Game of Thrones
- Thread starter Dak
- Start date
So...reactions to the first episode:
Good:
The bit where Ned is facing the camera after getting Lysa's letter with Luwin over one shoulder and Catelyn over the other was very well-done.
The wall looked fucking great.
I thought Viserys' character was actually more interesting here than in the books.
The wall looked just right, and the area beyond it was totally intimidating. Well done.
Including the scene in King's Landing between Jaime and Cersei was a good call. Demonstrates that time has passed, explaining why the wolves have grown. Book didn't do this, which was an unfortunate omission. King's Landing looked weird, though...
Bad:
The scene between Tyrion and Jon Snow was botched, especially when they lost half of the "all dwarves are bastards in their fathers' eyes, but not all bastards need be dwarves" bit. Also, there's an image in the book of Tyrion's shadow that's rather important and I can't comprehend why they didn't use it here.
They changed around the scene with Jaime throwing Bran off the tower. I liked the original version better because it made Jaime's action seem less premeditated, which imo helps make the character a little more sympathetic. Not a big deal.
I didn't like their take on the wedding scene at all. For one thing, it's really emphasized in the books that the Dothraki do everything on that big grass plain, so doing the whole thing on the cliffs by the sea is kinda weird. Especially the sex scene between Drogo and Daenerys. I felt that was bad in that it was completely rape whereas in the book it was consensual and was the start of a real relationship between the two, which later became important to Daenerys's character. They also failed to introduce the bloodriders and other elements of Dothraki culture that would have been easy to introduce then...considering they went to the trouble of inventing a whole language for the Dothraki, it's a weird oversight. Also, I didn't like the omission of the bells. Not a big deal, but I thought they were pretty cool.
Why is the only sex that happens doggystyle? It's just kinda weird, especially in the cases where the book pretty much specified it was otherwise.
The omission of Jon being at the feast wasn't a big deal, but it's unfortunate because that later became extremely important in his meeting with Mance, which resulted in one of my favorite exchanges in the series. That also would have been a good opportunity to give the actor who will play Mance a little cameo to set that up, although of course they wouldn't really have that lined up yet since they probably don't even know if they'll get a whole first season, never mind a second.
I think Theon was there, but they never used his name. Him kicking the head in the execution scene is an important introduction to his character, and I feel it's an unfortunate omission. Also not a big deal, but given that he is an important character it's weird to deliberately not involve him.
The bit where Arya gets a bullseye, while a good introduction to her tomboyness, is stupid.
I'm assuming Jory is the guy with the sideburns...that just looks goofy.
Drogo looked way too much like Satan, especially with the eyeshadow in the wedding scene. I suspect they're setting him up as a wholly unsympathetic character, which I don't particularly like but isn't really a big deal. That said, they're trying too hard.
Also, the Dothraki wedding scene overall. It was supposed to be a party for the whole khalasar or however that's spelled. Instead it's like 50 people. Also, the dancing was stupid. And who gives someone snakes?
Overall:
Very good casting. Acting is good. Production values are good. Script is good. In general, not quite as good as it could have been, but way better than I feared and also better than I expected.
Good:
The bit where Ned is facing the camera after getting Lysa's letter with Luwin over one shoulder and Catelyn over the other was very well-done.
The wall looked fucking great.
I thought Viserys' character was actually more interesting here than in the books.
The wall looked just right, and the area beyond it was totally intimidating. Well done.
Including the scene in King's Landing between Jaime and Cersei was a good call. Demonstrates that time has passed, explaining why the wolves have grown. Book didn't do this, which was an unfortunate omission. King's Landing looked weird, though...
Bad:
The scene between Tyrion and Jon Snow was botched, especially when they lost half of the "all dwarves are bastards in their fathers' eyes, but not all bastards need be dwarves" bit. Also, there's an image in the book of Tyrion's shadow that's rather important and I can't comprehend why they didn't use it here.
They changed around the scene with Jaime throwing Bran off the tower. I liked the original version better because it made Jaime's action seem less premeditated, which imo helps make the character a little more sympathetic. Not a big deal.
I didn't like their take on the wedding scene at all. For one thing, it's really emphasized in the books that the Dothraki do everything on that big grass plain, so doing the whole thing on the cliffs by the sea is kinda weird. Especially the sex scene between Drogo and Daenerys. I felt that was bad in that it was completely rape whereas in the book it was consensual and was the start of a real relationship between the two, which later became important to Daenerys's character. They also failed to introduce the bloodriders and other elements of Dothraki culture that would have been easy to introduce then...considering they went to the trouble of inventing a whole language for the Dothraki, it's a weird oversight. Also, I didn't like the omission of the bells. Not a big deal, but I thought they were pretty cool.
