Official Off Topic Thread

[ABQShredHead]

I live right in the middle of "infestation", and I know exactly what JDub speaks of. And preached acceptance of their multiculturalism sickens me. It dilutes our country's history and pushes us toward third-world standards of living.

As for the wages, companies will only look at the bottom line. The cheaper the labor, the better to the bottom line. Sad, but true. I in no way condone it, don't get me wrong; in fact, I think companies who have illegals on their pay rolls, whether under or over the table, should be held absolutely accountable for their practices.

I have seen plenty of Mexicans go through the proper channels to gain US citizenship. It is by no means a difficult process.

 

[J-Dubya 777]

I live right in the middle of "infestation", and I know exactly what JDub speaks of. And preached acceptance of their multiculturalism sickens me. It dilutes our country's history and pushes us toward third-world standards of living.

As for the wages, companies will only look at the bottom line. The cheaper the labor, the better to the bottom line. Sad, but true. I in no way condone it, don't get me wrong; in fact, I think companies who have illegals on their pay rolls, whether under or over the table, should be held absolutely accountable for their practices.

I have seen plenty of Mexicans go through the proper channels to gain US citizenship. It is by no means a difficult process.

I endorse this post 110%

 

[Beelzebub]

I live right in the middle of "infestation", and I know exactly what JDub speaks of. And preached acceptance of their multiculturalism sickens me. It dilutes our country's history and pushes us toward third-world standards of living.

Mexicans are all over the place here, too. I agree with Ken on this one. I don't understand what you said about how accepting multiculturalism is sickening. If that were the case, I'd never have a taco :\.

 

[razoredge]

Myself, I want proper channels closed as well, my feelings are straighten out your own country as our kin did ours.
-------------------------------------------------------
Ken, that was kinda of pathetic. First off you indicate that picking "fruit" is the only occupation thats threatened... WRONG, but to answer your question, yes I did work happily in agriculture for three years after I graduated from high school, 50 hours/6 days a week. Farm minimum wage paid 2.10 (no time and a half) an hour in '77 and I was at 3.50 by the end of three years. There was many of us country boys that did that at that time, I have met many my age that worked various farms, apple orchards, chicken farms... yikes... not me!, logging, pulp wood producers, ect. yes indeed at one time boys were men.

I should tell you that before when I said "what do you know about it" did not mean what do you know but rather that you were and would be unaffected... hopefully. By not being effected you are unaware of the full scope and therefore uncareing.
------
ABQ- yes, capitalism as it finest sheen, however, were the "competition" not there for the jobs, that capitalistic pigs would have to compete for the work force... thereby making them less hoglike. I know beyond a shadow of a doubt that this all has intentionally taken place by the blind eye as a matter of putting the American labor force "in our place"... yet all along we thought our place was living and producing in AMERICA, you know the place we were born, our parents were born, our grandparents were born, working hard and gaining by all that the labor force had fought for during the turn of the previous century, the wars, building a strong economic growth that awarded all citizens, right up through the 60's... when it only took one income to raise a great, happy, low stress family. Now its all just chaos, the ultimate ant hill, everyone dancing to the tune of a handful of puppet masters. But hey, we have cheap products (in more ways than one) and its a damn good thing, otherwise the working poor couldnt afford to live here, but wait didnt we just scam our way into a great profitable way to further stress that ? Its OK though because its predicted to all level out in 100 years... groovy

 

[ABQShredHead]

Mexicans are all over the place here, too. I agree with Ken on this one. I don't understand what you said about how accepting multiculturalism is sickening. If that were the case, I'd never have a taco :.

Hey, I love tacos just as much as the next guy. In fact, I completely adore the cuisine of my area, which is based on Mexican cuisine adapted to the local flavor of green chile. However, that is not at all my point, Yas.

The South Valley of Albuquerque has become Little Juarez. The large contingent of Mexican nationals have come into the area and degraded the entire area to nearly a cardboard city, much like what exists 200' from the border of El Paso, TX and Juarez.

Our rush to bring multiculturalism to the forefront of our society is degrading our own society. My feelings are that we rush too fast to accept others' cultures without a) understanding our own and b) remembering our own if and when we do understand it.

