Yetti
Active Member
R2R is ok. i think they couldve done better job though. but some of the songs off R2R sound pretty good live.
Does "anyone" like Reroute?
- Thread starter Inflames626
- Start date
mousewings
Member
- Nov 21, 2001
- 3,626
- 84
- 48
Exactly my thought.Arch said:Wow, Inflames626 has some serious ADD. Can't seem to stay within a topic.
The video was not taken from anywhere, it was completely made by Achilleas Gatsopoulos (iirc). The fact that it was made in that specific style, because its maker visioned it like that, doesn't mean he was copying anything. If that was the case, then every impressionist painter, for example, would have been a copycat of the beginner of the school. This is something you have to learn (and it goes for Niklas' artwork too):Inflames626 said:
Having similarities, or looking alike, or reminding something else, doesn't mean being the same.
Now keep this in mind and go listen to the whole Mind's I again. Thank you.
stefan86
invariably off-topic
Arch said:
Now for some point by point smashing of detractors who seem to take criticism of DT personally.
I don't think I know everything in the world, but I'm quite confident in my opinions.
Your artwork first please. Show me something different. Jackson Pollack and such is considered the "newest" phase in modern art, at least according to the National Gallery in D.C. It's pretty pathetic that Andrew Warhol could line up Cambell's Soup cans and alter the colors and be hailed as a genuis. I'm just kind of tired of the Tool-ish, nonobjective, "mystery" artwork. For our record, I've used some ultra-realistic Baroque artwork because it fits the feel of the record, Van Eyck, Rubens, Goya, Rembrandt. It's not a new kind of art because I chose it because it looks great and has a dark feel. I'm merely complaining because everything has a been there, done that feel, including my own stuff. People are running out of ideas, and as the pendulum of art swings back and forth between realistic and abstract again and again, Romanticism, Roccoco, non-objective and modern art are really just variations on the same thing of real vs. abstract. Eventually, everyone will do what Matisse did a hundred years ago and be a genius because he's bringing something back into style. It's sad that modern culture can be so stagnant when our communication technology is so instantaneous.
Secondly, as I've criticized various things, I've never told anyone to "get their head out of their ass"...some people are purely confrontational.
Show me how we're not repeating ourselves over and over through the centuries in both music and art, friend, and I will give you credit. Unfortunately, I've seen little that's been done over the past 50 years at least. Maybe Grant Wood and Norman Rockwell's kind of "American Expressionism", and the Bauhaus certainly. But for all everyone talks about this being the newest and bravest time in art, I'm seeing very little originality.
I love art, but I like ultra-realistic, Rubens, neo-classicist style things. That and I can't draw for shit, but I basically see art as a craft, and the closer you can replicate reality, the more difficult it is and hence the more skill required. I don't care if you took a piece of shit and smeared it on the canvas and said it represented the state of war and poverty in human affairs, you're essentially taking a low-brow thing and trying to make it high-brow with a lot of generalities.
You try playing over 14 chord changes in every style and mode (while you're at it, play some fusion and Django Reinhardt or something), and get back to me. Personally, I feel that only fans who are musicians are fully competent enough to criticize and, while I'm no Van Halen, I can definitely say a lot of songs on Mind's I minus some strong ones (like "Tongues") sound similar and maybe should have been off the record.
I don't know everything, but I believe strongly in what I think.
Siren said:Exactly my thought.
The video was not taken from anywhere, it was completely made by Achilleas Gatsopoulos (iirc). The fact that it was made in that specific style, because its maker visioned it like that, doesn't mean he was copying anything. If that was the case, then every impressionist painter, for example, would have been a copycat of the beginner of the school. This is something you have to learn (and it goes for Niklas' artwork too):
Having similarities, or looking alike, or reminding something else, doesn't mean being the same.
Now keep this in mind and go listen to the whole Mind's I again. Thank you.
