Reasons why Logic 9 is stupid

[Machinated]

I'll try and explain it as easily as possible.

After all drums are set up/tuned/mic'd etc, Ill create and name the tracks, group them, get my takes and comp using quick swipe. I'll literally do as many takes of either the whole song or little sections untill i have everything I need.

comp those together so the performance is as close as i want it.

then for editing, ill base my edits off my trigger tracks as there is basically no bleed. this makes using the transient detection pretty reliable, so most of the time its like 99% right if not 100%.

depending on the songs difficulty/whether or not it has triplet things in/if the drummer is really bad, ill either edit 100% by hand, or cut the song into sections (different regions for chorus etc) and use the automatic method. if im hearing artifacts theres a parameter with "decay" and "slice length" that can be edited to fix things up a bit.

I prefer editing by hand which is WAY slower, but that way I can edit much more accurately as I dont really trust computers with that kind of stuff.

it would be much easier for my to do a video of it, ill try and do something when I have the time. although you cant see the grid behind the regions, when you're moving stuff, it does a line which goes right up to the ruler at the top, so i use that to see how close i am to where i want to be.

 

[Machinated]

just as another thing.....

if you wanted more control over the crossfades etc, after you have done your edits, you can click the "slice at transient markers" and then do the fades yourself, and do further edits if need be

 

[Jarkko Mattheiszen]

Let's take GR meters off compressors and mix with just our ears. Hell, while we're at it, let's ditch all meters! And the faders should read "NO SOUND" at the bottom and "FUCKLOADS" at the top! Actually, I'm plugging my display off tright nwoow so it wo+nt ditsarct me.-

I can absolutely imagine the panning thing irking someone off. It's little things like these that made me fall in love with ProTools. Everything just seems to be the way I want it to, and I don't have to learn working on the software's rules. If the working environment just doesn't feel right, even if it's because such small details, it will affect your workflow and the end results.

 

[updog]

Obviously, the panning level is also graphically shown at all times. I really can't understand what's so difficult about it.

 

[Machinated]

Obviously, the panning level is also graphically shown at all times. I really can't understand what's so difficult about it.

+1

 

[AdamWathan]

If you want to pan two guitar tracks 50/50 L and R what do you set the pan knobs to? -32 and +31 or -32 and +32?

Honestly the panning doesn't bother me that much, I don't understand why they can't do 100 per side like every other DAW but it is by far the least significant issue in my list, I have no problems living with that one. The copy/paste, grid and lack of visible waveform when dragging regions are huuuge deal killers for me, as is the whole automatic aspec of flex mode that leaves zero room for manual adjustments. If I could "flatten" after flexing like when comping and see all the chopped regions and crossfades that would be a dream come true, but you can't. I have sort of figured out a workaround which is to do it via flex, listen and then disable any transient points which sound wrong, go back and cut at the transient out of flex mode and fix it yourself, but it still makes me nervous for some reason...

I really really really want to like Logic! I sold all my PCs and spent $2500 on this setup so of course I want to be happy with it, but everything about Protools just makes so much more sense. But the M-Powered limitations and shitty plugin selection are issues I also would really prefer to avoid, plus I would feel like a complete jackass dropping $2500 for my mac setup when I couldve used PT on my PCs and had things running better anyways since I wouldn't have to record to a fucking useless external HD!

Ugh I hate this.

 

[slashvanyoung]

Adam, have you already ordered m-powered?

Maybe it's an absolute no-go for you, but Cubase (5) does most of the things you're complaining about just fine...

 

[AdamWathan]

Yeah I already ordered M-Powered :/ I would rather suck it up and finally move to ProTools than screw around with anything else at this point to be honest. If PT is good enough for Sneap it's good enough for me, and my buddies around here who also engineer have zero qualms with it. It seems to do everything the way I want it done so I know I'll be happy with it, just suuuuch a bummer that I didn't buy a Profire 2626 and M-Powered to begin with, I would've saved myself at least $4k. FML.

 

[Machinated]

If I could "flatten" after flexing like when comping and see all the chopped regions and crossfades that would be a dream come true, but you can't.

as I said earlier, when you have done your edits with flex, you can right click and click "split at transient markers". this will cut the region into small regions at every marker. then you can do crossfades/further edits yourself

 

[AdamWathan]

Yeah but it doesn't show you all of the flex edited crossfades does it? Because it obviously is crossfading the splits for you already. So by adding another crossfades you are fading over another fade that is already there, so if flex puts he fade somewhere wrong and it sounds awful, you can't actually fix that automatic fade, it's there as long as the track is set to flex, it's just invisible and uneditable :/

 

[AdamWathan]

Also the split at transient thing only works for regions under 32 bars long for some weird reason.

