There is a lot of debate over which band was the first Black Metal Band. Venom certainly coined the title Black Metal, and they were the first band to really go over the top with the occult references. Celtic Frost certainly contributed to the genre as well. Tom G. Warrior had some face paint and the guttural vocals. His previous band Hellhammer had some occult references and some Lo-Fi production that traditional black metal is famous for. Then there is Bathory. Some regard Under the sign of the Black Mark as the best Black Metal album of all time. Mercyful fate wasn't musically considered Black Metal, But I am sure King Diamond inspired the second wave of Black Metal Norwegian bands with his corpse paint and satanic lyrics. What do you think?
Who Started Black Metal?
- Thread starter Jonnyrotten2013
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SomeGuyDude
My name is sorrow.
- Apr 26, 2011
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It's really hard to say exactly. I mean, bands like Bathory, Hellhammer, and Venom all started that idea, but they were MUCH closer to thrash or punk than what later became "black metal". I mean, if you ask me, who "started" it means one of two things: who knocked down the first domino, or who laid down the sonic template. If it's the first, then it's Venom and Hellhammer. If we're talking about the latter, then it's the first wave of Norwegian bands.
When we say "black metal" today, we're talking about the sound that was nailed by everyone in Euronymous's "Black Circle". That's black metal as a sound. An album from 2014 is completely built upon the blueprint laid down in 1990, not 1983.
When we say "black metal" today, we're talking about the sound that was nailed by everyone in Euronymous's "Black Circle". That's black metal as a sound. An album from 2014 is completely built upon the blueprint laid down in 1990, not 1983.
romanticism
New Metal Member
- Jan 8, 2014
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Venom, Hellhammer, or Bathory. Depends on your perspective. There isn't really one objective answer.
Edit: However, contrary to SomeGuyDude's post, the latest possible answer is Bathory. Black metal is not defined today by the second wave. Countless bands still celebrate the first wave tradition.
Edit: However, contrary to SomeGuyDude's post, the latest possible answer is Bathory. Black metal is not defined today by the second wave. Countless bands still celebrate the first wave tradition.
crimsonfloyd
Active Member
Bathory.
Venom isn't black metal in any contemporarily meaningful sense of the term and Hellhammer really isn't black metal either. On the other hand, I think everyone can agree that Under the Sign of the Black Mark is black metal.
Venom isn't black metal in any contemporarily meaningful sense of the term and Hellhammer really isn't black metal either. On the other hand, I think everyone can agree that Under the Sign of the Black Mark is black metal.
Krow
Garbage Connoisseur
romanticism
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Like I said: Venom, Hellhammer, or Bathory - depending on your perspective. No use being close-minded about it; there's fair arguments either way. Bathory is the first undeniably black metal band, but that doesn't make certain valid opinions, you know...invalid or anything like that.
crimsonfloyd
Active Member
Well I guess it also depends on whether the question is "who started black metal?" or "who was the first black metal band?". The answer to the first question is ambiguous because you can make a case bands like Venom and Hellhammer started black metal without being a fully black metal band. However, if the question is who is the first band to qualify as black metal, then the answer is without a doubt Bathory.
~Neurotica
perfectly insane
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Krow
Garbage Connoisseur
I can almost deal with Venom being called black metal but there is no fucking way Mercyful Fate is anything but traditional heavy metal.
clschniffer
New Metal Member
~Neurotica
perfectly insane
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Well, basically it is thm and Venom is traditional thrash metal. But the thing is that BM is pretty much the only genre in metal that has became special not with its music technically, but by the visual style and image, lyrics, theatric performance during playing live and the whole satan anti-christian propaganda.
If you would judge only by the music - then yeah, it's probably Bathory, then Burzum and so on. All kvlt oldschool jerks would still base their opinion in the ideology point, and I'm one of them, I'm afraid.
clschniffer
New Metal Member
The only ideology behind black metal is that you have to be good enough at convincing others that your misrable life is entirely ruled by your devotion to a certain horned god but then you go shopping at walmart.
~Neurotica
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clschniffer
New Metal Member
How rude! They don't need no pads for blood after all the fucking each others in the butt sessions
~Neurotica
perfectly insane
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seems like you know what you're talking about!
clschniffer
New Metal Member
I have been listening to black metal quite a bit, got to know all the players. Let me tell you they all spend way too much of efforts trying to rule the booze, fitting the dressing code and following the rules of a cult that is a complete joke in the first place. The more serious the harder the fall!
~Neurotica
perfectly insane
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Yeah, I kinda agree. At least 99% of them... The tr00 bm audience is also pretty much fucked up in my opinion, with their stupid impossible demnands and strange ambitions and complete closed mind, also seems like they never grow up. They appreciate more of your circus and the crap you give them on your promo pics and shows than actual music. One of the reasons I barely listen to bm nowadays - I don't like circus.
clschniffer
New Metal Member
Strangely the pagan wave has always been the worse for me, talking big on past traditions, warriors and dragons and lines stolen straight out of history books from things they've never actually experienced themselves... Those are the ones I avoid at all cost, they have an opinion about anything and everything, politics and art, economics and justice, and they want to be heard!
~Neurotica
perfectly insane
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romanticism
New Metal Member
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This is a better way to words your views, yes. And for the record, I think I agree with you. But I still think that a fair argument can be made for Venom (purely a theatrical/aesthetic/vision/etc issue) or Hellhammer (Venom-esque but truly departing from the trappings of the NWoBHM/arena rock/etc).
If someone is going to downright insist that they have full knowledge of the trends behind black metal, I would rather they play on the safe side at the least and talk about Bathory. The only thing Neurotica ever contributed to this board was physical attractiveness.
