NineFeetUnderground said:
There's a BIG difference between a grocery store that loses money because something is gone that otherwise would have been bought by someone, and a this case: someone copies a cd that he wouldn't have bought anyway.
Do you all buy Opeth cd's?
- Thread starter atilla000
- Start date
There's a BIG difference between a grocery store that loses money because something is gone that otherwise would have been bought by someone, and a this case: someone copies a cd that he wouldn't have bought anyway.
NFU
I like pie.
atilla000 said:
no, thats not the case. its still stealing property you dont have a right to own. Simply because someone wont lose revenue right off the floor like a grocery store, doesnt mean that music deserves to be yours without buying.
Its not the band or record companies fault that theres now a medium for their music to be pirated...but just because there is...doesnt make it ok for you to do so.
more or less, stealing music hurts the artist. they make music to sell so they can make a living and continue recording new music, in basic terms.
a grocery market would go out of business if everyone started stealing from it and then no one would have food. music wise too if the trend of ripping it off got out of hand in the future, this is the problem.
a grocery market would go out of business if everyone started stealing from it and then no one would have food. music wise too if the trend of ripping it off got out of hand in the future, this is the problem.
Kenneth R.
Cináed
i'd like to see the reaction to the creation of the CD, and before it, the Tape.
those were mediums that allowed "sharing" easier too. this is certainly not a new phenomenon and not contained to mp3s and the internet.
those were mediums that allowed "sharing" easier too. this is certainly not a new phenomenon and not contained to mp3s and the internet.
Kenneth R.
Cináed
here's my argument to that, theoretically.Dark Thane said:
if people boycotted by selectively buying what they consider quality material and selectively downloading what they consider lower quality material (ie, not worth your $10 but worth 10 minutes if its free), then the level of quality would be induced to rise out of fear of being ripped off, or by the numbers in sales of well-thought-out albums vs those that were just made for a quick profit. i think this trend might be beginning now, and it has a partial stake in the death of teen-pop music and the return of rock/alternative/rap to the mainstream "pop" scene.
NFU
I like pie.
atilla000 said:
i got your point too. but i dont understand how you feel stealing music doesnt hurt the artist?
Eemu
Member
- Feb 14, 2004
- 60
- 0
- 6
I currently have 2031 mp3's on my computer, of which 80% I own on original cd, 10% are my own sucky daily recordings I still haven't deleted, 5% free samples from artists' web sites and 5% 'illegal' samples my friends send to get me hooked on their favourite bands (mostly unsuccesfully 
)
I agree with NFU and dorian, downloading music isn't justified by weak economy. Many people claim to do it because of "sampling", but that's a lousy excuse aswell, since this filters 99% of the cd's this person would otherwise buy, 99% at the expense of the musicians. And as some have pointed out, illegal dloading isn't the only way of sampling. At least all my local record stores offer an oportunity to listen to any cd they have in stock before purchasing.
)I agree with NFU and dorian, downloading music isn't justified by weak economy. Many people claim to do it because of "sampling", but that's a lousy excuse aswell, since this filters 99% of the cd's this person would otherwise buy, 99% at the expense of the musicians. And as some have pointed out, illegal dloading isn't the only way of sampling. At least all my local record stores offer an oportunity to listen to any cd they have in stock before purchasing.
Silent Song said:
Good point, never thought of it like that.
sharing is most likely a minor loss to the industry overall, im just defending the sheer respect of bands that work hard to get where they are, and then have their music stolen from some bum who can't spend a few bucks to pick up an album and support, you know.
Hehe, you've been creative with my words. I said that it's not stealing if it doesn't hurt the artist.NineFeetUnderground said:
Face this:
Anal Cunt sucks. I wouldn't ever in my life buy a cd from that "group". But I have some mp3's of them on my pc, just for fun (not fun enough to buy it although). Did Anal Cunt lose some income now?
NFU
I like pie.
atilla000 said:
thats really not the point. youre creating your own rules.
speeding is still against the law even if you didnt hurt anyone else.
doing drugs is still illegal even if you dont get caught.
jaywalking is still illegal, even if you didnt get hit by a car. etc etc
its a matter of morality and your ethics rather than a matter of defenition i think.
NFU
I like pie.
not to mention...youve taken it upon yourself to decide if youve hurt the artist or not. i would disagree. i think any pirating hurts the artist on some level. because its becoming a rampant problem...its not like youre the only one pirating music.
It's a matter of morality, I totally agree.NineFeetUnderground said:
So let's forget about illegal or not illegal
No really, this is my situation: almost all my friends copy all (yes all) their music, and they think I'm crazy because I buy things I can get for free. I try to give them a lesson in my (not holy enough...) morale, but it's really hopeless.
