If Mort Divine ruled the world

So the difference is that Hardy was justified in his use of violence and Rice was not? Is this what you're getting at? What's this attacking story anyways that you are referring to, and why are you giving it more weight than her version?

http://www.scout.com/nfl/cowboys/story/1529511-cowboys-hardy-a-timeline-of-dv-complaint

Why do I not believe her side? The bruises don't back up her story (other than the futon part anyway), her being high on cocaine doesn't help her story, the fact that he had to call the police, the fact that her story changed and the DA couldn't even go forward with what they had from her without her, and that she didn't want to appear before a jury.

THE NIGHT OF THE INCIDENT


The night of May 12, 2014, Hardy, and Holder, along with Hardy’s assistant and other friends, went out drinking. Holder later admitted to snorting cocaine that night, although a co-worker enacted her Fifth Amendment rights when asked about taking cocaine with Holder that night. After a night of partying, including Hardy getting upset when a Nelly song was played in one of the clubs they visited, they returned to Hardy’s apartment and continued to party.

The 9-1-1 Calls:

At approximately 4:18 a.m., Hardy made a call to 9-1-1, in which he stated the following:

  • That Holder had hit him in the face twice, and wouldn’t leave the apartment, and that she told him to break her arm when he asked her to leave.
  • Hardy’s assistant was trying to retain her but she was attempting to his Hardy with a shoe.
  • Hardy stated that she wouldn’t let him close the door to the apartment and that he “can’t touch her to get her out”.
  • That he was trying to stay away from her, and that he was behind the bar, and wasn’t touching her, but that she had broken some glass and he couldn’t walk through his kitchen. Additionally he repeatedly asked “What do I do?”
  • When asked if he needed a medic he stated that he was “a little swollen” but didn’t notice any bleeding, although later in the call he said “Ah (expletive), am I bleeding? (Expletive), I’m bleeding, man. (Expletive).”
Throughout the call he could be heard telling his assistant to “Keep her, bro, keep her. Don’t let her go,” as well as telling her “You shouldn’t have hit me, you shouldn’t have hit me.” She could be heard in the background yelling.

Shortly after Hardy’s 9-1-1 call, another call was placed by an attendant at Hardy’s building, a woman, claiming to have been in the apartment during the incident was with him, and kept interrupting the call. In this call the two parties stated:

  • (Female) “Domestic Violence. Do you hear that bull(expletive)? He’s beating her (expletive) in there. Some girl’s getting her (expletive) beat upstairs, and I heard it. And I seen it. He is beating her (expletive) right the (expletive) now. So get here now. I was in the apartment, he’s beating her (expletive).''
  • The building attendant stated that the female told him that she was in the front room of the apartment, and heard the argument in the back room.
  • The attendant also stated that the female who was speaking on the call had initially stated that she heard the altercation, and later said she had seen it.
  • According to the attendant, while they were on the call, the other female (Holder) walked out of the apartment (and apparently down stairs to his post).
  • (Attendant) “I don’t know her name. She just stated her name to you. It’s my first time seeing these girls ever. The one that was talking, she’s drunk. You can tell that she’s inebriated.”


A third 911 call was placed the next afternoon by a neighbor, who stated he had heard what he thought was moving furniture, but after he called the woman involved (likely Holder), she said that they were not moving furniture. He also stated that what he heard was likely the incident that the eight officers were outside his apartment investigating the night before.


The incident report & arrest warrant:

The incident report for the investigation lists a white, 24-year-old female (Holder) as the victim, although the name was temporarily withheld on the copy I was able to view. In the report, the officer stated that the victim was drunk, and had incurred minor injuries (Bruises/Scratches), and refused medical treatment at the scene. The only listing of weapons was “Personal Weapons (hands, feet, teeth, etc.)”. The narrative listed by the officer stated “On May 13, 2014 at approximately 0418 the victim was physically assaulted by the suspect at his residence located at (blank). The victim and suspect have been in an active relationship together since September 2013.”

At 12:49 PM on May 13, 2014, a warrant was issued for Hardy’s arrest. The warrant stated that Hardy assaulted Holder by (the capital letters are present in the document):

“GRABBING VICTIM AND THROWING ON THE FLOOR, THROWING INTO A BATHTUB, SLAMMING HER AGAINST A FUTON, AND STRANGLING HER.”

