Writing Songs for Guitar

[Botfly]

I didn't start learning scales until after I had written 2 full-length albums. I still only know the basic scales, and I know them as shapes and what key they start in rather than what scale they are. But the thing is, I was good at writing music and improvising solos before I even knew what a scale was. Since I learned the scales it has actually limited my solo improv skills because I tend to try to stick to a scale instead of just focusing on the sound. Yes, screw the scales, FOCUS ON THE SOUND. That's the most important thing any musician will ever tell you. I've made a chord progression that used all dischords, I don't even think they were in a scale, but it was awesome because it sounded right, had a cool melody and a nice lead overtop, and some good low grunts.

I always get asked about my musical theory, and Jinn told me I know theory, since I can write an awesome song in just one day and it takes him weeks.... but I never tried to learn theory and I honestly don't even know what theory is. I guess I was born with it. :-\ I honestly believe musicians like Jari Maenpaa, and other multi-instrumentalists that like almost have to be born with theory or at least it develops super-easy. Or maybe this whole thing is just a matter of creativity and experimentation, I don't know. I can even write stuff just using a keyboard now, and despite the goofiness, I can even do vocal layers and harmonies... well, kinda. Learning how to sing is a whole differen't thing in it's own.

But other than that advice, really, if you want to learn a Metal Scale, then learn E Minor. Record yourself playing E Minor into the computer, and set it to repeat in Winamp or something, and then just keep solo'ing and solo'ing and figure out what notes sound right in E minor until you've got it figured out. Use slides a lot, I did all that when I started out. I usually just use slides to get a cool sound now, though. But if you're like Jimi Hendrix, you'll need to use slides and bends to get the right note because you can't friggin' hit it right off the bat. ^_^

After you've learned E minor, learn A minor. Same basic shape, just up one string and you add an extra note there.. check a chord diagram or something because I really can't explain chords over the net in text. Learn E minor, E Major, A Minor, A Major, D minor, and D major... and then you can move them all over the fretboard. Then you'll know what 20% of all metal musicians use, the other 60% use basic powerchords, and the other 20% use large chords and dischords like Opeth used to do.

Always stay in E Standard. Downtuning is for people who can't make decent riffs in E Standard.

Ladies and Gentlemen, perhaps what might be the most ignorant and idiotic advice ever given. btw, your music blows.

Something more useful: scale formulas and scales.

important terms:

half steps: notes right next to eachother (ex: G and G#, E and F, B and C)
wholesteps: notes seperated by sharps, flats, or halfsteps.

below, halfsteps = "[number]&[number]", wholesteps ="[number], [number]" and then TNS's (two note seperations i.e. from E to G or skipping two frets) are "[number]^[number]"

pentatonic scale: no half steps, consists of 5 notes (hence "penta")
1^2, 3, 4^5, 6 (ex: E-G-A-B-D-E)

Blues Scale: 1^2, 3&4&5^6 (ex: G-A#-C-C#-D-F-G)

Minor scale: 1, 2&3, 4, 5&6, 7, 8 (ex: E-F#-G-A-B-C-D-E)

Major scale: 1, 2, 3&4, 5, 6, 7&8 (ex: E-F#-G#-A-B-C#-D#-E)

Harmonic Minor: 1, 2&3, 4, 5&6^7&8. (ex: D-E-F-G-A-A#-C#-D)

Symmetrical/Augmented Scale: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 (ex: C-D-E-F#-G#-A#-C)

Symmetrical/Dimished Scale: 1^2^3^4^5 (ex: E-G-A#-C#-E)

Chromatic Scale: Basically every single note. (ex: C-C#-D-D#-E-F-G-G#-A-A#-B-C)


So here you have it, the basic and essential scales you need to know.

 

[affinityband]

The best parts of Oinks amazing speech is in my sig. Where it shall remain forever. Brilliance.

 

[all_sins_undone]

oinkness is a god imo and i think iyo iirc...

