Both Opeth and TOOL kick all amounts of ass and can never be truly duplicated. What I really love about TOOL besides the music is how they stay on the outskirts of the maintream and don't whore themselves out.
The problem with Tool
- Thread starter Cryptophile
- Start date
![[0hr]Sunlapse](/data/avatars/l/12/12972.jpg?1086073981){kind=avatar}
[0hr]Sunlapse
Wraith
I love tool, I'm not going to get into a big argument. You can despise them all you want for all I care. But you can't say they aren't creative or progressive.
KielbasaSausage
YARRRRG
IanDork107
I wrote a book! Buy it!
Jayde said:Yes.....all lyrics should be unneccesarily obtuse references to forests and death to be considered creative.
At least it's better than whiny teen angst crap.
BarronBlod
Member
TOOL is my favorite band. I saw them live at Roskilde 2 years ago, it was awesome. Who cares if they don't bang their heads or go running wild on stage.
Why do people have to start these fucking annyoing "hate-threads". Lets start a "Linkin Park sucks major ass" thread, shall we? I dislike a lot of bands myself, but I don't start pathetic patronizing talk about it just to piss people off.
And who has said that TOOL is a prog band? Lateralus may have some progressive (similar to "long" some seem to think) parts, beeing inspired by bands such as King Crimson. TOOL is an unique band, and shouldn't be labeled in anyway but rock or metal. TOOL is TOOL. Simple as that. And they are fucking great.
...and YaYo....keep those posts coming. Love em.
Why do people have to start these fucking annyoing "hate-threads". Lets start a "Linkin Park sucks major ass" thread, shall we? I dislike a lot of bands myself, but I don't start pathetic patronizing talk about it just to piss people off.
And who has said that TOOL is a prog band? Lateralus may have some progressive (similar to "long" some seem to think) parts, beeing inspired by bands such as King Crimson. TOOL is an unique band, and shouldn't be labeled in anyway but rock or metal. TOOL is TOOL. Simple as that. And they are fucking great.
...and YaYo....keep those posts coming. Love em.
LuminousAether
My name is Distance
Blah blah blah I can't stand dissenting opinions blah blah blah. Go back in your hole, little man. Did I say you could come out?
Of course, we can just settle this quite easily:
Tastes in music are entirely subjective. It's just like viewing art. However, there are some things that can be judged across the board, and in this case it's technical talent.
In terms of technical talent, Tool rates very high up on my list. Whoever said that they could replicate anything that Danny Carey could play.... here's my challenge, go listen to Eulogy and try and replicate the section where it's just drums and vocals... that's 4/4 with hi-hat opened every 3, making for a shifting pattern. Takes quite a lot of practice, let me assure you. Then you can go and play Ticks and Leeches.
As for the rest of the band, people seem to forget that in some cases less is more. This applies mainly to Tool's guitarist, who in my opinion is musically blessed, even if he isn't a very technical player. The bassist is also a much more subtle bassist... if you listen his part is mainly laying a very solid foundation for the rest of the band. Tool is very much a collective effort, not 4 guys who can play really well deciding to try and patch something together.
Maynard's lyrics (in the non-joke songs) actually have a lot of thought behind them, and if you don't catch some of the references, well, bad luck, go read some books. I'm not trying to be snobby about this, but the fact remains that to capture the meaning of the lyrics, you need to understand where Maynard is coming from. If you don't, fine. Don't buy the record.
I think that too many people hate on Tool simply because they're sick of those "hardcore" Tool fans who are intent on cramming Tool down people's throats. What they forget is that many of those fans are just like pop fans - Tool is the new "underground" trend to make you look as if you actually know something about music, despite the fact that many of those "hardcore" fans wouldn't recognise a 7/4 rhythm if it hit them in the face. They're just in the process of hopping bandwagons, we're hoping they'll be gone by the next album.
So yeah, basically if you want to rag on Tool on technical grounds, you really need to check your facts. Danny Carey is cited by many respected drummers who are both in and out of the metal scene as an influence, simply because of his phenomenal work on odd time signatures and polyrhythms. Adam Jones is cited as an influence because he has one of the nicest guitar sounds, and has been able to consistently produce riffs that are simple, yet still possess a strange technical quality. I don't think you can hate on Tool technically. But if you don't like their music, that's fine. No-one forced you to listen.
Tastes in music are entirely subjective. It's just like viewing art. However, there are some things that can be judged across the board, and in this case it's technical talent.
In terms of technical talent, Tool rates very high up on my list. Whoever said that they could replicate anything that Danny Carey could play.... here's my challenge, go listen to Eulogy and try and replicate the section where it's just drums and vocals... that's 4/4 with hi-hat opened every 3, making for a shifting pattern. Takes quite a lot of practice, let me assure you. Then you can go and play Ticks and Leeches.
As for the rest of the band, people seem to forget that in some cases less is more. This applies mainly to Tool's guitarist, who in my opinion is musically blessed, even if he isn't a very technical player. The bassist is also a much more subtle bassist... if you listen his part is mainly laying a very solid foundation for the rest of the band. Tool is very much a collective effort, not 4 guys who can play really well deciding to try and patch something together.
