Gaming Thread

[Det Som Engang Var]

ocarina of time + majoras mask = da shitz

Yep. They are pinnacles of gaming experiences.

 

[Talking Backwards]

As for Mass Effect 3, I won't post spoilers, but confirmed story line has leaked. It was horribly bad. I mean, BAD.

So Bioware basically has The Matrix trilogy on their hands? Although it kind of depends on what side of the fence you stand on concerning the first and second games. I personally felt the first game had a much better story, but the second had greatly improved gameplay and more interesting squad members.

Would they make changes based on people's reaction tothe leaked story? "We listen to our fans all of the time," Muzyka said. "We listen to them on the forums, their feedback from stories. We're reading it all. If we can get ideas out of it that will make the game better, sure. We're not averse to taking feedback. That's part of our core values, is humility. Any time we get a good idea from fans ... they're our audience. They keep us in business."

Muzyka said the writing team working on the game were saddened by the leak. "It was disappointing for them, yeah. They're moving on. They're making a great game. The script, frankly, has changed a little bit from what was released, too. It's been edited. They're always tuning it. They're always making it better. But yeah, it's tough when you see your work displayed. You realize only a small number of people are probably going to look at those spoilers in advance."

He urged fans not to read the story that's been leaked because discovering it organically is what makes the game. "What I would suggest to the fans is ... Don't spoil the story," he said. "The fun of the story is uncovering things and exploring and finding new points to adventure in. I hope they don't lose that joy of discovery.

 

[DarkGift]

Yep. They are pinnacles of gaming experiences.

pretty much, yes!

 

[Enemy242]

wow an entire storyline for a game leaked? thats fucking crazy, though i'm definitely not going to look at it as honestly the story is a huge part of those games. I'm in the camp of ME1>ME2, despite the gameplay changes in ME2 (I still liked the more rpg-ish way better) and I'm not all that pumped for the 3rd except for the conclusion of the story and to see what ridiculous shit they come up with this time that's totally over the top (each time the story just gets more COD gigantic scripted event esque). the fact that uberfans of the series would read the script is baffling to me, as that just completely fucks up your run through the game. It'd be like if i read the story to DXHR, it would just totally fuck up the game (with the leak at least you were actually able to PLAY it).

I'll wait for reviews and see how it does, and hear the opinions from others (as i'm sure most sites will give it a high score just because it's bioware, mass effect, and a high budget game). Hopefully it'll be considered amazing and i'll find it quite good, or at least i'll just be able to finish the story and get closure on the series. i've heard rumors they're bringing back rpg elements but i call bullshit on that one, though if they did do a lot that'd fuckin rule.

 

[Talking Backwards]

I'll wait for reviews and see how it does, and hear the opinions from others (as i'm sure most sites will give it a high score just because it's bioware, mass effect, and a high budget game). Hopefully it'll be considered amazing and i'll find it quite good, or at least i'll just be able to finish the story and get closure on the series. i've heard rumors they're bringing back rpg elements but i call bullshit on that one, though if they did do a lot that'd fuckin rule.

Switch "Bioware" with "Bethesda" and "Mass Effect" with "TES". Doesn't really matter what the quality is or if it's majorly buggy.

360 users get "exclusive 30 day DLC" when the first DLC is released too. I guess that's somehow supposed to be "fair" because modders can fix the game and make better DLC than Bethesda can. /shrug.

The next patch won't be out until January, so have fun with your 0 resist ability until then. I guess the upside is that you can just pick fire spells since they do more damage and use them on anything in the game now without them taking less damage or being immune.

 

[Det Som Engang Var]

Then stop being a PC elitist and play it on console. Because even New Vegas gave me zero glitches, and we all know Obsidian is worse than Bethesda with bugs. What the fuck do you expect from a game this big? Of course there's going to be bugs.

I take shits bigger than Bioware games.

 

[Talking Backwards]

Then stop being a PC elitist and play it on console. Because even New Vegas gave me zero glitches, and we all know Obsidian is worse than Bethesda with bugs. What the fuck do you expect from a game this big? Of course there's going to be bugs.

I take shits bigger than Bioware games.

What are you talking about? The latest patch for ALL platforms have the same bugs. It's also rather meaningless to use the term "PC elitist" when I've stated I don't know how many times I'll use whatever platform is the best depending on the game or genre.

I find it funny though how Obsidian gets so much flak, yet they usually have much better dialogue and stories, and Bethesda games are just as buggy and imbalanced if not moreso (I had zero issues with NV either, but I know many did and acted like it was the worst game ever upon release). The best narration in most Bethesda games isn't even part of any of the quests, it's all found in books.

Oh, and here's the list of so far known bugs.

http://forums.bethsoft.com/index.php?/topic/1297205-unofficial-buglist/

I just picked up the quick reflexes block perk, used it and the first time it activated I ended up getting stuck with permenant time slow.