 

[the_drip]

I didn't start learning scales until after I had written 2 full-length albums. I still only know the basic scales, and I know them as shapes and what key they start in rather than what scale they are. But the thing is, I was good at writing music and improvising solos before I even knew what a scale was. Since I learned the scales it has actually limited my solo improv skills because I tend to try to stick to a scale instead of just focusing on the sound. Yes, screw the scales, FOCUS ON THE SOUND. That's the most important thing any musician will ever tell you. I've made a chord progression that used all dischords, I don't even think they were in a scale, but it was awesome because it sounded right, had a cool melody and a nice lead overtop, and some good low grunts.

I always get asked about my musical theory, and Jinn told me I know theory, since I can write an awesome song in just one day and it takes him weeks.... but I never tried to learn theory and I honestly don't even know what theory is. I guess I was born with it. :-\ I honestly believe musicians like Jari Maenpaa, and other multi-instrumentalists that like almost have to be born with theory or at least it develops super-easy. Or maybe this whole thing is just a matter of creativity and experimentation, I don't know. I can even write stuff just using a keyboard now, and despite the goofiness, I can even do vocal layers and harmonies... well, kinda. Learning how to sing is a whole differen't thing in it's own.

But other than that advice, really, if you want to learn a Metal Scale, then learn E Minor. Record yourself playing E Minor into the computer, and set it to repeat in Winamp or something, and then just keep solo'ing and solo'ing and figure out what notes sound right in E minor until you've got it figured out. Use slides a lot, I did all that when I started out. I usually just use slides to get a cool sound now, though. But if you're like Jimi Hendrix, you'll need to use slides and bends to get the right note because you can't friggin' hit it right off the bat. ^_^

After you've learned E minor, learn A minor. Same basic shape, just up one string and you add an extra note there.. check a chord diagram or something because I really can't explain chords over the net in text. Learn E minor, E Major, A Minor, A Major, D minor, and D major... and then you can move them all over the fretboard. Then you'll know what 20% of all metal musicians use, the other 60% use basic powerchords, and the other 20% use large chords and dischords like Opeth used to do.

Always stay in E Standard. Downtuning is for people who can't make decent riffs in E Standard.

sorry but you've never been good at writing anything. dont' sing your own praises plz.

 

[FRUGiHOYi]

I didn't start learning scales until after I had written 2 full-length albums. I still only know the basic scales, and I know them as shapes and what key they start in rather than what scale they are. But the thing is, I was good at writing music and improvising solos before I even knew what a scale was. Since I learned the scales it has actually limited my solo improv skills because I tend to try to stick to a scale instead of just focusing on the sound. Yes, screw the scales, FOCUS ON THE SOUND. That's the most important thing any musician will ever tell you. I've made a chord progression that used all dischords, I don't even think they were in a scale, but it was awesome because it sounded right, had a cool melody and a nice lead overtop, and some good low grunts.

I always get asked about my musical theory, and Jinn told me I know theory, since I can write an awesome song in just one day and it takes him weeks.... but I never tried to learn theory and I honestly don't even know what theory is. I guess I was born with it. :-\ I honestly believe musicians like Jari Maenpaa, and other multi-instrumentalists that like almost have to be born with theory or at least it develops super-easy. Or maybe this whole thing is just a matter of creativity and experimentation, I don't know. I can even write stuff just using a keyboard now, and despite the goofiness, I can even do vocal layers and harmonies... well, kinda. Learning how to sing is a whole differen't thing in it's own.

