The End Records - Fortune Small Business article

[Wires & Waves]

how is it bullshit?

lets face it. money makes the world go round. without money, music would not exist. unless we started hand making our instruments from materials we found in the wilderness again. money is inherently linked to EVERYTHING. buying the instruments, buying the recording equipment, buy the pot that amde you write the cool riffs in the first place, buying the twinkies and hot pockets required after getting baked....
~gR~

theres been so many bands and labels that continued to exist and were happy to continue to exist merely by breaking even, theres no need for exploitative capitalist assholery in the music industry

 

[YouFoolWarrenIsDEAD]

Wow, I never thought I'd live to see the day where people would rag on a quality label like The End Records, a label that not only goes out of it's way to sign quality, intelligent bands (Lordi aside) but also has the best Metal webstore on the planet AND does it's best to promote vinyl.

 

[Jreg]

When Tower Records folded in October, The End lost a major distributor that was more friendly to indie labels than are mainstream giants Best Buy (Charts) and Wal-Mart (Charts). The fallout was immediate. "Suddenly all the big chains got very tight with their budgets," Katsambas says. Sadly, he can't count on small record stores to pick up the slack. Hundreds of those have closed in the past several years, he says, "and you don't see any new ones opening up."

This part of the article particularly caught my attention, as I've kinda wondered about the effects of Tower going under. Yeah, I know many of you are like me and didn't really shop at Tower much because of prices and such (even if there was nearby location), and some of the bigger metal labels do have other large distributors to fall back on, to a degree. But there are still lots of people I know who rely predominately on buying their music in stores. Unless all of them change that habit, that's lost income for labels like Moribund, The End or Willowtip who don't really have much in the way of another large chain outlet for making their records available.

And yeah, I see nothing wrong with getting advice for the big shots. Admittedly, there aren't a whole lot of bands on The End's roster that I'm wild about, but they've done a fine job making a name for themselves investing in some very unique bands, without going for the trendy cash grab bands. Acts like Agalloch have really started to take off in recent years, and the label wants to be able to accomodate those rises in popularity.

 

[CAIRATH]

I don't care so much about The End's roster, but they've always been one of the better metal mail-order distributions. It's funny to see the typical elitist meathead responses of people who feel that everything should be done for free. Just because your life will never amount to anything more than making 7 bucks an hour flipping burgers and putting out the trash at a greasy fastfood joint doesn't mean that everyone should "break even" and strive to make no money whatsoever. Running a business means turning a profit or die. That's how businesses work. Breaking even might work for a while, but one bad year and you're done for. Not to mention that it offers zero possibility to expand or do anything else.

If The End needs to sell shit like Slipknot records along the side in order to stay afloat or go into shitty merchandising deals then so what. Let them. As long as they continue doing what they've always been doing and offer a decent selection of underground metal for an affordable price (you Americans don't realize how lucky you are, shit at The End records costs about half of what it cost in stores here in Europe) then who fucking cares.

Don't get me wrong, I despise the music "business" when it comes to interfering with artistic integrity and artificially keeping CD prices up but none of that applies to this article whatsoever.

 

[V.V.V.V.V.]

^ Highly agree.

 

[Unfaithfully Metalhead]

I don't care so much about The End's roster, but they've always been one of the better metal mail-order distributions. It's funny to see the typical elitist meathead responses of people who feel that everything should be done for free. Just because your life will never amount to anything more than making 7 bucks an hour flipping burgers and putting out the trash at a greasy fastfood joint doesn't mean that everyone should "break even" and strive to make no money whatsoever. Running a business means turning a profit or die. That's how businesses work. Breaking even might work for a while, but one bad year and you're done for. Not to mention that it offers zero possibility to expand or do anything else.

If The End needs to sell shit like Slipknot records along the side in order to stay afloat or go into shitty merchandising deals then so what. Let them. As long as they continue doing what they've always been doing and offer a decent selection of underground metal for an affordable price (you Americans don't realize how lucky you are, shit at The End records costs about half of what it cost in stores here in Europe) then who fucking cares.

Don't get me wrong, I despise the music "business" when it comes to interfering with artistic integrity and artificially keeping CD prices up but none of that applies to this article whatsoever.

Exactly... +1 ... Break Even gets you nowhere but to fold and pack it in eventually... then the majors take over and try to whore the underground...

 

[genocide roach]

Don't get me wrong, I despise the music "business" when it comes to interfering with artistic integrity

to take it oen step further, the end is one of the few labels that promotes bands who do push the boundries of music. thats most of their roster! for that reason alone, the end gets my full support
~gR~

 

[MasterOLightning]

I don't see what the benefits of moving to NY would be. In the article at least, it was presented entirely as a negative. Any ideas why they would have moved?

 

[J.]

they have bills to pay and need to make a profit to survive... like he said expenses in NY are much higher then in other places... so I see nothing wrong with getting advice from business types from the mainstream as long as they do not compromise their original vision... but as far as marketing, distribution etc advice from these mainstream types i see nothing wrong like i said.... can't be troo all the time and go broke... if you do then all the indie labels will crash and burn and either A. The majors will release the bands or B. No one will release the bands and we won't hear bands we like.... for the labels whether its a big or small label it's first and foremost a business... yes they do it for the love of the music but to keep releasing albums they have to survive and that means turning a profit to do so...

I know where your coming from. I do.

Turning a profit is one thing. Turning to MTV mainstream types for advice on how to survive in New York is another. It seems that these advisers are giving the most blatant trendy advice one could give, which reeks of major labels. "Yeah, try to sell this crap to fans." "Infringe on merchandising rights of the bands."

