Opeth has run its course

[the_drip]

I don't really care what they do, as long as they continue to impress me. I loved Damnation enough that I, too, wouldn't mind if they dropped the heaviness.

that'd make for a boring ass live show. I can stand 2 of the softer songs ina set list..but I couldn't tolerate an entire concert.

 

[~random~]

I could if there weren't psycho fucks like in Brisbane. These two cockheads kept swearing at Mike telling him to play TIMR. THey got really shitty at him when he said they couldn't coz Axe didn't know it, and then they poured gin and cigarette ash all over me. It was people like them that fucked up some of the mellow bits.

 

[Alex78]

GR is a clear improvement over D1/D2. the next one might well be another masterpiece like BWP! why not?!

 

[~random~]

It's what i'm hoping for.

 

[Liquid Diamonds]

Nobody has the right to judge when a band has burned out. Like MetalManCPA says, if you're tired of them then there's more than enough alternatives out there to keep you satisfied. But I, quite frankly, am entirely perplexed by this thread. I see absolutely no indication whatsoever of Opeth burning out. At all.

 

[Powers]

I think Ghost Reveries was a clear progression from Deliverance. In all honesty, I'm at a stage where I would totally understand if the band were to break up. They have done quite a lot musically over the last decade and a half, and it would be fair for them to go their seperate ways.

I think as long as Mike is writing music, the essence of the band 'Opeth' will still be alive and well.

Strangely enough I agree. I don't want them to break up but if they did I'd wouldn't resent them for it or anything and I wouldn't feel that I'd been cheated or anything.

Opeth is not metal anymore, on Ghost Reveries the growls sounded forced and were very rare.

They keep the growls because it is their metal street cred but they are not into it anymore.
Proof is that Mikael doesn't listen to metal anymore and he said no metal band has struck him recently.

Opeth never had to be metal, If they decided that their stuff in future was going to be more like Damnation I'd still listen to them. Opeth is so much more than a metal band. Besides which it doesn't suprise me that no new bands have struck Mike or any of the members.

They released an acoustic album and we thought they'd fuck it up, signed to Roadrunner and a lot of us though they'd fuck it up and you know what we were wrong, they became a 5 piece with a permanent key boardist and again a lot of us thought they'd fuck it up. You know what? They proved us wrong, so we may well think that another album is a bad idea, but they've proved us wrong before, they may may well do it again.

Of course I did say In Flames were starting a second renissance after Reroute so I have been wrong about these things before...

 

[biggsy]

Strangely enough I agree. I don't want them to break up but if they did I'd wouldn't resent them for it or anything and I wouldn't feel that I'd been cheated or anything.

Absolutely. I feel they've acheived what they needed to and the rest is just bonus material. Of course, I'm not saying there isn't more they could acheive, just that this is all I'd expect from them. But I also have a feeling this next album will blow all these anti-Opeth feelings right out of the water.

 

[the_3_toed_sloth]

Im not getting anything from Opeth anymore, nothing new is coming from them, seems they are repeating themselves now and nothing shocking or exciting comes from them anymore, just one step down with each release.... your thoughts??

If they were to break up, I wouldn't be upset. I think they have already made their best stuff in my opinion.

One step down with every release? 90% of fans would call either Still Life or BwP their best, myself included. That means it was only midway through that they hit their stride.

Im in two minds about Opeth these days though. As much as i love the diverse/prog side of their music, i can't help but think that this increasingly equates with overproduction. GR is just too easy to listen to much of the time; even the growls, while sung incredibly well, never have that harsh aspect to them. If you track through their albums I think one big aspect is that they are increasingly easy on the ear, which goes against the grain of good metal. This is why the description of 'fun' seems very apt to GR, because theres no longer anything threatening in it. I always remember that one of the first times i really connected with Opeth was in Godhead's Lament - the mellow seemed that much more emotive and honest because the harshness felt genuinely harsh and destructive. The more refined Opeth becomes, the more the two blend, and the less effective each becomes.

Do I then consider this the end for Opeth? No, i am not ready to say this. Even on Deliverance, generally held as their least great, they gave one of my top Opeth tracks, Wreath. This a) showed a willingness not to resort to only the heavy-clean-heavy-acoustic-heavy formula, b) unpolished growls, c) thick mood, d) non-reliance on prog or psych influence. It was a truly excellent Opeth track, a truly Opethian track, and yet very different to anything they'd done in the past.

Opeth have a deep reservoir of talent, and while I can appreciate the fears of stagnation, I remain hopeful.

 

[metal_wrath]

I would have to agree that Opeth has not run it's course. Although if they decided to call it quits (which they won't) then they would remain immortalized by their amazing achievements in the musical realm.