The Restraining Order:

On May 14, 2014, Holder filed a “Complain and motion for domestic violence protective order” against Hardy, with the following statement:

“On May 13, 2014, Greg Hardy attacked me in his apartment. Hardy picked me up and threw me into the tile tub area in his bathroom. I have bruises from head to toe, including my head, neck, back, shoulders, arms, legs, elbow and feet. Hardy pulled me from the tub by my hair, screaming at me that he was going to kill me, break my arms, and other threats that I completely believe. He drug me across the bathroom and out into the bedroom. Hardy choked me with both hands around my throat while I was lying on the floor. He picked me up over his head and threw me onto a couch covered in assault rifles and/or shotguns. I landed on those weapons. Hardy bragged that all those assault rifles were loaded. Landing on those weapons bruised my neck and back. Hardy screamed for his “administrative assistant” (Sammy Curtis) to come into the room and hold me down. Curtis came into the room, grabbed me from behind and held me down. Hardy and Curtis then took me into the living room area. I wasn’t nearly strong or fast enough to escape. I begged them to let me go & I wouldn’t tell anyone what he did. They took me out into the hall, pushed me down & went back inside his apartment. I crawled to the elevator, and ran into CMPD.”

The restraining order, however, was dismissed when Holder did not show up in court on May 15th, 2014.
 
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He indirectly admits to hitting her because she hit him in the call, but denies it in court. But the stories don't match up? All the reports have Hardy getting jealous over Nelly banging his ex, so why is it illogical to think he overreacted (influenced by alcohol, surely) and hit her and threw and all the other stuff?

Court case concludes with;

After 10 hours of testimony, the judge ruled that the evidence persuaded her beyond a reasonable doubt that Hardy beat Holder, threw her around his apartment, then tried to hide his actions with the fabricated 911 call.

Then Holder doesn't show up for court. I mean, we have to be honest here, this seems like mafia-esque persuasion on the part of Hardy. Or do you think Holder feels guilty about getting Hardy convicted and decided not to show up to court again?

If anything, Hardy seems guilty of "reciprocating violence with violence" but the dude is probably 100-150 lbs heavier than her..and the evidence could suggest he did the tub/futon/choking shit too.
 
Cocaine is a hell of a drug. Her bruises and the general situation seems to support he shoved her around, and we will just assume that included onto a futon (possibly with guns on them, not like that matters) and maybe a tub. If she was coming at him, which is likely, that's a pretty restrained and reasonable reaction. Is he supposed to just let her do whatever? That's some bullshit I saw all over comment threads about this incident and others. So much for equality.

So a female judge looks at the poor little white girl and the big black man and finds the big black man guilty, with such little evidence the entire thing went away rather than go before a jury? Some strong evidence right there I tell ya.

http://www.charlotteobserver.com/latest-news/article10422650.html

Murray’s office would not elaborate on what prosecutors found when they compared Holder’s statements, but the district attorney said in court that with Holder unavailable, they “did not have sufficient legal basis” to enter her statements to police as evidence.

If she was credible, the DA could have moved forward without her.
 
I don't really care to go to this anymore. You admit that he atleast threw her around, which is domestic violence unless the law has changed.

The equality argument is pretty silly because no one is arguing that here nor is that a logical argument.

The opposite of the "female judge" line could be said by Mort-ists about every case other than this. "White judge allows NFL/NCAA player to keep playing because they didn't want his career ruined by X allegation" so I don't think it has any weight here. I think it's kind of a trite point anyways, I don't even know what your position is anymore. This started by me asking how was Hardy's case different than Rice's? Apparently you agree with me not that they aren't different or that he was justified because she was a wild cocaine addict who hit him.

She probably wasn't deemed credible because of the admittance to cocaine, but it's not really that crazy of a drug where you take it and start acting violent all the time. Look how Hardy is defended now, imagine if it went to a public court where it came out that she was drugged during the altercation? No bueno man. But I did enjoy how you ignored the "buying" off aspect of this case :)
 
I don't really care to go to this anymore. You admit that he atleast threw her around, which is domestic violence unless the law has changed.

This started by me asking how was Hardy's case different than Rice's? Apparently you agree with me not that they aren't different or that he was justified because she was a wild cocaine addict who hit him.

The equality argument is pretty silly because no one is arguing that here nor is that a logical argument.

So fending off someone who is attacking you in your own home is "domestic violence". Ok. I clearly delineated how the incidents were different but somehow I agree with you?