But other than that advice, really, if you want to learn a Metal Scale, then learn E Minor. Record yourself playing E Minor into the computer, and set it to repeat in Winamp or something, and then just keep solo'ing and solo'ing and figure out what notes sound right in E minor until you've got it figured out. Use slides a lot, I did all that when I started out. I usually just use slides to get a cool sound now, though. But if you're like Jimi Hendrix, you'll need to use slides and bends to get the right note because you can't friggin' hit it right off the bat. ^_^

After you've learned E minor, learn A minor. Same basic shape, just up one string and you add an extra note there.. check a chord diagram or something because I really can't explain chords over the net in text. Learn E minor, E Major, A Minor, A Major, D minor, and D major... and then you can move them all over the fretboard. Then you'll know what 20% of all metal musicians use, the other 60% use basic powerchords, and the other 20% use large chords and dischords like Opeth used to do.

Always stay in E Standard. Downtuning is for people who can't make decent riffs in E Standard.

lol your second link sounds like something from katamari

 

[Rock Hydra]

Always stay in E Standard. Downtuning is for people who can't make decent riffs in E Standard.

After saying all that and saying this ^^ is arrogant and ignorant.

 

[affinityband]

To be honest, most of the stuff he says he just makes up and assumes things. Ignorance is #1.

 

[affinityband]

lol your second link sounds like something from katamari

He should try using a metronome and not ripping off the harlequinn forest melody too.

 

[BrandonS]

Laugh all you want, but I'm pretty sure none of you have even written anything nearly as good as my stuff. And until then you don't have a right to laugh. So ignore that first statement about laughing all you want.

I'm not familiar with Katamari, and that sounds nothing like anything in Harlequin Forest. Actually Harlequin Forest may be my most hated track from Ghost Reveries, so congratulations on your stupidity again. I made the vocal layered track as a joke for a friend, I was just posting it as an example, so screw you. It's called Crazy Song 1, not Serious Song 1.

Downtuning such as drop D is for people who suck at making decent riffs and just want quick powerchords. Some of the heaviest stuff I've ever heard was written in E standard, and if you're a beginner guitarist it's not wise to leave E Standard. That is, after all, the purpose of this thread. Not to display belligerence.

And if you think that first quote is funny, then you must really, really suck as a musician. If you have any talent at all you can hear the instrument and be able to tell what fits together to form chords and be able to improvise solos. That's what, 2 years of 1-hour-a-day practice? Someone who doesn't limit theirself to scales can go beyond scales. Laughing at other musicians for not going by the book and making pedantic crap is possibly the most defeatist attitude you could have.

Also I find this ammusing...

ignorant

ignorance

ignorance

Learn some new adjectives, people.
...And discover context.

 

[:Wreath:]

Downtuning such as drop D is for people who suck at making decent riffs and just want quick powerchords. Some of the heaviest stuff I've ever heard was written in E standard, and if you're a beginner guitarist it's not wise to leave E Standard. That is, after all, the purpose of this thread. Not to display belligerence.

And if you think that first quote is funny, then you must really, really suck as a musician. If you have any talent at all you can hear the instrument and be able to tell what fits together to form chords and be able to improvise solos. That's what, 2 years of 1-hour-a-day practice? Someone who doesn't limit theirself to scales can go beyond scales. Laughing at other musicians for not going by the book and making pedantic crap is possibly the most defeatist attitude you could have.

Opeth used droped D, so they must absolutely suck at writing riffs don't they? :Smug:

And after listening to your stuff, I can tell you one thing: you should've learned the damn scales...

Your skills are not about the quantity of the material, be it 2, 3 or 10 albums... It's about quality :Smug:

 

[affinityband]

Laugh all you want, but I'm pretty sure none of you have even written anything nearly as good as my stuff. And until then you don't have a right to laugh. So ignore that first statement about laughing all you want.

I'm not familiar with Katamari, and that sounds nothing like anything in Harlequin Forest. Actually Harlequin Forest may be my most hated track from Ghost Reveries, so congratulations on your stupidity again. I made the vocal layered track as a joke for a friend, I was just posting it as an example, so screw you. It's called Crazy Song 1, not Serious Song 1.