 

[metal_wrath]

Opeth never had to be metal, If they decided that their stuff in future was going to be more like Damnation I'd still listen to them. Opeth is so much more than a metal band. Besides which it doesn't suprise me that no new bands have struck Mike or any of the members.

I don't think Opeth would be Opeth with only clean vocals. Also Mike has said that they will always be a death metal band......from Sweden . Cheers

 

[Nichtsicher]

Strangely enough I agree. I don't want them to break up but if they did I'd wouldn't resent them for it or anything and I wouldn't feel that I'd been cheated or anything.



Opeth never had to be metal, If they decided that their stuff in future was going to be more like Damnation I'd still listen to them. Opeth is so much more than a metal band. Besides which it doesn't suprise me that no new bands have struck Mike or any of the members.

They released an acoustic album and we thought they'd fuck it up, signed to Roadrunner and a lot of us though they'd fuck it up and you know what we were wrong, they became a 5 piece with a permanent key boardist and again a lot of us thought they'd fuck it up. You know what? They proved us wrong, so we may well think that another album is a bad idea, but they've proved us wrong before, they may may well do it again.

Of course I did say In Flames were starting a second renissance after Reroute so I have been wrong about these things before...

Couldnt have put it better myself. I also think that Opeth imo deserve legend status if they already havent received it. They have stayed true to themselves, released 8 brilliant albums which have constantly set new standards and the band keep on raising the bar. They have also been hailed as the most respected band in Metal in a genre that has grown exponentially since the early days.

Opeth will keep releasing albums.

 

[epihasi]

I think that bands have "run their course", when you can tell with great probability, what the next album will sound like. I mean, I think everyone here has to admit, even those who think Opeth "is finished", that you're curious of how Opeth will sound in the future. There is no telling with Opeth. In my opinion they will always induce this curiousity. If they made a total crap album, I would still await their next one, because I know their style can change. If you think they have "sold out" with roadrunner and Ghost Reveries, think two years ahead and imagine holding the brand new Opeth album in your hands, with no idea what they sound like now...Aren't you just a bit curious?

I am!

 

[Hubster]

I think they've done their time, they've made their mark with everything up to Still Life.

I wouldnt be upset if they broke up, if anything, rather a fitting finale for a stellar career.

 

[Harlequin Forest]

First of all I would like to say what a good thread this is. This is one of the reasons I come on here (although I don't post that frequently), because you can have a good debate without people getting carried away and bashing the band for no reason.

I would like to add my two pence worth to this one, too, by saying that there is much life in Opeth, I think.

FACT - GR was recorded without an eye on record label contracts, and since Mikael is without a doubt the core of Opeth and a very talented songwriter, we should assume that GR represents the natural progression from D1/D2. That this album is not to everyone's tastes is fine, and perhaps the only thing you can say about it is that it was rehearsed and through this it might have lost a little bit of that magic (or pain!) you find on Still Life and BWP. I think with the amazingly clear production and superb vocal performance it is easy for us to take this as Opeth 'being more commercial', but if you think about it that's just what we might collectively say in response to it being their best sounding album. Every artist should want their music to shine through great production and I think this plays a part in how the new album is perceived, although it may work on a subconscious level at times.

I for one have found that GR is almost seemingly perfect at times in its execution, and therefore almost appears a tad mechanical in places. I think the most noticeable thing on GR, which is not apparent on any other Opeth album, is the drumming. I love the grooves on this album and it's one of Martin's best performances, but I think many of you will know what I mean when i say that the drumming at times on GR sounds a little static. Yes, there are grooves and the actual playing is amazing, but with such crystal clear sounding drums it is easy to interpret the playing as more 'machine' like. And since many of us pay very close attention to Opeth's music, we will pay close attention to each individual instrument.

I'm probably talking a load of shit now but if you go and listen to April Ethereal for 2 minutes, then put on Beneath the Mire I think you might see what I am getting at, in that through time Opeth's production has got better and better - and I mean 'better' in that each players' parts have become more separated. April Ethereal is much more wholistic in its overall sound; Beneath the Mire isn't. Again, I am just trying to look at this from a different angle, other than saying, "Yeah, but The Drapery Falls has better riffs than The Grand Conjuration."

I would not be devastated if Opeth split up right now, simply because they don't owe us anything at all. That we are fans of their music is incidental and none of us can argue that they have filled a huge gap in the metal canon.

Still to this day there is no band that can say they are like Opeth through their use of dynamics, and yet retain that overpowering sense of majesty in what they do.

I like all their albums, especially Still Life for its amazing riffs and mood. It takes me to a place where no other album has ever done and I sympathise with the subject matter of the concept. I think it is a beautiful album, full of ambiguity in the lyrics and it is Opeth at their most seamless in terms of their shifting dynamics. But this does not mean that there is no chance of me finding another Still Life in the future of this band.