 

[Enemy242]

I really don't think it's fair to bitch about bugs in Bethesda games. Each time they try to have fewer, but honestly it's just insane to assume they would have none. When it comes down to testing bugs you have to test every aspect, every scenario and essentially everything someone can do. Now for a game like Mass Effect this is fairly easy as in the cities/planets you only have a few actions you can do and are permitted, the characters have a few looping dialogues/are stuck in certain areas and overall while there's a lot of assumed freedom in dialogue, in terms of actual gameplay and actions you can't really do as much as a bethesda game, and thus it's easier to bug test. Take the city of Whiterun and in it you have tons of unique NPC's, all doing their own thing, you can interact with them any way, do tons of ridiculous things etc, whereas on the Citadel you have a bunch of NPC's glued to one spot, with predetermined dialogue, and you can only interact with them via talking to them.

When you break it down, bug testing a bethesda game would be insane because you would simply have to do EVERYTHING, and do it multiple times. When you factor in the fact that the game has more than 300 hours of stuff you can do, that's a fuckload of testing (plus that's not counting completely non structured activities such as some of the smaller aspects that can result in bugs). other games are mostly linear and as such you just go through it again and again and again, and even ones that are non linear tend to have a smaller world than what bethesda games have. I'm not saying you should completely write off game breaking bugs, but the constant bashing and bitching about it doesn't really do much since it's simply so gigantic that until they come up with a way to bug test via machines/lines of code going through the entire game, there will still be things people have missed or that get passed up to work on something else.

They do have a lot of time to finish their games yes, but one has to remember they are a company. they can't spend 15 years on a game, and no one would expect that of any company. they provide an awesome game, consistently innovate, and that causes people to start to get used to the great stuff they bring and get desensitized, it's just how people work.

 

[Talking Backwards]

Yeah it's not fair, because it's Bethesda. Yet when it's any other company people won't stop bitching about it. Just because it's a "name brand" there's no excuse. They rushed the game to hit the "11-11-11" gimmick date. Have you not even looked at the bug list? It's more than "just a few".

It's quite obvious their quality assurance testers as well as gameplay testers were asleep at the wheel on this one for so many reasons. It's still a better game than Oblivion was, but that's not really that hard to accomplish. The more I play this game, the more I realize that once again it's all about exploration and the aesthetics while gameplay is the last thing on their mind. They did do a great job with aesthetics, but it's a shame that the creature variety is so limited, and the majority of dungeons are caves again. It's cool though, it will get GOTY no doubt, deserving or not.

 

[Enemy242]

Again, it's not just because it's Bethesda, it's the type of game. All huge open world games have bugs, they're not just being negligent because they can. Bugs in a linear game are sooo much easier to weed out, but the more freedom, the more space, the more options and the more choices you can make the potential for bugs grows exponentially.

Because you want d&d rpg elements doesn't make it watered down or any worse. In gameplay terms it's really fucking good, and the rpg elements are still deep for the type of game. They haven't been a true d&d stat rolling game in a lotttt of years; complaining about the drop in rpg elements from oblivion to skyrim vs me1 to me2 is not even in close to the same arena. There are things im not a personal fan of, yet I still understand it's a great and well developed gameplay element, same in many other games. Being subjective vs objective with games is totally different, and if one is going to trash the product/company there should be a fault that affects all types of gamers, not just someone expecting something that even the developer doesn't claim to be doing.

If they were claiming to create a full paper and pen rpg experience with in depth stats being the main focus of the game then yeah I'd agree, but they arent. They're influenced by it yeah, but they've made it clear their goal is immersion in the world, artistic style, complete freedom and immersion as opposed to being a perfect pen and paper rpg, a perfect fps, or a perfect stealth game (they work on them, but you can't expect specific focus in such a wide and multiple appeal game). The diversity is already a leap above the other games (all randomly generated dungeons of 2 kinds vs many uniquely designed and 4-5 different dungeon types) in not only dungeons but also the creatures. Placing realistic expectations on the game is important, as of course they'll claim they created the greatest thing ever, but youre just walking into disappointment if you create unreal expectations instead of comparing it to the rest of the series, similar games and progression for the amount of time it took. When the witcher, diablo or wow loses the rpg focus while claiming to be a 100% accurate, perfect stat based experience, then I'll start giving them shit.

 

[Enemy242]

I really do need to get tired of Skyrim though, 115 hours and I'm still having a blast and have tons of stuff to do. I have Battlefield 3, GTA 4, GTA E:LC, GTA:SA, The Witcher 2 2.0 all sitting on steam waiting for me to play them (the gta ones i never played on pc, or ballad of gay tony at all). Hell, I haven't even been online with steam or origin since the game came out, by the time i start playing those games i'll have mass effect 3, la noire, syndicate and more begging me to play them.

 

[Dead Winter]

Yeah. Awesome.

 

[Liverslapper]

I have a massive erection in my pants.

 

[Dead Winter]

Sensory overload. My ears and eyes can't take it.

 

[Enemy242]

making that video was very very foolish. now it is an absolute certainty that she will have legions of 300 pound nerds with neckbeards finding her and proclaiming their love to her while wearing an amulet of mara they made out of twigs and colored foil candy wrappers.