ABQ- yes, capitalism as it finest sheen, however, were the "competition" not there for the jobs, that capitalistic pigs would have to compete for the work force... thereby making them less hoglike. I know beyond a shadow of a doubt that this all has intentionally taken place by the blind eye as a matter of putting the American labor force "in our place"... yet all along we thought our place was living and producing in AMERICA, you know the place we were born, our parents were born, our grandparents were born, working hard and gaining by all that the labor force had fought for during the turn of the previous century, the wars, building a strong economic growth that awarded all citizens, right up through the 60's... when it only took one income to raise a great, happy, low stress family. Now its all just chaos, the ultimate ant hill, everyone dancing to the tune of a handful of puppet masters. But hey, we have cheap products (in more ways than one) and its a damn good thing, otherwise the working poor couldnt afford to live here, but wait didnt we just scam our way into a great profitable way to further stress that ? Its OK though because its predicted to all level out in 100 years... groovy

Do keep in mind (is it Steve?) that I'm on your side here, just in a different manner. I can see why companies want to go out and get cheap labor to affect their bottom line and turn their revenues into profits. I can also see those products they are turning out are cheap and crap. But, that also points at shortened lives of products to in turn increase sales through repeated buying by consumers, if they so choose to continue buying the same crap over and over.

At the same time, we as Americans do need to realize the landscapes have changed and we need to adapt as well.

 

[Beelzebub]

Our rush to bring multiculturalism to the forefront of our society is degrading our own society. My feelings are that we rush too fast to accept others' cultures without a) understanding our own and b) remembering our own if and when we do understand it.

American society? We're a nation of immigrants. What you're saying sounds really xenophobic.

 

[Swabs]

The content of the last few pages seems laughably and somewhat disappointingly xenophobic. And I say that living in England! A country who's workforce is more and more consisting of Polish, eastern european and middle-eastern immigrants.

But hey, I sort of expected that as soon as I read what people were talking about. Considering the "Hey lets shoot all the foreigners, not change our political system. and go back to the ways of the old days" attitudes of some of the people here.

 

[ABQShredHead]

American society? We're a nation of immigrants. What you're saying sounds really xenophobic.

Ha! We're a nation with immigration laws these days, aren't we? You don't quite see my point at all. I think you're quite tied up in the postmodernist layers of crap pushed onto our youth today.

I have zero phobias in that regard, Yas. I hired a daughter of Mexican nationals, and she's a great kid to work with. I do not look at anybody based on the color of their skin. I do look at people coming into this nation illegally and usurping our resources without contributing back as all other Americans do.

 

[razoredge]

American society? We're a nation of immigrants. What you're saying sounds really xenophobic.

That was then, along time ago and the American culture was still its own. Much changed since then and our country has tried to help so many other countries gain their freedom from issues within their governments as well as simply looking at our example, (Im not speaking or the past two decades, you should know.) What gets me is that the people of these other countries have not made the stand that our ancestors did at various points in time, over various issues, but rather just come here, I realize its easier, very easy in fact.

I like and respect other cultures, in their own country, its a thing called home.

I dont like or eat Mexican or Chinese food, but thats me, a boring eater.

The labor issue is really my upmost concern, that and the social security. The flood of immigrants willing to work cheap really has kept wages at a stand still for nearing 20 years and this directly has effected myself and many of my aquantances in the labor fields... that are left. Then when you get right down to it, these immigrants are just being used as well, so myself I think all should be concerned, not distracted by "zenophobia" or "racism", that is not it at all.

 

[Meedleyx10]

I haven't seen it anywhere on here yet, so RIP Jerry Reed. Lived a pretty good and long life, but a sad loss nonetheless.

 

[schenkadere]

I haven't seen it anywhere on here yet, so RIP Jerry Reed. Lived a pretty good and long life, but a sad loss nonetheless.

Indeed...a fine guitarist.

 

[Beelzebub]

Ha! We're a nation with immigration laws these days, aren't we? You don't quite see my point at all. I think you're quite tied up in the postmodernist layers of crap pushed onto our youth today.

I have zero phobias in that regard, Yas. I hired a daughter of Mexican nationals, and she's a great kid to work with. I do not look at anybody based on the color of their skin. I do look at people coming into this nation illegally and usurping our resources without contributing back as all other Americans do.

"I'm not racist, one of my bff's is black!"

How are they not contributing to the economy? Is the produce you eat every day not picked by them? Are the clothes you wear not made by them?

 

[J-Dubya 777]

"I'm not racist, one of my bff's is black!"

How are they not contributing to the economy? Is the produce you eat every day not picked by them? Are the clothes you wear not made by them?

For me, it doesn't even make it to the contributing to the economy part.
If my polo shirt wasn't made in China, it was probably made in Mexico. Is that shirt sewing job in Mexico any better than picking berries in the US?

