the influence of Mason lounges at that time(and they most probably still are, like most of the rest of the world) so they helped make up many stupid laws against the advancement of Islam...
Of course I can't change the view of people here, by saying some sentences limited by my humble knowledge... But I see that one should be a Turk or raised as a Turk in a Muslim family with modern ideas to understand what I mean... One might comprehend unfortunately only in this way I guess... (I insist on the detail of being like a person I describe because there are still people of some countries that love the "dust" I mentioned.)
Thank you Lion in a Cage
Thank you Lion in a Cage
gone
zabijasz mnie
Wanderer said:
I don't know about Islam or other religions, but for Christians pain and suffering can have spiritual meaning. Jesus was crucified and suffered to redeem the sins of humanity, even though he could have easily avoided death. Remember the flagellants and holy martyrs? When speaking against euthanasia for terminally ill people, Christian priests usually speak of 'finding the transcendental meaning of pain' or some other gibberish.
(this of course is in contradiction to the bible, which says that the body is the temple of the soul and was given to people by God and as such it is a sin to destroy it, but that's beside the point.)
So, technically, if you listen to depressing music and suffer spiritually, but manage to find some 'transcendental meaning' of the pain, it's not a sin. Or something
Wanderer
Decayed Smile
"When someone hit your face turn the other side" it is passivism not about pain.Good people do not attack their attackers but showing the shame of the attackers sins by turning the other side.The subject i mean is different.Mourning for your lover or relatives is very different.You don't act heroicly.You dont protect the weak or bear their sins.You just feel sorrow by your own pitifulness by your wrong acts or by others wrong acts to you.It is selfish.So you described heroism not sorrow or pain.And so pain and agony subject is NOT explained well.
Jinn
Saint
this thread turned from an explaination about Omerta to a discussion about Islam.
I love this board!
I love this board!
Lion in a cage: the koran is not the only source for Islmaic rules...., Prophet moh'd acts (Al-sunnah Al-naboyah) is also is a source of islamic rules.
MUSIC IN ISLAM
Contents
Introduction
Music is Haram
The Effects
Introduction
In recent years, certain developments have taken place which has brought the subject of music as an extremely significant issue. Music has spread to such an extent that it is afflicting every muslim in this modern era. Today, individuals are being confronted by a situation where one is forced to listen to music whether by choice or without. Music is played in nearly all department stores and super markets. Even whilst walking in the streets, we find cars blaring with music. No matter which direction we go, we are blasted with music. The increasing popularity of music, which is prevalent in our society poses a tremendous danger for muslims.
return to contents
Music is Haraam
References within the context of the Holy Qur`aan along with the Hadith of the Prophet confirm that music is haraam.
Interpreters of the Qur`aan have defined the term `lahwal hadith` which is mentioned in the Qur`aan as:
1) Singing and listening to songs.
2) Purchasing of male and female singers.
3) Purchase of instruments of fun and amusement.
When Sayyidana Abdullah Ibne Mas`ood , a very close companion of our Prophet was asked about the meaning of the term `lahwal hadith`, he replied
I swear by Him besides whom there is no other God,that it refers to ghinaa (singing ).
This statement, he repeated three times. This view is unanimously supported by the four Khalifas, the eminent Sahabaah, Tabi`een, the four Imaams and other reliable Islaamic scholars and authorities.
One hadith from the Bukhari Shareef, the most authentic Book of Hadith, further confirms unlawfulness of music and singing :
`There will be people of my Ummah who will seek to make lawful; fornication, wine-drinking and the use of ma`aazif ( musical instruments ).`
Detailed analysis of the arabic word `ma`aazif ` shows that it refers to musical instruments, the sounds of those musical instruments and singing with the accompaniment of instruments.
Closer analysis of the wordings of the Hadith establishes the prohibition of music. Firstly, the words `seek to make lawful ` shows that music is not permissible, as logically one can only seek to make lawful that which is not allowed. Secondly, if music was not prohibited, then it would not have been brought within the same context as fornication and wine-drinking.
return to contents
MUSIC - IT`S EFFECTS
Muslims are aware that nothing has been prohibited by Allah except that which is harmful to the welfare of a Muslim individual and the society as a whole. The divine attribute behind the prohibition of music can be comprehended by looking into the diverse influence music can have.
Experiments carried out by doctors and professors have confirmed that the music of today is such that it does not only affect the brain, but each and every organ of one`s body. There is a close relationship between music and bodily movements. We find that people listening to music automatically start tapping their fingers and feet, as if the music is permeating in their blood.
It is also proved that music affect`s one`s emotions, increases arousal in terms of alertness and excitement and also leads to various physiological changes in the person. In a psychology experiment, it was found that listening to moderate type of music increased one`s normal heart beat, whilst listening to rock music the heart beat increased even further, yet people claim that music has no effect.
It is a very ignorant and misguided attitude to percieve music as a form of pleasure and passing of time, since the messages of today`s music follow a general theme of love, fornication, drugs and freedom.