Basically stuff that doesn't belong in metal. For fans, by fans.

Of course labels need to turn a profit, but that profit should in turn be put back into the label. That is the way it should be run.

I'm not picking on The End. Just wary. These non-metal signings have made me so.

BYW, rumor has it they moved to New York because of Andreas' wife's work. Just rumor. But supposedly that's why they moved to Salt Lake City as well.

 

[Unfaithfully Metalhead]

I know where your coming from. I do.

Turning a profit is one thing. Turning to MTV mainstream types for advice on how to survive in New York is another. It seems that these advisers are giving the most blatant trendy advice one could give, which reeks of major labels. "Yeah, try to sell this crap to fans." "Infringe on merchandising rights of the bands."

Basically stuff that doesn't belong in metal. For fans, by fans.

Of course labels need to turn a profit, but that profit should in turn be put back into the label. That is the way it should be run.

I'm not picking on The End. Just wary. These non-metal signings have made me so.

BYW, rumor has it they moved to New York because of Andreas' wife's work. Just rumor. But supposedly that's why they moved to Salt Lake City as well.

A means to a end... I agree that they should not do non-metal signings but perhaps if it helps them survive and used to finance the underground bands they do sign and release albums of it could do more good then harm... what the End could do is start a separate division for non-metal bands with a different name and use the profits from that to finance The End further to keep signing and releasing more metal bands... They could also make their distribution business side more bigger ala Century Media and Nuclear Blast and distribute other label's releases again for profit to finance The End... just some ideas... as for the move to NY... your probably right that it had to do with his wife or something similar or perhaps he just wanted to get out of Utah because it is mad boring there... you can't even drink there except at where the Sundance Film Festival is held in lol ... or perhaps because NY is a center of music business and connections...

btw isn't Metal Blade records fairly successful in surviving by releasing underground bands as well as non-metal bands to finance signing more metal bands? ...

 

[genocide roach]

I don't see what the benefits of moving to NY would be. In the article at least, it was presented entirely as a negative. Any ideas why they would have moved?

from a label standpoint. its probably good to move to NY. alot of the industry is there
~gR~

 

[Wires & Waves]

I don't care so much about The End's roster, but they've always been one of the better metal mail-order distributions. It's funny to see the typical elitist meathead responses of people who feel that everything should be done for free. Just because your life will never amount to anything more than making 7 bucks an hour flipping burgers and putting out the trash at a greasy fastfood joint doesn't mean that everyone should "break even" and strive to make no money whatsoever. Running a business means turning a profit or die. That's how businesses work. Breaking even might work for a while, but one bad year and you're done for. Not to mention that it offers zero possibility to expand or do anything else.

If The End needs to sell shit like Slipknot records along the side in order to stay afloat or go into shitty merchandising deals then so what. Let them. As long as they continue doing what they've always been doing and offer a decent selection of underground metal for an affordable price (you Americans don't realize how lucky you are, shit at The End records costs about half of what it cost in stores here in Europe) then who fucking cares.

Don't get me wrong, I despise the music "business" when it comes to interfering with artistic integrity and artificially keeping CD prices up but none of that applies to this article whatsoever.

so encouraging the label to start taking from a band's tour earnings is cool with you?

yes, turning a profit is necessary for a business to survive, but why are sustainable businesses necessary in the underground music scene? new bands and labels will always pop up, get tired of not making any money, quit, new ones pop up. that's how it works. who cares?

 

[genocide roach]

because the bands would suffer in the long run. if a band gets signed by a small indie label, and then the label folds, the bands career stumbles and they have to start over again. but if a band can stick with a label for multiple releases they can build a solid career
~gR~

 

[Unfaithfully Metalhead]

so encouraging the label to start taking from a band's tour earnings is cool with you?

yes, turning a profit is necessary for a business to survive, but why are sustainable businesses necessary in the underground music scene? new bands and labels will always pop up, get tired of not making any money, quit, new ones pop up. that's how it works. who cares?

So a label should provide financial tour support for a band and not recoup their expenses?

Genocide already addressed the other part of your post...

 

[murderedbysound]

I have been using The End for quite sometime and there cheap prices and free shipping is top notch. Not to many companies offer that (unless its like Christmas time or something). But I also think it has to do with the music that they do put out and promote. If they were adding rappers or pop music to their roster I bet they would get offers from the bigger players. I'm not saying to do that but that's just my two cents.

 

[challenge_everything]

I'm gonna stop using Amazon and buy from The End from now on. And I wish they would sign Anathema because I can't believe these guys have been left without a label.

 

[Wires & Waves]

because the bands would suffer in the long run. if a band gets signed by a small indie label, and then the label folds, the bands career stumbles and they have to start over again. but if a band can stick with a label for multiple releases they can build a solid career
~gR~

being in a band shouldnt be a 'career' so the point is moot

 

[skeptik]

according to a faggot in a scarf on the internet

 

[NvmbrsDoom5]

being in a band shouldnt be a 'career' so the point is moot

 

[genocide roach]

being in a band shouldnt be a 'career' so the point is moot

well, being successfull is an obvious goal of EVERY band. but thats beside the point.

the point is, a band needs a solid label for good promotion. and i dont mean flyering for local shows. real worldwide promotion is dependant on having a steady label.

bands need a label to not only help fund recordings and tours, but give them the promotion to warrant the recording or tour.
~gR~