Downtuning such as drop D is for people who suck at making decent riffs and just want quick powerchords. Some of the heaviest stuff I've ever heard was written in E standard, and if you're a beginner guitarist it's not wise to leave E Standard. That is, after all, the purpose of this thread. Not to display belligerence.

And if you think that first quote is funny, then you must really, really suck as a musician. If you have any talent at all you can hear the instrument and be able to tell what fits together to form chords and be able to improvise solos. That's what, 2 years of 1-hour-a-day practice? Someone who doesn't limit theirself to scales can go beyond scales. Laughing at other musicians for not going by the book and making pedantic crap is possibly the most defeatist attitude you could have.

Also I find this ammusing...







Learn some new adjectives, people.
...And discover context.

1st Paragraph: First things first Oinkness, your music is an abortion it always has been. Many People on this forum have written better things than you have, Frugihoyi for a start, and cuntface with his death metal tracks. Your the only person ive ever seen thats kissed his own ass with so much passion.

2nd Paragraph: While you may not have intentionally made that heap of shite to sound like the vocal melody in the main acoustic passage of Harlequinn forest, it does. Not to mention all the voices are out of time/sync use a metronome for godsake one of the basic things anyone whos recording a song should do, yet you still sing your own praises.

3rd Paragraph: Again down to being niave, Different tunings are used for different types of music. Drop D tuning is WIDLY used in Blues and country,folk music.Droped D is also excellent for slide guitar tunes(especially DADGAD). Also lol@ you thinking that a powerchord in a standard tuning is really anymore difficult and anymore necesary than doing it in Drop D. Get out.

4th Paragraph:

And if you think that first quote is funny, then you must really, really suck as a musician. If you have any talent at all you can hear the instrument and be able to tell what fits together to form chords and be able to improvise solos. That's what, 2 years of 1-hour-a-day practice? Someone who doesn't limit theirself to scales can go beyond scales. Laughing at other musicians for not going by the book and making pedantic crap is possibly the most defeatist attitude you could have.

This is an absoloutley stunning bit of Writing here Oink, truly magnificent and it does take your own delusions to a new level. You think that all your heros dont use scales in their solos? You seem to be under the impression that Scales are for suckers. without these groups of notes you would be nowhere. You defeatist attitude has led you to dismiss musical theory. But to be honest there Oink your music would hugely benefit even a smigein of Music Theory.

And finally for the quotes: ignorant, unaware, oblivious, unmindful,neglectful, uninformed, naive.
Now, these are a few words that share the same basic principle. But i think overall the forum decided to go for the 'ignorant' statement to sum you up. Its pretty much a global meaning for you Oinkness. You just make up all these things in your head and then claim your excellence.
Anyway, to sum it up...Pwned.

 

[Botfly]

Laugh all you want, but I'm pretty sure none of you have even written anything nearly as good as my stuff. And until then you don't have a right to laugh. So ignore that first statement about laughing all you want.

I'm not familiar with Katamari, and that sounds nothing like anything in Harlequin Forest. Actually Harlequin Forest may be my most hated track from Ghost Reveries, so congratulations on your stupidity again. I made the vocal layered track as a joke for a friend, I was just posting it as an example, so screw you. It's called Crazy Song 1, not Serious Song 1.

Downtuning such as drop D is for people who suck at making decent riffs and just want quick powerchords. Some of the heaviest stuff I've ever heard was written in E standard, and if you're a beginner guitarist it's not wise to leave E Standard. That is, after all, the purpose of this thread. Not to display belligerence.

And if you think that first quote is funny, then you must really, really suck as a musician. If you have any talent at all you can hear the instrument and be able to tell what fits together to form chords and be able to improvise solos. That's what, 2 years of 1-hour-a-day practice? Someone who doesn't limit theirself to scales can go beyond scales. Laughing at other musicians for not going by the book and making pedantic crap is possibly the most defeatist attitude you could have.

Also I find this ammusing...







Learn some new adjectives, people.
...And discover context.

LOL! You don't understand anything, do you?

