Discussing leaks

[in_my_time_of_disease]

S'ok.

Btw--I love your sig. I just watched season four yesterday.

"Say...how's your vagina?"

lol wandering bear. I asked my friend the other day, he doesn't know curb, how his gfs vagina was? He almost attacked me haha, then I explained and gave him season 1 to educate him. I finally got round to getting season 7, so good. I hope he keeps going. Rumours are he is, but to hear it as a fact would be great.

 

[nox-Hand]

Just a question... just HOW do these albums get leaked?

Does some guy bribe a guy that mixes the album or something?

There are also the plants at which the albums are mass produced, the copies to reviewers, etc. There are enough copies floating around, and it's easy for someone with a copy to leak it onto the net. Same thing happens with movies, the preview copies for reviewers always sneak online sometimes over a month before it's release in cinemas

 

[wadler]

I understand what you're saying but I don't think it's quite as bad as shiting on someone's dining room table, at least people are so interested in the music that they can't wait to hear it.

rofl and you still manage to miss the fucking point.

 

[Korlich]

I will admit to haven DL illegally, however when the quality is top notch, I usually buy the stuff asap like with Opeth, PT, Comus etc. Another thing is all the obscure prog bands from the 60´s and 70´s who released a ltd number of LP´s back then, how on earth should i have known about them had it not been through illegal DL?
The final point is lame albeit true, as a student on a ltd. budget I simply cant afford to buy anywhere near all the music I want to at this point in time.

 

[nox-Hand]

The final point is lame albeit true, as a student on a ltd. budget I simply cant afford to buy anywhere near all the music I want to at this point in time.

I could vote myself guilty here. I got a few Opeth albums from the web before buying them. I personally don't mind listening to the song, deleting it if you don't like it, or BUYING it if you do. That's what I've done, yet I now own all Opeth's catelogue. However, supporting leaked downloads FTL. There's a difference between sampling to then buy, rather than "peeking at the christmas present before time" (an odd analogy).

Ah well, I own it all now

 

[Weakness]

I'm down with Opeth!

 

[soundave]

The final point is lame albeit true, as a student on a ltd. budget I simply cant afford to buy anywhere near all the music I want to at this point in time.

Very lame. I can't afford lots of stuff I want. Doesn't then make it okay for me to steal it.

 

[BefriendedUnit]

Korlich & Dave, that problem ventures outside of the realm of discussing leaks on the official forum. That goes into the illegal-downloads in general. But Dave, don't call it stealing. When you steal a car, the owner loses it. When you SHARE a file, it is duplicated, and buying it later makes no financial difference to the seller. If you bought the car after stealing it, the guy still would have lost his car for a while.

 

[Jackehh]

I think you need to make a distinction between downloading and LEAKING

Discussing an album that isnt even released yet is a slap in the fact towards the band, even more so on their own forum.

If I ever met mikael (I live close to stockholm, so it's not impossible) I would thank him with all my heart for making such great music. When I listen to opeth I experience something which I can only experience with great classical composers, mozart beethoven etc (the list is long): The essence of pure, well-made music! I think we all owe mike and the band that we dont discuss LEAKS on their own forum heh.

Even though I did download the album, I admit that. I will not reveal anything about it apart from the information I share with my friends, encouraging them to buy the record. I would surely pay double the price for it myself but I am, after all, a fanboi.

Remember that leaks and downloads are two seperate things, heh.

 

[BefriendedUnit]

If that's aimed at me, you wasted your time. I already agreed with you 100%.

 

[Frosties]

Very lame. I can't afford lots of stuff I want. Doesn't then make it okay for me to steal it.

+ 1000000000

I almost kissed the screen when I read this post!

The same goes if you can't wait for the album. Too fucking bad. Grow up.

 

[TheCrackedJack]

I'm not saying it's morally sound, but I don't agree with the equation of downloading necessarily equals stealing. It's something else.

Stealing implies taking something and that something no longer being there. If I walk into a store, and they have 20 CDs, and I steal 1. Now, there's 19 CDs left. If I download something off the internet, nothing is missing. That copy of the CD is still there, untouched.

A better analogy would be going into a store with a ray gun that copies whatever it touches. Could I now copy a pair of jeans and go on my way? I'm not taking anything from the store, but then I'm not giving anything to those who made the jeans. It's a grey area. Is it right? I'm not saying it is, so I better not get flamed. I'm just saying it's not as cut and dry and it's certainly not the same as walking into a store and taking a CD. It's not even close.

 

[Korlich]

Indeed it is a grey area. it used to be illegal to copy casettes, then came cds, and copying casettes became legal, but digital copying became illegal. The rules of the game are constanly changing.

 

[fränzi]

I'm not saying it's morally sound, but I don't agree with the equation of downloading necessarily equals stealing. It's something else.

Stealing implies taking something and that something no longer being there. If I walk into a store, and they have 20 CDs, and I steal 1. Now, there's 19 CDs left. If I download something off the internet, nothing is missing. That copy of the CD is still there, untouched.

