A few thoughts on the evolution of metal.

[waif]

ah
ok.

 

[BlackMetalWhiteGuy]

All of my music is MIDI.

 

[waif]

And I'm telling you that most of it would sound better with real instruments. Especially Overture. Would sound way better with real guitar, drums, and bass. And a better synth, but w/e.

 

[mutantllama]

It seems like that we are now improving the sub genres and being influenced by some of the originators of it.

 

[Zephyrus]

I disagree with you on the fundamentals here. Where do you hear lots of new bands including non-metal influences? The great majority of new bands/new albums are very much strictly metal with very little crossover appeal to rock/whatever fans. Just because some bands are utilizing industrial, folk, shoegaze etc influences doesn't mean it is "more and more"...it might be more obvious because those bands get more publicity for avant-garde or whatever...

And I know it's been mature for a few decades, but we (as humans) have been mature(ish) for about a decade now and yet there's a lot for us to do and look forward to doing despite every day seeming similar in some ways and I think of metal in the same way, with a very human/organic pattern of evolution. In this sense, I think metal is very much "just beginning." Of course it will never be exactly how it used to be and I think this is where you're partially correct, but I believe it's pretty natural.

Of course there will be bands playing the same old stuff for decades to come. I was talking purely in terms of innovations and original concepts of metal that are currently developing. I never intended to say that metal as it was and is will simply fade away, I'm just saying that any further innovations within the metal genre are grinding to a halt.

What I'm saying is that most bands playing truer forms of metal do not represent where metal is going; they represent where metal has been.

 

[waif]

The sub genres are become full-fledged genres and developing their own sub genres.
Also, now that there's a wide variety of musical categories, lyrical topics are becoming more important. For example, pirate metal and viking metal.

 

[Zephyrus]

The sub genres are become full-fledged genres and developing their own sub genres.
Also, now that there's a wide variety of musical categories, lyrical topics are becoming more important. For example, pirate metal and viking metal.

Lyrical themes shouldn't by any means be considered musical innovations, which is the focus of this discussion. I think it's great that metal's lyrical content is broadening its horizons, but that cannot speak at all for what really matters.

 

[waif]

The topic is the evolution of metal, not necessarily the music.

But yeah, the music...keyboards are becoming a more prominent instrument. Not sure if that's a good or bad thing.

 

[Vegard Pompey]

An instrument in itself is not a good or a bad thing. All instruments that I know of sound good when properly used.

 

[Zephyrus]

Keyboards have been fully incorporated in metal since the late 90's. What I see now is a greater variety in synthetic sounds built into songs.

 

[Alter]

Think about this, though: the defining qualities of each subgenre, the respective essence of extremity of each, their very raisons d'etre, have been amplified/exaggerated by successive generations of bands to the point where they can't be anymore. Think of extremity like a volume knob: you can only twist it to the right so far before you twist the knob off completely and the music becomes a putrid, gelatinous mass that doesn't even make sense anymore. This can be applied to death, black, doom, grind, whatever.

Grindcore can only get so fast (Agoraphobic nosebleed, electronically-inclined goregrind like Lymphatic Phlegm) before it's just an unlistenable blur, before it turns into sheer noise.

Black metal can only be so abrasive (Leviathan, early Darkthrone/Mayhem) before it's just a twisted, hissing mass of, yet again, sheer noise.

Death metal can only get so heavy (Mortician, "brutal" death metal like Disgorge) before the strings literally droop off of the guitars, completely unplayable, the music completely indecipherable.

Finally:
Doom metal can only be played so slowly (early Sunn O))), Skepticism) before it, too, becomes pointless and essentially a caricature of itself.

You see where I'm going with this? Subgenres are almost, if they're not already, at that point. The only thing left to do is a sideways crab walk.

Here's to hoping you're right and I'm wrong.

Interesting but what you you are not pointing out is that metal is moving into area of where the sound is being pushed in areas no other bands have done.