Maynard's lyrics (in the non-joke songs) actually have a lot of thought behind them, and if you don't catch some of the references, well, bad luck, go read some books. I'm not trying to be snobby about this, but the fact remains that to capture the meaning of the lyrics, you need to understand where Maynard is coming from. If you don't, fine. Don't buy the record.
I think that too many people hate on Tool simply because they're sick of those "hardcore" Tool fans who are intent on cramming Tool down people's throats. What they forget is that many of those fans are just like pop fans - Tool is the new "underground" trend to make you look as if you actually know something about music, despite the fact that many of those "hardcore" fans wouldn't recognise a 7/4 rhythm if it hit them in the face. They're just in the process of hopping bandwagons, we're hoping they'll be gone by the next album.
So yeah, basically if you want to rag on Tool on technical grounds, you really need to check your facts. Danny Carey is cited by many respected drummers who are both in and out of the metal scene as an influence, simply because of his phenomenal work on odd time signatures and polyrhythms. Adam Jones is cited as an influence because he has one of the nicest guitar sounds, and has been able to consistently produce riffs that are simple, yet still possess a strange technical quality. I don't think you can hate on Tool technically. But if you don't like their music, that's fine. No-one forced you to listen.
Wandering Third Eye
Open your eye.
Tool is a much deeper band than most people are ready to get into. Every lyric written and every image used in videos, album art, etc....has some type of revelance. Study up on reincarnation and you will begin to understand alot of the meanings behind the songs.
FluffyDonkey
Ride The Spiral.
Fortunesmith
Put it in your mouth!
Just because you might not like something, doesn't mean it isn't any good.
That being said, I think that Tool sucks. I saw them live twice. Once about a 2 years before they released Undertow at a $7 show in Buffalo. They were booed unmercifully for their enitre set (which was about an hour and a half!) Bad first impression. Then I saw them at Ozzfest in '99. They were incoherently bad. They will get no third chance from me, as I think their studio stuff is boring and as hell as well. Their songs just seem to meander along. You won't ever hear me mistaking them for a progressive band. Their songs progress absolutely nowhere; never can quite hit the mark. Doesn't do it for me, never will.
That being said, I think that Tool sucks. I saw them live twice. Once about a 2 years before they released Undertow at a $7 show in Buffalo. They were booed unmercifully for their enitre set (which was about an hour and a half!) Bad first impression. Then I saw them at Ozzfest in '99. They were incoherently bad. They will get no third chance from me, as I think their studio stuff is boring and as hell as well. Their songs just seem to meander along. You won't ever hear me mistaking them for a progressive band. Their songs progress absolutely nowhere; never can quite hit the mark. Doesn't do it for me, never will.
KielbasaSausage
YARRRRG
Wandering Third Eye said:
You have to understand Buddhist teachings in order to understand the music?
TheLordofGuitars
Member
Cryptophile said:
Most ignorant thing i've ever read in my life, seriously at least know something about a band before trying to make "logical" opinions on them. Tool will kick your fucking ass and I think they're the greatest band out there right now. If you can find anyone who sings like Maynard or plays drums better than Danny Carey i'll be shocked. Fuck you buddy! :hotjump:
Bleakest Harvest
\m/Misanthropic Hippy\m/
In the same way that Bill Bruford is 100000x more inventive and creative than the Tool drummer
Although I do think that the drumming in Tool is excellent
Bleakest Harvest
\m/Misanthropic Hippy\m/
I agree with you there for the most part Static, some people seem to think that Tool are some kind of prog messiahs or something, when even they themselves have admitted they have blatantly ripped off King Crimson in the past.
Although I wouldn't agree with you about Maudlin Of The Well, I think they're way overrated to be honest. They have tons of potential though.
Replace MOTW in your post with KC, and then you have win
Wandering Third Eye
Open your eye.
KielbasaSausage said:You have to understand Buddhist teachings in order to understand the music?
Not the music but the lyrics and meaning behind them. Someone said earlier the lyrics made no sense. They do you just have to know a little about what they are talking about.
dygi
prestidygitator
Message to all people who think that Danny Carey isn't a great drummer : Go to http://www.futation.net and download the song called "Triad" from concert in Oklahoma! It's 1000x better than studio version!
Bleakest Harvest
\m/Misanthropic Hippy\m/
You'd have to be a total cuntarse not to realise Carey's drumming ability. In fact, we should all be thankful of him as he is one of the very few drummers in mainstream music who is any good.
But everyone should go and download king crimson - one more red nightmare
the drumming in that song, by none other than the mighty Bill Bruford is simply awesome.
But everyone should go and download king crimson - one more red nightmare
the drumming in that song, by none other than the mighty Bill Bruford is simply awesome.
scorpian007
\m/
Tool are a great band, I don't know what the fuck is some peoples problem with them. But yeah, Opeth is the best by far