We find that the whole world is obsessed with the kufr idea of freedom, i.e. freedom of speech, freedom of movement, etc. In western schools and universities, we observe independence, free expression and secular thinking being encouraged. This idea of freedom, It`s my life, I`ll do what I want is a predominant, underlying theme of today`s music. It is being used as a means for drilling western ideologies, which are totally contrary to Islamic Shariah and values, into the minds of Muslims.
One should abstain from evil audacities such as listening to music and encourage others to do the same too.
MAY ALMIGHTY ALLAH GUIDE US ALL TO THE STRAIGHT PATH-
AMEEN.
MUSIC IN ISLAM
Contents
Introduction
Music is Haram
The Effects
Introduction
In recent years, certain developments have taken place which has brought the subject of music as an extremely significant issue. Music has spread to such an extent that it is afflicting every muslim in this modern era. Today, individuals are being confronted by a situation where one is forced to listen to music whether by choice or without. Music is played in nearly all department stores and super markets. Even whilst walking in the streets, we find cars blaring with music. No matter which direction we go, we are blasted with music. The increasing popularity of music, which is prevalent in our society poses a tremendous danger for muslims.
return to contents
Music is Haraam
References within the context of the Holy Qur`aan along with the Hadith of the Prophet confirm that music is haraam.
Interpreters of the Qur`aan have defined the term `lahwal hadith` which is mentioned in the Qur`aan as:
1) Singing and listening to songs.
2) Purchasing of male and female singers.
3) Purchase of instruments of fun and amusement.
When Sayyidana Abdullah Ibne Mas`ood , a very close companion of our Prophet was asked about the meaning of the term `lahwal hadith`, he replied
I swear by Him besides whom there is no other God,that it refers to ghinaa (singing ).
This statement, he repeated three times. This view is unanimously supported by the four Khalifas, the eminent Sahabaah, Tabi`een, the four Imaams and other reliable Islaamic scholars and authorities.
One hadith from the Bukhari Shareef, the most authentic Book of Hadith, further confirms unlawfulness of music and singing :
`There will be people of my Ummah who will seek to make lawful; fornication, wine-drinking and the use of ma`aazif ( musical instruments ).`
Detailed analysis of the arabic word `ma`aazif ` shows that it refers to musical instruments, the sounds of those musical instruments and singing with the accompaniment of instruments.
Closer analysis of the wordings of the Hadith establishes the prohibition of music. Firstly, the words `seek to make lawful ` shows that music is not permissible, as logically one can only seek to make lawful that which is not allowed. Secondly, if music was not prohibited, then it would not have been brought within the same context as fornication and wine-drinking.
return to contents
MUSIC - IT`S EFFECTS
Muslims are aware that nothing has been prohibited by Allah except that which is harmful to the welfare of a Muslim individual and the society as a whole. The divine attribute behind the prohibition of music can be comprehended by looking into the diverse influence music can have.
Experiments carried out by doctors and professors have confirmed that the music of today is such that it does not only affect the brain, but each and every organ of one`s body. There is a close relationship between music and bodily movements. We find that people listening to music automatically start tapping their fingers and feet, as if the music is permeating in their blood.
It is also proved that music affect`s one`s emotions, increases arousal in terms of alertness and excitement and also leads to various physiological changes in the person. In a psychology experiment, it was found that listening to moderate type of music increased one`s normal heart beat, whilst listening to rock music the heart beat increased even further, yet people claim that music has no effect.
It is a very ignorant and misguided attitude to percieve music as a form of pleasure and passing of time, since the messages of today`s music follow a general theme of love, fornication, drugs and freedom.
We find that the whole world is obsessed with the kufr idea of freedom, i.e. freedom of speech, freedom of movement, etc. In western schools and universities, we observe independence, free expression and secular thinking being encouraged. This idea of freedom, It`s my life, I`ll do what I want is a predominant, underlying theme of today`s music. It is being used as a means for drilling western ideologies, which are totally contrary to Islamic Shariah and values, into the minds of Muslims.
One should abstain from evil audacities such as listening to music and encourage others to do the same too.
MAY ALMIGHTY ALLAH GUIDE US ALL TO THE STRAIGHT PATH-
AMEEN.
If listening to music leads one to something really bad, since I believe in Allah, should I not listen...? Does it end with this... Can we say the entertainment via music is evil?
Let Allah judge it...
Let Allah judge it...
That's what I was talking about. All those stuff are either MADE UP or FALSELY INTERPRETED. Holy Koran is the only real source and saying that something is haram which the Koran doesn't say anything about is blasphemy!dead inside said:
Mantraschism
Skáld
/goes to start 'ANDERS, isteh cahracter in OMERAT reall yMohammad???' thread
(No offense meant to the current discussion in this thread, which is actually quite interesting, especially since I am a student of Arabic فصحة currently.)
(No offense meant to the current discussion in this thread, which is actually quite interesting, especially since I am a student of Arabic فصحة currently.)
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