 

[Dead Winter]

Nah she's done tons of videos like that. She always does her own rendition of soundtracks and such.

 

[WhiteBeastofWotan]

that was way fucking rad.

 

[Anvil]

Yeah. Awesome.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4z9TdDCWN7g

Wow. <3

 

[Talking Backwards]

Because you want d&d rpg elements doesn't make it watered down or any worse. In gameplay terms it's really fucking good, and the rpg elements are still deep for the type of game.

Good god your inexperience is showing. This as "RPG lite" as you can possibly get, and no, the "gameplay" is not good by any means. I just found a review that shares my exact sentiments on what Skyrim actually is and how you have to approach it. You can't think about it, you can't ponder on the future or your character, you have to just "let it happen". In other words, you can't enjoy it without shutting off your brain, because if you don't, you'll spend too much time thinking about what it's not.

This is Skyrim at its best. When you accept it on its own flawed and often brittle terms. When you look past the FedEx delivery quests, almost all of which come down to going someplace to get a doo-dad. When you let the lore and dialogue and scripting carry you along. When you embrace what it's trying to do instead of scrutinizing what it actually does. When you just let it happen. This is when Skyrim will reward you most richly. Not when you're trying to win, or beat it, or get to the end, or level up, or earn the achievements. Not when you're playing it like a stat-based RPG, or a single-player MMO, or a challenge. Skyrim is putatively a game. More accurately, it's a narrative loom.

But Skyrim isn't just a world. It's also an RPG in which the leveling is almost beside the point. Like so many other things in Skyrim, it happens, but it hardly feels worth chasing. There's very little of the forward pull you get in an RPG with a good character development system. Leveling up is a strange combination of money, crafting, combat, stealth, lockpicking, and almost anything else you'll do. Basically, you just play and it happens. It's more like aging than leveling up. There is nary an experience point to be found of all of Skyrim, but that doesn't mean it doesn't have some of the trappings you expect when you're earning experience points. For instance, the references to monster levels. I learn a spell that only affects enemies up to level 10. How am I supposed to know what level this frost troll is? What are these bandits? Do wolves have levels? Why am I suddenly fretting about this?

The moment you start to approach Skyrim as a game, and at times you can hardly help it, is the moment it starts to get brittle and threatens to crack. As a game, Skyrim is sometimes profoundly broken, and not just because of the occasional bugs and busted AI scripting. This is all too often a frail illusion that will collapse under its own weight, if not the weight of Bethesda's traditionally sloppy testing or their utter cluelessness when it comes to usability issues. Welcome to one of the worst interfaces this side of a Pip Boy. You'd think a game so full of trash loot and inconsequential frippery would put a priority on managing all that detail. Instead, you get to scroll through myriad lists, sometimes while the action is paused with a battle axe swinging towards your skull or a spell poised to leave your fingertips. This is not a fluid experience, much less a graceful one. The hand-to-hand combat is an exercise in flailing, the magic is a list of spells as long as your arm and just as unwieldy to reference, and the stealth is as contrived as ever. This is still an engine clearly built for a first-person shooter, which means archers have it easiest and everyone else just has to make do.

For all Bethesda's ambition, why haven't they gotten better at the basics of moment-to-moment gameplay? This is the same game they've been making since 2002's Morrowind. In fact, you can trace this design as far back as Bethesda's 1990 Terminator game, in which you played Kyle Reese battling the Terminator across an open map of Los Angeles. Has any other developer worked with the same basic idea for more than two decades and still asked you to accept such fundamental compromises as this sloppy melee system, overbearing inventory management, and brittle AI scripting? When so many other issues have been solved, when computers and console systems are finally ready to realize Bethesda's ambitious vision, why do these more pedestrian issues persist? For the most part, Skyrim is a triumph of world building that deserves recognition, praise, and the many hours you'll pour into it. But Skyrim is also a disappointing punt.

http://www.honestgamers.com/reviews/9740.html

 

[Enemy242]

I still believe what I said but yes, I am inexperienced when it comes to RPGs. But that's the point, I don't think they planned on it being the be all end all RPG, the be all end all FPS, the be all end all stealth game etc. I'm able to enjoy it more simply because I'm going in looking for what they've produced the past few games but improved as opposed to something else. When it comes down to it that's all you really can do, and instead of ripping on something they're not fully trying to do (yes they have rpg elements yes they have stats but again, that's just one part and they've evolved to focusing on other things) doesn't make all that much sense and is a bit hopeless.

Maybe someday i'll grow to love the D&D super stat rpgs, but even then i'll look for it in games that promote and make a point to offer that. I play DXHR for it's offerings and the ideas that are a common thread to the deus ex series, and it's the same thing for Skyrim. If you really want to buy and play a game you know won't be attempting to offer what you want then it makes more sense to either mod it yourself or buy a game that specifically caters to those deep rpg fans as opposed to ripping on something that is projected by the player into the game. I wouldn't pick up MW3 and be pissed when they lead me down a hallway of scripted events, despite rehashing the same thing for the 3rd time, i just say it's shitty and never play it instead of playing it and dissecting everything that wouldn't be in there.