If I wanted to move to say, Australia, do you think that for one second, I'd be able to do it with out the proper paperwork/visas/whatever? That I'd be able to waltz right in? I wouldn't expect that to happen, nor would I be pissed if I got deported because of it. Sure, in a perfect UtopianKenneth world, we'd be able to live wherever we wanted to on the planet. Real life isn't like that. Thank the undocumented/illegals worldwide for that. Don't even get me started on the a-holes who get student visas here, and never show up, or even signup for any classes. They are equally as guilty as the rest of them. I still stand by what part of ILLEGAL isn't understood by the bleeding hearts on this issue (no offense Yas... )

I haven't seen it anywhere on here yet, so RIP Jerry Reed. Lived a pretty good and long life, but a sad loss nonetheless.

No kidding, I'm a fan of his music and movie appearances

 

[progmetaldan]

^ There are definately advantages to being an island... We have a very multicultural environment here, and that's cool, but yeah not so many illegals...

 

[DoomsdayZach]

I don't take what Mark is saying to be xenophobic in the least. To my understanding of skimming the topic, he's complaining (and correct me if i'm wrong) about people who are here illegally (and people who come from mexico and are not here via proper channels is illegal based on the laws in our country) who are causing problems in the community and the country. I don't think it's to say that they're all rotten people, but they are here illegally, and they don't belong here. The law states they shouldn't, so why give them the benefits of living here?

 

[J-Dubya 777]

I don't take what Mark is saying to be xenophobic in the least. To my understanding of skimming the topic, he's complaining (and correct me if i'm wrong) about people who are here illegally (and people who come from mexico and are not here via proper channels is illegal based on the laws in our country) who are causing problems in the community and the country. I don't think it's to say that they're all rotten people, but they are here illegally, and they don't belong here. The law states they shouldn't, so why give them the benefits of living here?

Exactly. I'm not making a judgement on them as people, but their status is ILLEGAL... end of story. I don't care if they are Mother Theresa or the next up & coming Saint. They are ILLEGAL!

 

[ABQShredHead]

I haven't seen it anywhere on here yet, so RIP Jerry Reed. Lived a pretty good and long life, but a sad loss nonetheless.

What?!! Shoot, I didn't hear that. I liked him.

"I'm not racist, one of my bff's is black!"

How are they not contributing to the economy? Is the produce you eat every day not picked by them? Are the clothes you wear not made by them?

Oh, hell, don't even bring out the racist card. Again, more postmodernist lines of thinking. As Antonin Scalia said it best, "the only way to stop discriminating on color is to stop discriminating on color". I have zero issues with the color of anybody's skin, Yas, only their behaviors.

I don't take what Mark is saying to be xenophobic in the least. To my understanding of skimming the topic, he's complaining (and correct me if i'm wrong) about people who are here illegally (and people who come from mexico and are not here via proper channels is illegal based on the laws in our country) who are causing problems in the community and the country. I don't think it's to say that they're all rotten people, but they are here illegally, and they don't belong here. The law states they shouldn't, so why give them the benefits of living here?

Thank you, Zach. I obviously couldn't (and didn't) say it any better myself.

 

[squidfetish]

Doesn't capitalism rely to a large extent on having a cheap pool of labour? With full employment, wages rise and businesses go bust. I'm not saying it's right, just the way it is. Over here we have a lot of Poles and Latvians who work for a lot less than the minimum wage, but their money goes 4 times further back home than it does over here. I lived with a bunch of them for a couple of years - they work way harder than the British and they don't take days off sick. A lot of the locals here are too lazy to get off their fat asses and work because they've got it too easy on the dole (benefits, that is) as long as they cheap churning out kids. I don't really blame employers for taking the foreigners on, but I have to say that it does piss me off that they can claim financial benefits for children they have back in their home countries and the British taxpayer has to pay for it. Why can't their own governments and taxpayers cough up for that?

 

[ABQShredHead]

Yes, to some extent. But it's not capitalism, per se - it's just simple business operation. Operating expenses detract from revenues, reducing profits. A company needs cash to stand on its feet - if it does not have profits to turn into cash, it will soon wither and die. The more a company can reduce its operating expenses, the more it can turn its earnings into profits. Any business operates in that manner, whether in a capitalist environment or not.

 

[squidfetish]

To a certain extent yes, but now I see more and more businesses where the be-all and end-all is shareholder profit. Call me old fashioned, but I think we've gone too far in this direction. I'd like to see a bit more responsibility to the population and yes, in return, a bit more responsibility from the population towards its own upkeep, regulation and wellbeing. That said, I don't see things changing any time soon....