It is a common line that it's "never" ok to hit a woman. Never means "under no set of circumstances". I disagree with that sentiment. That sentiment is also incredibly sexist, so why do Mort's agree with it?

The opposite of the "female judge" line could be said by Mort-ists about every case other than this. "White judge allows NFL/NCAA player to keep playing because they didn't want his career ruined by X allegation" so I don't think it has any weight here.

Women > black men. Gotta get your victimization hierarchy right.


She probably wasn't deemed credible because of the admittance to cocaine, but it's not really that crazy of a drug where you take it and start acting violent all the time. Look how Hardy is defended now, imagine if it went to a public court where it came out that she was drugged during the altercation? No bueno man. But I did enjoy how you ignored the "buying" off aspect of this case :)


I ignored the alleged payoff because it's pure speculation on the part of one person. If he did, she obviously got what she wanted anyway, and if he didn't, she knew she wasn't going to get it if she had to appear in court again. Even with her not appearing, the DA could have moved forward with criminal charges if he had anything to go on, but they didn't because they compared her statements and they apparently significantly conflicted.
 
Society is unequal and it should be, don't be such a crybaby :)

The only difference is that there's no video evidence of Janay ever hitting Ray Rice, but if there was it would be similar scenarios and justified in your eyes. It takes some pretty crazy circumstances for a man to be justified using force on a woman.

I don't know why people agree with that sentiment, or think that "pushing" women to go into STEM is equality but they do and it makes no sense to me.

Your whole argument is speculation! He hit her first, because she's a cokehead and he said so. :lol:

Only confliction I saw was the whole "I seent it, I heard it!" thing in that website you linked. Seems that the bodily damage evidence is pretty easy to win a case, but i'm sure without the testimony of the victim it's harder. Either way, it's clear she was scared or bought off. Unless she's this crazy coke head that's laying around somewhere :)
 
You were in the military, you should understand the concept of "reaction equivalent to the threat". Ray Rice clearly went over that line, it does not appear that Hardy did. Regarding crazy circumstances: Yeah, that covers most fights. It's an idea that all men outweigh women by 100lbs and women can't really do anything to physically hurt men.

Well if you want to get technical, everything is a degree of speculation because only 3 people were present plus "seen it/heard it" girl. But based on the best speculation, the charges were expunged.

Yeah she was scared. Perjury ain't no joke. At least she didn't cry rape on top of it all.
 
Threat = drugged out woman with no weapons :lol: quit being so ridiculous here man!

How many bruises does Hardy have? Holder? I mean come on..its not an equivalency thing here. A woman slap is way less than anything a pro DL can do..

Just because you're in the tiny minority doesn't mean you have to play the "But not all men are 6'0"!!!!" card..

Do you really think she was lying here? You literally just admitted to him hitting her like 2 posts ago
 
Threat = drugged out woman with no weapons :lol: quit being so ridiculous here man!

How many bruises does Hardy have? Holder? I mean come on..its not an equivalency thing here. A woman slap is way less than anything a pro DL can do..

Just because you're in the tiny minority doesn't mean you have to play the "But not all men are 6'0"!!!!" card..

Do you really think she was lying here? You literally just admitted to him hitting her like 2 posts ago

You're saying "drugged out" like it makes her less dangerous. Come on dude.

We didn't get pictures of bruises on a black guy afterwards, we have pictures of hickies on a white girl. Are you telling me a woman slapping you or hitting you with an object - even if she isn't that strong, isn't painful enough to warrant a reaction? Come on.

Do I think she lied about him chokeslamming her etc? Yeah.
 
If you think a woman on cocaine isn't a threat, you're straight up a fucking idiot.
I could tell you some stories.

Anyway who cares, some drug-fucked skank and some overpaid caveman dickhead fucked with each other, boo hoo it's the end of the world.
Execute them both for all I care.

151106205556-01-greg-hardy-deadspin-photos-super-169.jpg


How hard exactly does one need to push to cause bruises like that? Being lightly pushed doesn't cause that.

That isn't bad bruising, that's an average day for a skateboarder, bad bruising is the colour of a fucking eggplant Mort, you've clearly not experienced much extreme DV in your life (not saying that's a bad thing) oh and cocaine users tend to have horrible skin so to my eyes that just looks like bad skin with light bruising on top in about 4 separate places.

Next.
 
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It's a hell of a drug.

Only tried it twice, and it was pretty fun for me (dexedrine was better though), but I saw it tweak other guys out.