Why is Asia not a great Metal continent ?

[Bruticus]

READ BEFORE SPEWING OFF-TOPIC WASTE:
Everyone will mention their niche obscure metal band from Indonesia, Japan and Nepal, but you realize as you think for 2 seconds it's off topic. The topic isn't whether there are any metal bands at all in those areas but why as a general phenomenon it's a genre that hasn't at all inspired and generated good/to great metal bands.

Japan (or S.Korea) for e.g. is very similar to the West socio-economically: they've had a society that welcomes individualism and iconoclast artists, no theocratic religious govnmt police, they've had a comfortable middle class, which is wealthy enough where a kid can ask his parents for a guitar and studio records growing up...

And although it's been a limited window, other developing countries like India, or the Philippines, Nepal, Thailand, Middle-East, Iran... have now received the influences of globalization for a while, so the internet, YouTube, Facebook, major concerts played in their cities, vast amounts of expats for many decades now... but still globally SUCK tbh and haven't produced a slue of world class metal bands as may've been reasonably anticipated.

WHY IS THAT ????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[HamburgerBoy]

Japan has plenty of great metal bands. Probably because they're honorary Aryans.

 

[Slammed]

A look down the list of MA shows asian countries have thousands of bands. Maybe they aren't all known to mainstream audiences but that doesn't mean the place doesn't make great metal. Then again Marty Freidman was quoted in the press recently saying Japan is not known for metal, so if Marty says it and the press reprints it it has to be true.

 

[no country for old wainds]

japan has a great tradition of heavy music that pretty much goes as far back as the west's, so i'm not sure they should be grouped into this. otherwise, there are quite a few asian countries whose societies are probably too conservative for metal to thrive outside of the underground--metal's literally illegal in some of them i believe. others just may not have a compatible culture, which also seems to be true of some european countries tbf if their mediocre metal scenes are anything to go by. metal is kind of a bizarre phenomenon that probably requires a specific cultural mood to really flourish.

 

[TechnicalBarbarity]

 

[challenge_everything]

Poverty and lack of means would be the biggest factor. Playing music full time or even part time is a luxury afforded to those who don't need to worry too much about putting food on the table. Plus metal in particular relies heavily on the internet for dissemination these days.

Conservative cultures/governments are also a big factor. There is an underground metal scene in Iran for example but it is literally illegal, these people gamble their freedom playing such music. Many other countries are also like this.

 

[jimmy101]

A mate of mine who used to play drums for Whoretopsy played at a massive festival in Jakarta a few years ago. Probably 20,000+ in attendance.

Plus I know for a fact that metal has a huge following in India. In fact, if you look a population numbers alone there's every chance that most of the metalheads from around the world are or Asian extraction.

 

[Allfader]

Look up on metal map and you'll see.

 

[CiG]

The west started developing its metal roots in the 60's, by contrast Asia only started to go through the growing pains of developing a heavy metal scene/culture in what, the late 70's if we're being generous? And that's Japan, the most developed of them all.

 

[HamburgerBoy]

Flower Travellin' Band was more metal than anything in the West in the 60s.

 

[CiG]

Bullshit. Firstly they're primarily a 70's band, their 60's material was mostly covers of heavy western stuff like "21st Century Schizoid Man." Their 1969 debut Challenge was tame and mostly pop rock/psych rock covers.

Secondly the heaviest song on their sophomore from 1970 is their cover of "Black Sabbath."

Edit: What was so heavy on their 1969 debut album? Been ages since I listened to it, but I doubt it has anything heavier than Hendrix, Cream, Blue Cheer, Deep Purple, High Tide, King Crimson etc.

 

[HamburgerBoy]

I meant that their 70s material was more metal than 60s proto-metal or whatever; I forgot about their very first album, my mistake. My point more broadly is that there wasn't much of a metal scene anywhere in the world in the 60s. Additionally, "the west" basically just means the UK in this context. I don't think Japan was any further behind the USA, for example, in the early-mid 70s.

 

[CiG]

By the time FTB were "heavy" Black Sabbath were already working on their 4th album in late '71. They literally formed because Yuya saw Hendrix live and went back to Japan to form a cover band, which lasted for like 2 albums until Satori. Other heavy proto-metal/heavy psych bands from Japan like Blues Creation were at their heaviest in the early days when covering western bands.

I think another big part of why Asia's metal scene developed way slower than the UK/US is due to almost no cultural interaction with blues music, until it had become popularized enough not to be ignored. Much of the heavy metal that developed in the UK comes directly from adapting US blues music. So essentially the Japanese had to wait until the UK developed this American creation into something heavy, and then they hitched their wagon.

FTB's 70's music might have been heavier than western 60's music, but that's just a redundant point because they only got to that level by aping heavy western music from the 60's in the first place.