Why is the only sex that happens doggystyle? It's just kinda weird, especially in the cases where the book pretty much specified it was otherwise.
The omission of Jon being at the feast wasn't a big deal, but it's unfortunate because that later became extremely important in his meeting with Mance, which resulted in one of my favorite exchanges in the series. That also would have been a good opportunity to give the actor who will play Mance a little cameo to set that up, although of course they wouldn't really have that lined up yet since they probably don't even know if they'll get a whole first season, never mind a second.
I think Theon was there, but they never used his name. Him kicking the head in the execution scene is an important introduction to his character, and I feel it's an unfortunate omission. Also not a big deal, but given that he is an important character it's weird to deliberately not involve him.
The bit where Arya gets a bullseye, while a good introduction to her tomboyness, is stupid.
I'm assuming Jory is the guy with the sideburns...that just looks goofy.
Drogo looked way too much like Satan, especially with the eyeshadow in the wedding scene. I suspect they're setting him up as a wholly unsympathetic character, which I don't particularly like but isn't really a big deal. That said, they're trying too hard.
Also, the Dothraki wedding scene overall. It was supposed to be a party for the whole khalasar or however that's spelled. Instead it's like 50 people. Also, the dancing was stupid. And who gives someone snakes?
Overall:
Very good casting. Acting is good. Production values are good. Script is good. In general, not quite as good as it could have been, but way better than I feared and also better than I expected.
Krigloch the Furious
Pants full of poo
Although your criticisms are valid in many regards, it was just a pilot. They had already crammed as much as they could into the damn thing.
I wholeheartedly agree with the Khal/consensual scene (I mean hell, they straight up turned it into him raping her), but my hopes were redeemed a bit because if you click on the Jason/Khan bio on HBO's website, the opening scene they have is him and Dany lying post-sex and actually enjoying and smiling with each other - if that is any proof of where their relationship is heading, then I'll be happy. I think they just set up the wedding in that regard to show how alien the culture was to Danny; soon enough the iconic savagery will be gone, and it will obviously point towards Viserys being shown as the real savage (then he'll get his crown). That being said though, I was really hoping they would elaborate on Viserys' anger problem. Granted, he does mention "waking the dragon", but unless you read the books you aren't particularly sure what that means. Hopefully they show that.
Also, doggystyle owns. I will laugh if they have lesbian scenes doggystyle somehow
I actually thought the Tower/Jaime/Bran scene was pretty good. Jaime is set up right now as the suave, charismatic/super confidant knight, where woman melt just by his charm alone. His actual disregard and lack of forethought with that scene where he shoves him (yeah, different from the book from just letting Bran go) really worked. That's my opinion though.
I think by far my favorite scene was in the crypt, where Robert shows his feelings for Lyanna. God damn that was just a well executed scene in every regard.
Einherjar86
Active Member
It definitely crammed a lot into a short space, but what choice did they have? I personally felt like it was rushed, but as Pessimism said; it's the pilot, and I feel like the subsequent episodes will slow down a bit and spend more time on the separate plots (which were all just kind of hurled at the audience in the pilot).
Other things:
I thought the scene between Jon and Tyrion was good, but Dinklage stole the show with it. The actor playing Jon unfortunately can't keep up with that acting.
In the sex scene between Drogo and Dany; I thought the first time they do it she's scared shitless? I don't remember it being "consentual." I mean, in the pilot it's not as though she was completely resistant; she submitted in the end. That's how I remember it in the book, but I could be recalling it wrong.
Crypt scene was indeed awesome, although I wish Bean hadn't acted so surprised when Robert asked him to be the hand. Come on, he had to know it was coming a little bit. But overall yes, great scene; I love how Addy gave the line: "In my dreams, I kill him every night." Badass.
Other things:
I thought the scene between Jon and Tyrion was good, but Dinklage stole the show with it. The actor playing Jon unfortunately can't keep up with that acting.
In the sex scene between Drogo and Dany; I thought the first time they do it she's scared shitless? I don't remember it being "consentual." I mean, in the pilot it's not as though she was completely resistant; she submitted in the end. That's how I remember it in the book, but I could be recalling it wrong.
Crypt scene was indeed awesome, although I wish Bean hadn't acted so surprised when Robert asked him to be the hand. Come on, he had to know it was coming a little bit. But overall yes, great scene; I love how Addy gave the line: "In my dreams, I kill him every night." Badass.