There's a really interesting difference between our opinions. But I'd like to continue the discussion it in a pub
Btw: I'm convinced that I should buy more cd's. But NOT anal cunt!
mot-
Look behind you!
NineFeetUnderground said:
I'm really eager to hear the first "cool guy" pull out a certain Crowley quote on this.
Kenneth R.
Cináed
and i wholeheartedly agree. i respect bands who put time and effort into their work, and encourage people to buy music they are impressed with.Dark Thane said:
as for NFU's "illegal" comment, let me just say that i NEVER will decide my choices based on the legality of options. i would favor moral decisions and justice as i understand it, and to me this is independent of legality. there have been and still are many, many unjust and immoral laws. just because something is legal doesn't make it right, and just because something is illegal does not make it wrong. those who make laws are not immune to bias and prejudices. they are not always able to seek and enforce the "moral" right, or quite simply their view of morality differs from another person's. to agree/disagree with an action or idea solely on its legality is in my opinion, a foolhardy gesture.
Lord_AgathoN
LIKE FIRE....
Its really disgusting to see you deranged comments about that topic NFU. You are telling me you dont own anything illegal? No programm.........no game.........not a single mp3........not a copied tape......not one divX movie - you are the greatest lyer i have ever seen. Its simple as that........you CANT buy all the music you are interested in, well even all the good shit out there. I would own like 4000 cds a minimum if i would do.........and you would too...but you arent -> So should the fuck up, false prayer. It was always like that (your damn parents copied tapes.......or recorded stuff from the radio and played it <- thats also stealing)........and it always will be like that. Its just "normal".......and a good artist, that puts his hard work in his release (and not just the 1000x reissue or best of) will be appreciated and can damn trust the people that they will buy his cds, cause they can see his true work and not just the money-making with something thats not worth spending cash on it. Just like that.......but the point is, there are so many bands out there, that release something thats just poor or lacking of work that was put in it.
I bought more cds than anybody around me.........and i will. But i wont quit with downloading before i buy to see if its worth it. And i wont see it as stealing.
I bought more cds than anybody around me.........and i will. But i wont quit with downloading before i buy to see if its worth it. And i wont see it as stealing.
NFU
I like pie.
Lord_AgathoN said:
you need to pay better attention. first of all, i dont own any illegal things. i own my permanent media...my mp3s are only of albums i own, that i rip onto the computer. just because you have neglegence and take no responsibility for your illegal activity, doesnt mean that im just like you. And second of all, i never said i dont download MP3s..i often download Mp3s that are available to preview a band in order to buy it. but ive NEVER downloaded music and kept it with no intention to buy. legal previewing and listening (which were the MP3 market's original intention), and downloading for the sake of owning without any fiscal responsibility are 2 completely different things.
i dont appreciate your accusations and belligerent name calling at me, simply because you disagree with my opinion on this...i dont know who you think you are. i too would own thousands and thousands of cds if i was able to buy everything i wanted to. But because you cant afford it doesnt mean its your right to steal them instead...how dimented do you have to be to argue that?!
and my final note, is that im saying downloading available material as a form of trial before you buy the album i find to be alright...as i do it too. but to call yourself a fan of a band, and then to just download their music with no intention of paying for it ever...i find terribly wrong and immoral.
cthulufhtagn
Went Out for Smokes 13 Years Ago
Silent Song said:
damn right. in some countries it is actually illegal to kiss in public. end of fucking discussion.
@nfu: if i may play devil's advocate here, does any art truly belong to the artist? of course artists deserve our support, and i always prefer to buy cds whenever possible--i often dl a few songs and if i like them i go get the cd. but if i download a few songs by an artist and decide i don't like them and delete the files, is it any different than if i go to a friend's house and they show me an album and i don't like it? should i have sent the band some money for having listened to their album?
@dorian: uh....well i don't really mean to offend you, but i can't imagine not having heard about p2p/file sharing before....i mean....dude, napster? remember napster? lars ulrich? people hating metallica for non-musical reasons?
I have all their original CDs, the DVD plus a couple bootleg DVDs. A couple of their CDs have a somewhat permanent place in my cars CD changer. For some reason I can't seem to remove them.
NFU
I like pie.
cthulufhtagn said:
obviously kissing in public being illegal is something that is unjust and undignified by any stretch of the imagination and what i would call logical for humanity.
but dont get me wrong, once again...i support downloading of some mp3s for previewing sake...this was MP3s original intention when it comes to the record industry. i just dont support downloading when people have no intention of buying ever, or supporting their bands.
