Survivor Final Showdown - Round One

[Vuashke]

for deliverance, every song drags ass, masters apprentices at the start, deliverance at the end, pain at the end, fair judgment all the way through. for absent friends may only have two real phrases (the diads playing over the acoustic guitar -> the lead guitar over the acoustic guitar) but i think it sounds beautiful, its very sad. whats wrong with it? is it because its not a 'proper' opeth song? just because it doesnt have growling, heavy distorted guitars and drumming doesnt make it a bad song. the lead guitar especially has a great tone

look, if you dont like any of my choices fine thats ok with me, ALOT OF PEOPLE DONT. i wouldnt have an issue with you if you didnt add that last line, as if heir apparent must be liked or something. i dont, the drum intro is slow and boring, the 'heavy' riffs are uninspired and ive heard that kind of phrasing before, i dont think the slide was done very well. the only part that i thought was great was the fingerstyle part, it sounded very evil.

im not going to pick songs as MY favourite (read: MY) just because they showcase all the elements that make opeth opeth (the heavy/soft contrast in particular)

 

[BefriendedUnit]

I voted for To Bid You Farewell. The rest of the selections seem fair as representatives of the album (except for Heir Apparent which is so good it's exempt), but not TBYF.

 

[burntoast]

so you think mike makes certain songs with the express purposes of one being better than the rest? hahahahahahahah

Right, because that's what I said, and because my opinion is identical to Mike's. Where the hell did I imply that Mike deliberately makes certain songs better than others? You need to work on your reading comprehension skills.

 

[Vuashke]

You think "For Absent Friends" is the best song off Deliverance? Are you kidding me?

i take this as meaning: fuck you, your opinion is wrong

 

[burntoast]

You still haven't explained what that has to do with Mike.

And there's really no such thing as "wrong opinion." You're entitled to your opinion, but I'm just as entitled to mine. Am I saying that I'm right? No. All I'm saying is that your choices are just baffling to me. That's all.

whats wrong with it? is it because its not a 'proper' opeth song? just because it doesnt have growling, heavy distorted guitars and drumming doesnt make it a bad song. the lead guitar especially has a great tone

im not going to pick songs as MY favourite (read: MY) just because they showcase all the elements that make opeth opeth (the heavy/soft contrast in particular

There you go making weird inferences again. When did I say that that contrast or anything you've mentioned is an obligatory factor when it comes to picking a "proper" Opeth song?

I mentioned "Burden" as an exception, and I do agree with you on Damnation (which I forgot to mention earlier). I just happen to think the other tracks you chose are fucking weak. Period.

 

[BlueSky]

ive heard that kind of phrasing before, i dont think the slide was done very well.

Where have you heard that exact phrasing before? Plus there is nothing wrong with the slide. You can have your subjective opinions, but there is nothing wrong with the slide. Period. You like to pick apart every little thing fine, but don't make up shit that holds no truth, and try to state it as fact.

 

[Vuashke]

yes there is something wrong with the slide - i dont like it

sec, looking for songs

 

[burntoast]

To be fair, saying there's something wrong with that slide is still technically his opinion. I wouldn't construe it as fact.

 

[Vuashke]

yes it does, it means its wrong for me

ok, note the low e pedal thingo in heir apparent, then listen to when, and for the part after the part in when, im certain ive heard it before on morningrise, ill check it out

ok, on white cluster, the riff underneath the solo sounds like the heir apparent thing, the e pedal point and the octaves. the difference is that the pedal is not quite so long but it still sounds similar to me

 

[BlueSky]

To be fair, saying there's something wrong with that slide is still technically his opinion. I wouldn't construe it as fact.

Wrong.

wrong Audio Help [rawng, rong] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–adjective
1. Deviating from truth or fact.

 

[burntoast]

Way to exclude the other possible meanings.

3. not correct in action, judgment, opinion, method, etc., as a person; in error:
5. out of order; awry; amiss: Something is wrong with the machine.
6. not suitable or appropriate: He always says the wrong thing.

Any of these fit with what he said.

 

[BlueSky]

There's no other meanings as wrongness abides by the rules of truth, and fact. There's no subjectiveness to it.

 

[BefriendedUnit]

"Opinion: n. a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge.

When you give your opinion on something, you offer a conclusion or a judgment that, although it may be open to question, seems true or probable to you at the time.

A view is an opinion that is affected by your personal feelings or biases, while a sentiment is a more or less settled opinion that may still be colored by emotion.

A belief differs from an opinion or a view in that it is not necessarily the creation of the person who holds it; the emphasis here is on the mental acceptance of an idea, a proposition, or a doctrine and on the assurance of its truth religious beliefs; his belief in the power of the body to heal itself).

A conviction is a firmly held and unshakable belief whose truth is not doubted she could not be swayed in her convictions), while a persuasion (in this sense) is a strong belief that is unshakable because you want to believe that it's true rather than because there is evidence proving it so she was of the persuasion that he was innocent)."

-From Apple's dictionary. An opinion cannot be wrong. If someone says "my opinion is that Blackwater Park was released in 1933", it is not an opinion, it is an untruth. If someone says "Blackwater Park brought courage and strength to the migrant workers during the dust bowl era", that is an opinion BASED on an untruth. I'm not taking sides and the argument is tl;dr for me, but there you go.

 

[Vuashke]

^ its what ive been trying to say all along

 

[burntoast]

There's no other meanings as wrongness abides by the rules of truth, and fact. There's no subjectiveness to it.

Holy shit you're hilarious. Did you even read my post? So if he said that he found the slide to not be suitable or appropriate, you'd still pounce on him for attempting to pass off his opinion as fact?

 

[BlueSky]

No, if he said, "I just don't personally like it" I'd be fine with that. But! When you state there is something wrong you're stating it as a fact. Just like when he said he's heard that phrasing before I didn't take that as an opinion obviously, and called him out on it where he as still yet to answer. Like I said he can have his opinion, but when you state things as facts then be prepared to back them up.

 

[Vuashke]

like i said before, its wrong to me

yet to answer? read my edits

but when you state things as facts how do you know i was stating it as fact? did i say it was factual? plz back up ur shit plz

 

[burntoast]

No, if he said, "I just don't personally like it" I'd be fine with that. But! When you state there is something wrong you're stating it as a fact. Just like when he said he's heard that phrasing before I didn't take that as an opinion obviously, and called him out on it where he as still yet to answer. Like I said he can have his opinion, but when you state things as facts then be prepared to back them up.

First off, you're the one who used that wording. He never initially said there was anything "wrong" with it. He said he didn't think it "was done very well."

Second, this is false (given the context):

When you state there is something wrong you're stating it as a fact.

Again, way to ignore everything I said.

I can't believe I'm defending Vuashke now.

 

[BlueSky]

As we're talking about something that pertains to a performance saying it wasn't done well means it's execution was bad obviously. It's a fairly simple concept.

 

[burntoast]

Yes, and how is that not opinion?