Ed when you are selecting a section of the song to work on with flex, how are you choosing it? Like do you go by the logic bar lines or do you just go from the very beginning of one transient over to the beginning of the transient in the next section regardless of the grid? And say you are editing a verse and the last hit of the verse is early, when flex shifts it late and it overlaps the beginning of the next section do you always have to go and add a crossfades there manually since that next section isn't being flexed relative to the prior section? I wish I had logic on my computer at work so I could just play around myself but I don't unfortunately :/ I think I can get used to the flex thing but the other points still really really bug me. The drum replacement thing is sooo annoying, I can't believe there is no way to manually add or remove transient markers in that feature, especially considering there is already a GREAT transient detection/editing mode used for flex in the sample editor. Why doesn't it just use those same points?!

 

[plague_rider]

Yeah I already ordered M-Powered :/ I would rather suck it up and finally move to ProTools than screw around with anything else at this point to be honest. If PT is good enough for Sneap it's good enough for me, and my buddies around here who also engineer have zero qualms with it. It seems to do everything the way I want it done so I know I'll be happy with it, just suuuuch a bummer that I didn't buy a Profire 2626 and M-Powered to begin with, I would've saved myself at least $4k. FML.

Used alot of different DAWs over the years, always preferred pro-tools, first one i bought with one of the old M-Boxes

Used Logic alot, but to be honest i'm not a huge fan of it...

 

[xTomx]

'Honestly the panning doesn't bother me that much, I don't understand why they can't do 100 per side like every other DAW'


I may be wrong, but using the MIDI range for panning makes alot of sense when you're messing round in the Environment or the Transform window it uses MIDI in it's most basic form.

I'm doing a shitty job of explaining, search around and you'll probably find something more articulate haha.

Still, it's pretty lame you can't use 32-bit audio in Logic whatsoever unless you trick it using the freeze tool

 

[beyond dead]

dude, im tracking bands every day with logic, and it works fine. I have found ways to deal with all the issues u describe. the issue is the user, not the software. if there is a problem with the drum editing, then the tracks wernt tight enough to start with. rearranging the arrange window is a piece of cake. if the drum replacement tool doesnt pick up all the hits, compress the track, bounce it, then try again. it takes a bit of time but IMO is more practical then using Mpowered.

 

[AdamWathan]

Everything about logic so far just seems SLOW except for quick swipe comping which I do think is fantastic. I just don't see why these issues exist, there is no reason for the stuff I listed to be the way it is, it doesn't benefit anyone to behave that way, they are all just massive hinderances to an efficient workflow.

 

[greyskull]

Because it literally takes twice as long. I would still be using Reaper if that wasn't an issue for me.

The grid is the worst part, it is basically like having no grid at all. Even the grid that is there, it ONLY shows beats no matter what, sub divisions are only shown as little ticks on the ruler.

Where were all you Logic haters when I was looking to switch? Everyone only had good things to say at the time

hey we only just got opaque regions in pro tools.:Smug:

 

[AdamWathan]

...is the transparency of the regions in PT8 togglable? I am going to flip if I can't see the grid through my regions...

 

[TheWinterSnow]

See what I don't understand are all the guys saying, your just being anal, some things are about it are annoying, but just deal with it. You shouldn't have to compromise to a DAW, it should work for you and not the other way around. And even if you discover all the functions and learn how it works, if it doesn't feel right, your never going to like it. Though I do remember feeling awkwardness when moving from Noteworthy Composer to Guitar Pro, but eventually I got used to the differences and I find Guitar Pro to be easier and more logical to use, and the same applies for DAWs as well.

 

[supahd]

Adam,

You should ask some of your questions over at http://www.logicprohelp.com

 

[AdamWathan]

Will do, any questions I've asked so far though have been ignored. Much like the reaper community where anyone who does need the feature you are looking for doesn't use that DAW so no one is there to help.

Protools seems like my best bet although the take comping system looks awful compared to reaper and logic. It's just annoying that the only things I hate about Logic are things I could never even discover without buying it and trying to use it. The manual won't tell me about how the waveform isn't visibile when dragging a region for example, but it's a crucial detail for editing. The annoying thing is that you do see the waveform moving if you are editing a take in a take folder, just not on reular regions in the arrange window! (at least I think I remember seeing it there)