A better analogy would be going into a store with a ray gun that copies whatever it touches. Could I now copy a pair of jeans and go on my way? I'm not taking anything from the store, but then I'm not giving anything to those who made the jeans. It's a grey area. Is it right? I'm not saying it is, so I better not get flamed. I'm just saying it's not as cut and dry and it's certainly not the same as walking into a store and taking a CD. It's not even close.

Well actually it is pretty close. In fact, I'd say it's not really any different, save only for the medium by which you acquire the product. It just so happens, that with digital format, items can be reduplicated. Makes no difference to whether or not it's morally correct, nor really to the situation in general, because you're still depriving someone of a potential sale. If someone is selling an album online and you download it for free, then go off on your merry way, well, sure the original copy is still there, but the seller gets no money for the copy you now have. Hence, stealing. I know you acknowledged that in the last paragraph, but really, I don't see it as a grey area at all.

 

[Slayer101]

rofl and you still manage to miss the fucking point.

Nah, bro, I'm pretty sure I got the fucking point, it's very rude to talk about a bands leak on their own forum, maybe if you'd have read some of my earlier posts you'd understand that.

 

[Death_To_False_Metal]

How about the average young western citizen is a lazy dork who doesn't know he has won the lottery of life ( there are 800 millions-1 billion people living with great comfort out of more than 6 billion) thinks that because he breathes air, he is entitled to listen to every album, watch any movie or tv series he likes and will try to convice anybody with the most unforgivable rethorics that downloading copyrighted material illegaly isn't such a big deal because every body ( e.g western spoiled young citizen) does it.

Meanwhile, the independant music store as a whole is dead and Virgin is reducing its space dedicated to selling cds by the minute.

The Interwebz has already won.

But has the music too ?

I am not sure ...

The hypocrisy on band forums is pathetic, you cannot talk about leaks on a band's forum but you can do it with evey other band ?

Opeth Leak ? Bad

Ihsahn Leak ? Good

Give me a fucking break !

 

[Frosties]

It's not grey at all. If people were complaining about the cd stores losing money, then these anallogies may be true - but you're talking about the artist. If you download, you are taking their product (in whatever form whatever way) and you are not paying for it. How is that grey??????

 

[Fluxcored]

I've often wondered whether people who use the internet are more likely to be douchebags, or if trolling the internet turns people into such cunts. It's an interesting question as we move forward and the percentage of people tooling around on their computer all day increases.

It's sad to watch as the internet culture moves toward this shared conscience that anything digital should be totally open and free. There are certainly merits to the widespread sharing that goes on, people have mentioned those already. Unfortunately, I feel like everything gets cheapened in the process.

Nevertheless artists and labels have to adapt. I'd say as soon as the album is mastered, fuck it get it on any and all digital download stores immediately. That being said, cram the physcial release with shit that cant be duplicated to give incentive to people who are willing to pay. I think this could help sales a lot, even if the unit price goes up. I'd pay top dollar for artist signed digibooks. While you're at it, release the discs in album sized books. I would have paid 4x for the SL digibook if it came in an LP sized book like Jethro Tull's Living in the Past record. I'd have that book on my coffee table permanently. Travis' art at that size...

Other things that might be more realistic to include exclusive to the physical release could be promotions like discounts on Opeth merchendise, links to demos or other studio outtakes/home videos. All of this could be kept exclusive with some kind of license key like video games have. One unique key per unit. Key's get shared, the key generators get cracked.. yeah eventually, perhaps. Judging from the anti-piracy posts in this forum I'd guess most of us who'd pay for these extras would be less likely to share then to just give you knob-slobbing pirates the one finger salute.

 

[Fluxcored]

How about the average young western citizen is a lazy dork who doesn't know he has won the lottery of life ( there are 800 millions-1 billion people living with great comfort out of more than 6 billion) thinks that because he breathes air, he is entitled to listen to every album, watch any movie or tv series he likes and will try to convice anybody with the most unforgivable rethorics that downloading copyrighted material illegaly isn't such a big deal because every body ( e.g western spoiled young citizen) does it.

Meanwhile, the independant music store as a whole is dead and Virgin is reducing its space dedicated to selling cds by the minute.

The Interwebz has already won.

But has the music too ?

I am not sure ...

Give me a fucking break !

notworthy

 

[TheCrackedJack]

It's not grey at all. If people were complaining about the cd stores losing money, then these anallogies may be true - but you're talking about the artist. If you download, you are taking their product (in whatever form whatever way) and you are not paying for it. How is that grey??????

But your not taking it. The word take implies that the person no longer has what has been taken, so that word really isn't applicable.

If I DVR, which is what the product is for, the complete 3rd season of Lost on ABC when it airs, am I stealing? I no longer have to buy the DVD's and I'm not paying for those episodes. Same basic premise, same grey area.

Again, I'm not saying it's not wrong. I'm saying it's not the same as taking someone's car, stealing someone's CD player, ect. Yes, the person that made the item isn't getting compensated for it. However, your still not taking it. Hence, grey area.