Grindcore-Ghengis Tron have been making music that fuses grindcore with keyboard based lines. The songs still retain the same grindcore passion but they have moved it into something much more real and interesting that not much people have seen since Scum.


Black Metal-Bands like Peste Noire,Nachtmystium and Blut Aus Nord are all doing things that set them apart by doing things that no one else has done and it is paying off. Even Leviathan is doing things that makes his music sound different compared to boring 90's worship bands such as Crebain or Bahimiron, and not mention established acts such as Dark Funeral or Markduk who write the same record over and over again.



Post-Metal-This is one to watch. Labels like Hydra Head and Southern Lord are putting out cutting edge metal that takes the basic metal formula and pushes it WAY beyond the expected norms. This genre will puts black metal,doom metal, drone metal, thrash, death metal and hardcore into a mixing pot with even more genres and this creates a endless limit of creative possibilities.

 

[waif]

post-metal sounds cool. If you could link to the myspaces of a couple bands it would be nice.

 

[Zephyrus]

I think HaggardBastard's post was concerning extremity, mainly. But you seem to disagree on where to draw the line in the pushing of genre-boundaries. Some will set limits to how far you can go, and thus bands that innovate past those limits are no longer metal. Others will expand the definitions of what they consider metal in order to accommodate such innovating bands.

For me personally, the line I draw is a band-by-band question. I cannot set over-arching limits to what is and isn't metal.

 

[V.V.V.V.V.]

What I'm saying is that most bands playing truer forms of metal do not represent where metal is going; they represent where metal has been.

What? There is no such thing as a "truer" form of metal than another. To think that way is to condemn modern developments as outgrowths, cancers which render themselves "false" just by being different. I don't think you mean to imply such a thing, but you sort of did. There are plenty of bands combining subtle influences from various styles (Dead Congregation comes to mind; modern Greek death metal focusing on a sound combining Immolation/Incantation influences with a more "brutal" and even still "old-school" approach which is pretty rare to hear all in one band who doesn't sound like crap). I don't think innovations are grinding to a halt either; even if you don't respect/understand a lot of the innovations happening in metal now, you can't say they don't/won't exist.

 

[Zephyrus]

There seems to be a misunderstanding. When I say "truer" forms of metal, I am mocking elitism. I fully embrace metal's future path. I just feel that the controversy will continue to rage over whether further innovations in metal will call those bands' status of metal into question. My hope is that the boundaries of definition will expand to accommodate them, but I see more conservative fans dismissing such modernist musicianship.

 

[V.V.V.V.V.]

Ah, yes I suppose it was something of a misunderstanding in that case!

 

[Alter]

post-metal sounds cool. If you could link to the myspaces of a couple bands it would be nice.

Check out Hydra Head Records and Southern Lord Records but some interesting post-metal. It is still a genre that is building so keep that in mind and I am not the expert in it yet.

Isis
Jesu
Ghengis Tron
Boris
Om
Pelican
Russian Circles
etc.

Zep, the thing that I see that is most important is to break down the stereotypes that hold metal down. When I post my interview with Blake Judd you will see how he is a perfect example of a person who understands that metal is not a meathead form of music that can only be expressed through cheap 4-track worshiping bedroom bands. He fully express his love of, yes, Interpol. I want to point out that there are in fact other forms of music that metal fans and artists can draw upon to create greater forms of art. They dont have to been locked into the basic idea of having to create the same corpse painted version of black metal or the same Immolation/Suffocation/Entombed sound to be metal. The genre moves nowhere when it is in this mind set because honestly how many Sarcófagos or Blasphemys do we need aside from the originals?

 

[Zephyrus]

I surely agree with your post, Alter. However, that shouldn't discredit those bands that will continue to navigate within the more widely accepted channel of metal's waters.

 

[Donnie Darko]

In America, everyone just wants to play metalcore

 

[SouthernTrendkill]

I don't think the cap has even been neared. I can imagine it getting a lot faster and darker and more extreme. I also think there's a whole lot of brand new territory metal can have, it just takes people to think beyond everything they've heard before. Only time will tell if I'm right or not.