Like Metalman said, each of us has our favourite moments or songs. My love for Still Life is also partly to do with when and where I was listening to it at the time. I can associate so many memories that go together with my infatuation with that record. Again, I am pointing to a mixture of sensual impressions which in turn build our judgements. Because I have not had a similar experience when listening to GR does not necessarily mean I view it as inferior to Still Life.

I think we can all admit to having special memories that go hand in hand with music, and I am sure that if Opeth released another four albums I will have similar reactions to that music, even if they continue to release more albums that sound like GR, rather than the earlier stuff.

Sorry if my argument goes off the point, but what I am getting at overall is that we all seem to love the same albums, and there must be a reason for this other than them having the best riffs or vocal lines, and so on. Is it because GR is not a concept album that we don't like it as much? Is it because of the association with Roadrunner that pervades our feelings towards songs like The Grand Conjuration?

I think this debate is as much to do with where we think Opeth's best moments lie as it is to do with how much longer they will serve as a band. Who's to say that they won't release another ten albums and change direction, making their new work eclipse even the great Still Life?

If you could be arsed reading that, well done!

Rant over.

 

[TLA]

good post, except Opeth have never owed us anything.
and... how is an album more "commercial" just because the production is good?

 

[Harlequin Forest]

good post, except Opeth have never owed us anything.
and... how is an album more "commercial" just because the production is good?

I think what I was trying to get at was as a band tends to get more famous/popular they spend more money on their records and thus have better production. I was just saying that I think there is a possibility that we can interpret this cleaner sound as it not being as good as "back in the day" kinda thing.

If GR was a little more muddy sounding (for want of a better word) and therefore had a production like that of My Arms...then there would be less inclination to slag it off.

I just think the older stuff sounds more organic, not just on a musical level.

Many, of course, will disagree, but I was just trying to get at the debate from a different angle and see if there is something to do with the production of records that plays a huge role in our overall impressions of them.

 

[Powers]

Harlequin Forest makes an interesting point. Perhaps our feelings toward a certain album or song are also a lot to do with where we think the band are in their career. I suppose in a way a lot of people will have an affinity with the album they first heard, for many, Reveries, for a few Orchid, for me My Arms. On the other hand I also have a massive connection to Ghost Reveries as it's the album they were touring when I first saw them.

Now, the band are signed to a major label, they (no doubt) get brilliant producers, their following has increased 10 fold, they're hailed as the new metal sensation (music press 10 years to late anyone?) and their creating music that is (argueably) eaier to listen to, but who wouldn't want to make music that the majority of open minded people could enjoy?

On the one hand I imagine that those who first listen to the band on Orchid, perhaps those who saw them preform live just starting out, feel that the sound has moved too far from what it was to really be "their" Opeth. But some might argue that back then they were just another metal band from Sweden?

On the other hand I imagine that their are those fans from the
"Morningrise" era who were blown away by the 20 minute epic which was "Black Rose", who perhaps expected Opeth's future material would mirror this? Some of these fans have, doubtless, been dissapointed.

For fans of their stuff from the "My Arms" era to "Blackwater" (myself), the band way well have jumped the shark with "Deliverance and Damnation". Particularaly Damnation as it is quite obviously like nothing Opeth have done before and some people seem to feel it wasn't a progression.

However, as I'm sure you're all aware, "Damnation" allowed Opeth a massive stepping stone in to a bigger audience, an audience of people who perhaps might not otherwise listen to a metal band? It could be argued that "Damnation" may well have been the album the album that gave Opeth a name outside the underground metal scene and paved their way to signing to a major, yes?

My point is, that just because Opeth has run its course for you does not mean its run it's course. Just appreciate that in the time they did do something for you, that opened you're mind to more music and perhaps even inspired you to make greater music or some other variety of art and they gave you some awesome memories that you'll never forget. I hope I can still recall, many years from now, the first night I saw them because it is seriously one of my favourite memories.

Just, always try to remember why you were a fan of this band and what came of being so, just remember "your" Opeth.

 

[CF87]

Deliverance and Ghost Reveries while being great are not a progression for the band like say blackwater park and damnation or still life and my arms, your hearse. Opeth is going to really have to reinvent themselves with the next album.

Both albums are still a lot more progressive than the first 2. Just say the band can't progress anymore they still are less stagnant than a lot of heavy bands.

 

[Harlequin Forest]

Well said, Powers.

 

[MetalManCPA]

Bottom line:

When you see Mikael et al at the MTV Music Awards, then you can say Opeth has run its course.