At one point in 2001 I had Mind's I in my car and listened to it over and over, the special edition that included Razorfever, etc. Archetype was unnecessary and, like KMFDM, went on too long. I'm a firm believer that Dissolution Factor Red, Atom Heart 243.5, and Tidal Tantrums should not have been on the record and personally prefer fewer, stronger tracks to having 12 to 14 and only listening to half of them. I kind of knew it was going to be bad on R2R when they had 14 songs and the byline "14 Songs of Conscious Insanity". I knew they would be shorter, more similar sounding, and forgetful. As far as DT, they are getting better and better, but I honestly felt that everything I bought after Projector up until Damage was not as good.
When I said taken, also, I did not mean literally, but it reminded me of the scene early in Caligari where the hero explains to the old man in the forest what he and his girlfriend went through, etc., following the murders of various people by the sleepwalker Cesare. Also, whether or not someone copies or not, I do think the video was influenced by such earlier work. I wasn't bashing it for being influenced by it, but as similar as it seems to it, I felt there was a strong connection.
Also, to people who are not involved in a craft, everything does seem similar to the founder of the school. To someone interested in country, DT sounds a lot like Kreator or Death or any other death metal band. Only when one becomes intensely interested in something do the details come through. I just don't understand why everyone is defensive about it. If I say the video looks like Caligari, everyone says it isn't. If I compare DT to In Flames, everyone says they aren't. Almost like they're trying to validate Niklas and Co.'s existence. Let them do that, and be their own originality. Everyone here seems to be eager to prove that DT is doing something new and different, but I just don't think that's true. But I like the music all the same.
Maybe I'm cynical, but everything's just a bit boring. Not that I could do better, all I do is yet another Maiden variation. But who knows, if I dig for musical gold, I might find it.
Inflames626 said:
I don't openly criticize things I don't understand or like. Just because Puff Daddy's music isn't in tune with my musical taste doesn't mean "Puff Daddy's doesn't uses such-and-such music structure, chords, scale, wankery skills, and whatever I can spout out of my mouth." I wouldn't consider Andy Warhol's artwork "pathetic"; perhaps twenty years from now, I might think his Campbell Soup cans is brilliant.
Boo-fucking-hoo, you're tired of the same old things you see. Somehow, we humans don't live up to your standards. Why don't you impress me by pointing a loaded gun to your head and pulling the fucking trigger; that will be the most beautiful art ever.
Salamurhaaja said:
I have tastes enough to not consider criticisms of bands I like as personal attacks, and I also have enough creativity to put more than 2 riffs per song to a drum machine.
Industrial music is about being rhythmic. I think it gets old after a while. People don't incorporate enough different tastes into the same record anymore. Why can't we have a Metallica song, a Crowbar style song, a COC/Down kind of song, a Dream Theater kind of song, etc. It's hectic on creating a general album "feel", yes, but I'll be damned if I'm going to write 12 something songs only to have 2 get video/radio play.
If you can't make each song strong, then make it a 30 minute, quick and dirty, "Reign In Blood" kind of job.
Arch said:
Why don't you impress me by getting over what someone posts on a message board?
Or are we another I hate God, gothy boy who thinks he's Trent Reznor junior and knows everything?
I sir, may spout a lot, but there's substance. I've yet to see anything from you but being angry over my opinions.
Oh, and, because I don't enjoy something, I automatically don't understand it? Dislike comes from experiencing, and saying, you know, this doesn't interest me, or, conversely, that's a nice idea, but here's how I'd do it differently.
Do calm down sir. You take this messageboard far too seriously.
Again, listen to some Gypsy music. It's depressingly technical.
And relax dude, you're here to post opinions, not to tell me to kill myself because you can't argue with me over a random fuck you thrown my way.
mousewings said:Since we're off-topic: I think everyone should see this movie. I've seen it several times (I have the DVD) and it's amazing.
Inflames626 is quite amusing in ways. He/she should listen to some David Gray, Down, Wide Mouth Mason, and Darkthrone too. To have more diverse musical taste. Stop listening to COF and new Slothtallica!
BTW: I used to like Slayer's music but don't anymore.
Mouse, what else are you into? I listen to a wide variety of metal at least, even have a Phil Collins CD, but I love my Metallica, I love my COC, and I love my classics.