For one, saying "knowing scales is dumb because it limits creativity" is so rediculously absured, that if I ever saw you on the streets, I'd rape you. Perhaps it's because you're still completely naive to this whole "playing an instrument" thing, but scales are just a way to universally organize a sequence of notes so musicians can communicate them logically. They're certainly not "guidelines" as you put them, although since your musically retarded, you can't help but confine yourself to a scale because of how much you limit yourself in the first place (because when you play what seems like random, creative scales, it actually can be musically defined).

K, let's say you're in a band (with other people, not just yourself iirc), and you want to do something like harmonize a lead for example, you can tell your guitarist buddy that you're playing in such and such scale rather than "idk, just a random set of notes that sound good together."

The ironic thing is that you say that knowing scales limits you, when in all actuallity your limiting yourself as a musician by not knowing what the fuck your doing. The irony piles on folks...

Someone who doesn't limit theirself to scales can go beyond scales

Someone who doesn't limit theirselves to standard tuning can go beyond tuning. Hypocrite.

downtuning to drop D is for people who want to play quick power chords

LOL, maybe it's just me, but when I listen to Demon of the Fall, it seems like there's alot more going on than just "quick power chords."

And if you think that first quote is funny, then you must really, really suck as a musician. If you have any talent at all you can hear the instrument and be able to tell what fits together to form chords and be able to improvise solos.

Completely subjective and dumb. To say someone's not talented because they're not as stubborn as you to figure out a chord by what "sounds right" (through trial and error I'm sure), as opposed learning some theory on how notes work to form a chord (and on top of that know the name of that chord) and skip all that trouble of trial and error and guessing is failed logic.

I actually took the time to listen to all your shitty music. You go on about creativity blah blah blah... well, whilst listening to your music, I discovered you haven't done anything beyond playing in minor or major scales with key changes. Your music is also quite simplistic and boring. So basically, you go on about how "evil" music theory is and how it limits you, yet you write stuff that is within basic music theory. My point is if you learned a little more theory, you'll know what you're playing as opposed to not knowing what you're playing and thinking you're being creative.

so do you see why everyone has used that same "adjective" to describe you? imho, it's because you're a fucking dunce.

Goodnight.

 

[Botfly]

didn't see u post that affinity, good werk. double pwn't tbh

 

[Opethian666]

That was some mighty pwnage tbh.

 

[affinityband]

didn't see u post that affinity, good werk. double pwn't tbh

imo hes gay lulz

 

[Opethian666]

Btw I am usually not one to jump on one person that everybody's attacking, I try to look at things from a clear objective perspective, but you really have no right to be arrogant about this oinkness. I've listened to several songs from both Rainwound and Satanic Dirge, and nothing I heard there convinved me that you even have an average talent for composing music or playing the guitar. I'm not saying you should not continue making your music, but being arrogant over something as petty as what you've accomplished so far is truly ridiculous. Hell, I don't consider myself an extraordinary guitarist in the least, but everything I've heard from you so far I probably had the necessary skill to play after less than half a year of playing the guitar.

 

[Heckelgruber]

I guess the stupidity of Oinkness' advice has been thoroughly established (as if it even required comment - )! If the Global Village of the Internet has an idiot, it is Oinkness.

One thing I kind of struggle with is going from exercises, which can be hard to make fun and can be very frustrating to turning them into something. So I often end up just learning other peoples' stuff.

 

[metal_wrath]

One thing I kind of struggle with is going from exercises, which can be hard to make fun and can be very frustrating to turning them into something. So I often end up just learning other peoples' stuff.

me too

I am currently learning Hours of Wealth, which is going very well, I have learned most of the song and am working on the solo. 'Tis probably the most fun you can have on guitar, especially learning such a brilliant song.

 

[all_sins_undone]

lmao... HoW is the most fun you can have on guitar...

 

[affinityband]

To be fair the solo is quite a fun one to play.