I dunno...the Viserys on the show is different from in the books. He's a bit more restrained with his anger, though the edge is obviously still there, but they also subtly show his ineptitude, like when he runs up to ask Illyrio about what Drogo leaving abruptly meant and his voice sorta cracks a bit. Usually when a show/movie changes something from the book it's a bad thing, or at best neutral, but I actually like this more. It makes the character a little more sympathetic, and ultimately tragic, which is pretty fitting.
Eddard knew it was coming, they discussed it in the godswood scene.
The scene between Drogo and Dany was consensual in the book. She was scared but then he comforted her and she stuck his hand up her cooch.
The omission of the scene of her riding her horse was an interesting choice. In the book it pretty much shows her taking control of her life a bit, so leaving it out is a good way to emphasize the overall shittiness of her situation.
Dinklage is great as Tyrion, and the scene in the courtyard was going quite well, which is why it bothers me so much...they had the chance to make it a really great scene, and instead they left it at "pretty good."
And yeah, they had to cram a lot in there. I felt they did a pretty good job at making things not seem rushed. Obviously no matter what they do I'm going to hate them a little bit, but they're doing a good job.
Einherjar86
Active Member
That's what I mean. He shouldn't have looked so surprised when Robert actually asked.
It occurs to me that they also omitted the scene where Rob and Joffrey duel. That scene establishes what a prick Joffrey is and introduces Sandor Clegane and Prince Tommen. A necessary omission for time reasons, obviously. I'm guessing they'll hold off establishing those characters until the scene with Sansa on the road.
Other than the nitpicking from WAIF (I do agree, like how hard would it have been to add the bells in the hair), my sole concern with the pilot is it appears to have been made with the assumption that all the viewers had already read the books and could fill in the large gaps left by cramming.
Einherjar86
Active Member
I just have to say, judging purely from the actors chosen to play Robb and Joffrey, Robb would totally wipe his ass with that little prick.
They got a great actor for Joffrey. He just makes you want to punch in him the face, and he hasn't even had any lines yet.
Oh I quite agree with you. He's a sham, and it's going to show itself more and more, and then hopefully they'll take advantage of the situation to highlight his anger complex. i mean hell, it's the perfect transition to his crowning. I cannot wait for this story arc.
God yes. God yes x 10000000.
Also, GoT has been picked up for a second season (the show stomped everything in regards to the international market, so hopefully it can ride that horse for a long time). I'm hoping the show goes as far as it can - hopefully they count DVD sales into the equation this time (which from what I remember they did not do for Rome). I had to torrent the first episode, just like I'm going to have to for the second (I don't own a tv, and am not paying for an online subscription to HBO for one show). I will definitely be buying the DVD though.
I dunno...I mean, they're pretty stingy with character names, but that could be because they're trying to make it seem natural. We'll have to see a few more episodes before we'll know.
Agreed on both counts. They aged Rob a good deal, but not Joffrey, apparently. Smug little shit.
Wow, that was quick. Sweet. I hear they're doing about 1 book a season, which means they have 5 seasons worth of stuff to go on now and presumably by that point the 6th book will be done. It's really a question of whether the 7th (supposedly the final) book will be done in 6 years from now (assuming the show makes it that long). Man, it'd be really fucking disappointing if they got like halfway through the series and got dropped...especially when horrible shows keep getting renewed every year.
My wife, who has not read the series, basically spent the whole episode asking who/what/when/where, since the show did a fairly poor job of explaining. Maybe they figured everyone went to the website first at least.
Dude, there's still two books left. Winds for Winter (whatever the hell it's called) and the the book title that has Spring in it.
And behold my new Gurm photoshop!
http://i.imgur.com/H8zJC.png
Not safe for work at all.
And behold my new Gurm photoshop!
http://i.imgur.com/H8zJC.png
Not safe for work at all.
I know. Books 5-7 haven't come out yet. Book 5 will be out shortly and presumably book 6 will be out well before the series catches up. But can Martin finish two books in 6 years? Most other writers could, but given his track record...
Dakryn: yeah, you're probably right. I've read the books like 3 times so I was just waiting for each successive thing to happen, but it would be pretty easy for people to get confused, I guess...that said, the books themselves are a bit confusing at first. There's a lot going on, and a lot to introduce. They may need a few episodes to really get going. I've heard it said you should give a show six episodes to catch on.
Dakryn: yeah, you're probably right. I've read the books like 3 times so I was just waiting for each successive thing to happen, but it would be pretty easy for people to get confused, I guess...that said, the books themselves are a bit confusing at first. There's a lot going on, and a lot to introduce. They may need a few episodes to really get going. I've heard it said you should give a show six episodes to catch on.
Valerie
¯\(ã)/¯
- Aug 29, 2005
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