 

[Allfader]

There's also this thing about Japan where they are totally struck in the 80's. Not sure why, but it seems to happen.

 

[Bruticus]

I don't buy the argument that there are great but unknown metal bands. If a band is great (provided it has the outlet, obviously, but who doesn't with the internet) it will be known it's great. Labels will immediately jump at the chance to sign them and milk the big bucks out of them. So there's a reason for e.g. there are tons of well known Swedish bands and very few Italian ones. It's because Sweden is good, and Italy isn't. Not because Sweden just happens to have some sort of limelight over it and poor Italy has no exposure. Metal is not immune to the natural rules of the free market: if you're good, we'll know.

And is it really a satisfying argument to say those Asian countries just don't have enough good labels and studios around ? Sepultura went to Florida to record those early albums, and Brazil is third world but still produces quality metal bands.

 

[Slammed]

I think you're just to blind to see anything but your own argument. You don't see bands as popular therefore they aren't.

 

[CiG]

I don't think Japan was any further behind the USA, for example, in the early-mid 70s.

Sir Lord Baltimore, Bang, Mountain, Dust, Grand Funk (1969!) - just a few bands that come to mind from the US that had already trailblazed American proto-metal by the time the first truly heavy (without relying on tons of western cover songs) Japanese albums came out like Satori, Shinki Chen & His Friends and Demon & Eleven Children in '71.

I don't buy the argument that there are great but unknown metal bands. If a band is great (provided it has the outlet, obviously, but who doesn't with the internet) it will be known it's great. Labels will immediately jump at the chance to sign them and milk the big bucks out of them. So there's a reason for e.g. there are tons of well known Swedish bands and very few Italian ones. It's because Sweden is good, and Italy isn't. Not because Sweden just happens to have some sort of limelight over it and poor Italy has no exposure. Metal is not immune to the natural rules of the free market: if you're good, we'll know.

And is it really a satisfying argument to say those Asian countries just don't have enough good labels and studios around ? Sepultura went to Florida to record those early albums, and Brazil is third world but still produces quality metal bands.

You're comparing today's music industry to the 80's and 90's, which is dumb. Being a great metal band these days doesn't come with the same opportunities as it used to. Also everybody should stop taking your gay ass topics and comments seriously, you're a troll or some kind of worthless dumb ass.

 

[no country for old wainds]

I don't buy the argument that there are great but unknown metal bands. If a band is great (provided it has the outlet, obviously, but who doesn't with the internet) it will be known it's great. Labels will immediately jump at the chance to sign them and milk the big bucks out of them. So there's a reason for e.g. there are tons of well known Swedish bands and very few Italian ones. It's because Sweden is good, and Italy isn't. Not because Sweden just happens to have some sort of limelight over it and poor Italy has no exposure. Metal is not immune to the natural rules of the free market: if you're good, we'll know.

lol

 

[HamburgerBoy]

By the time FTB were "heavy" Black Sabbath were already working on their 4th album in late '71. They literally formed because Yuya saw Hendrix live and went back to Japan to form a cover band, which lasted for like 2 albums until Satori. Other heavy proto-metal/heavy psych bands from Japan like Blues Creation were at their heaviest in the early days when covering western bands.

I think another big part of why Asia's metal scene developed way slower than the UK/US is due to almost no cultural interaction with blues music, until it had become popularized enough not to be ignored. Much of the heavy metal that developed in the UK comes directly from adapting US blues music. So essentially the Japanese had to wait until the UK developed this American creation into something heavy, and then they hitched their wagon.

FTB's 70's music might have been heavier than western 60's music, but that's just a redundant point because they only got to that level by aping heavy western music from the 60's in the first place.

Obviously Sabbath was far ahead of the curve, but they were ahead of basically every band in every metallic aspect aside from Deep Purple, who had the edge speed-wise and shred-wise.

Sir Lord Baltimore, Bang, Mountain, Dust, Grand Funk (1969!) - just a few bands that come to mind from the US that had already trailblazed American proto-metal by the time the first truly heavy (without relying on tons of western cover songs) Japanese albums came out like Satori, Shinki Chen & His Friends and Demon & Eleven Children in '71.

I'll have to relisten to some of those albums; I don't remember the Dust S/T being leagues ahead of FTB for example, and that one was released in 1971 as well. But 1971 is still hardly late to the game in any case is all I'm saying.

 

[CiG]

Dust's debut is honestly standard fare boogie/blues-fueled hard rock, but the drumming has a very metallic and crushing feeling to it which makes it feel heavier to me than maybe it actually is. I'm not saying those albums are way heavier than Satori, just that Japan was definitely lagging behind the US in the early 70's, because the US already had proto-metal/heavy psych bands doing original material in the late 60's and Japan didn't, they were all cover bands.