I personally don't like COF, as I've listened, and the whole shock rock thing is kind of pathetic. Marylin Manson will look so "Kiss" in 20 years.
Lastly, regarding Puff Daddy, etc., one, rap's never been about the music, but the lyrical content. Nobody ever says "Shit man, did you listen to that melody in that Snoop Dog tune?" What gives me a right to criticize? Why, being able to make decisions about what to do with my time and money.
If I bother you sir, don't reply to my thread
And the very reason why I change topics and stay in this thread is to keep from pissing off everyone at once. If people like my ideas, they can come and contribute, if not, they don't have to.
Inflames626 said:
I am calm... and you think you know me?
"Waaah waaah waaaah, [name dropping this, name dropping that], is so stupid, blah blah blah, it isn't technical enough for me. It doesn't use the Dmaj13th-Phrygian/Doric la-di-da eat-your-heart-out Kirk Hammet piece I was looking for." Your childish rants will come with consequences. And you sir, need to grow the fuck up. Somehow, your view of art and music seems to serve you and only you.I
Inflames626 said:...
Lastly, regarding Puff Daddy, etc., one, rap's never been about the music, but the lyrical content. Nobody ever says "Shit man, did you listen to that melody in that Snoop Dog tune?" What gives me a right to criticize? Why, being able to make decisions about what to do with my time and money.
If I bother you sir, don't reply to my thread
And the very reason why I change topics and stay in this thread is to keep from pissing off everyone at once. If people like my ideas, they can come and contribute, if not, they don't have to.
Oh, so, if someone AGREES with YOU, one should reply your YOUR thread.
This is a "public" place to exchange and discuss ideas. Obviously, you haven't been here long enough. Did someone kicked you out of their forum?
Arch said:
Arch
Disagreeing with me and telling me to blow my brains out are two different things.
Are we resentful toward things we don't understand, hmm?
I can send you a theory book...it all starts with a major scale...
No, I originally just came to this forum to find out where "Lady In Black" came from, and liked posting my ideas.
I just don't like the personal tone you take when someone pisses you off.
Any kind of condescending attitude I have toward you stems from your tendency to make personal remarks out of impersonal opinions. I'm as dumb as shit in a car mechanics forum, trust me, so I don't go to those. I hardly know all.
It is public, but there's a respectful way to disagree, and a disrespectful one.
I also said if someone disagrees with my ideas, they don't HAVE to come. That means, if they disagree with my ideas, they still CAN come post. But it isn't necessary.
Besides, my thread here is only about one trillionth of the entire Internet. I'm hardly a menace.
Oh, and, btw, Kirk Hammett uses and abuses the minor Pentatonic scale nowadays more than he did any other scale, then natural minor. Those are respectively
1 b3 4 5 b7 8
and
1 2 b3 4 5 b6 b7 8
Hardly technical.
Phrygian is 1 b2 b3 4 5 b6 b7 8
You wouldn't find Phrygian over Dmaj13 because the b3 in Phrygrian, as well as the b6, would clash with the natural 3 and natural 13 (or major 6) in Dmaj13. So, unless you're Korn, stay away from that. Phrygian is a minor scale (think Alex Skolnick) and Dmaj13 is a major, jazz chord.
Hmmm, how ironic. I CANNOT take you seriously with your opinions, but somehow, you took me WAAAAY to fucking seriously when I said to blow your brains out. A little double standard there, huh?Inflames626 said:
I'm just stooping to your level just to let you see what a dumbass you are with your opinions.
No need, I have books on music theory already.
Good for you.
Tough shit.
And you think it is oh-so-respectful to publicly slag on things you deem unworthy to your taste. I'm just giving you a taste of your medicine.
No shit Sherlock. People have their own volition to respond or not respond to your statements, no brainer there.
The more you talk, the more you make an ass of yourself.
wildfyr
unus spiritus est
wait, wait.. a RTR thread turning into a flamewar about something other than "OMFG NU METUL WTFLOL!!1!!11"
first time for everything I guess.
first time for everything I guess.
