AE's Nebula thread (samples, tests, etc)

[colonel kurtz]

man...even though i've only read a small portion of it and haven't participated at all, it's threads like this that make me glad that this forum exists...there's really no doubt in my mind that this is the place to go in order to get info on the best and most cutting edge production techniques...

[/beer fueled babbling]

 

[Ermz]

The effects that Nebula has on the tone is not an EQ issue you could fix afterwards, it is the content itself that is fucked and unless we find the errors that are the reasons for these alternations we won't get any closer to an optimal emulation of a cab.

I've already proven twice (I'm too lazy to find the posts where I did so right now) that a post curve EQ A/B'd to the original cab tone gives an almost 100% match across the frequency spectrum so we can safely ditch the idea that we would have to fix the fizz and out-of-balance tone with some surgical EQ in our chain. Actually maybe the term fizz is misguiding, it is the overall upper frequencies that have a very unpleasant, harsh and unnatural sound to it, very edgy and metallic sounding whereas a cab has a creamier, smoother tone there. And I am not being picky here, this is some issue that has been present throughout all the clips that have been posted so far and it is something that impulses seem to get right. That, and as mentioned before the lowend doesn't seem to be quite alright.

Basically, all Nebula needs to do is emulate given (good) impulses we have and add its dynamic features to them = pot of gold.
Now we have a more 3D and dynamic sounding result but the cab vibe itself gets lost during the process if you can catch my drift.

To me, anyone who thinks that Nebula tones come closer to the real deal than impulses...with all due respect...lacks the ability to hear the vast differences.

To repeat myself, yes Nebula programs result in a more open and dynamic tone but that's it. They don't feel like a guitar being played through a cab. I am unable to tell you if that is because people who did the programs might have done something wrong or if it is NAT/Nebula itself which needs adjusting for more accurate results.

In the end, impulses are still my go to solution for the closest emulation of cabs, even if it means I'd have to deal with more 2d and flat sounds. Despite being static, at least they get the harmonic content right.

That is just my own personal opinion. I do dig the abilities Nebula seems to offer in the long run but all I'm saying is that we're far from being at a point where we've tapped its full potential it seems. But then again, we'd need a good tone right from the start which we could use as an orientation.

Thank you, I was about to post the same thing.

I'm kind of finding it difficult to approach this thread. I was hoping we had pushed forward under the assumption that Nebula was fundamentally flawed in the way it sampled cabs. Though, to come in here and hear people say there is no fizz, or it's easily avoidable and such... I don't know. I mean, all the best luck to you, but the fact that Nebula's response compared to the real cab is more skewed than even that of a standard impulse speaks volumes to me of what's going on. Trying to EQ the programs afterward to 'de-fizz' them is like tuning a room with a 31-band graphic. What you should be doing is adding acoustic treatment from the start, if you dig the analogy.

I look forward to further developments here (provided you guys think they're needed), but I don't think I'll be of much aid. We seem to be on fairly different pages as far as where we perceive Nebula to be right now and where it has to go.

Best of luck.

 

[AeternusEternus]

I'd just like to preface this by saying as a user, I really don't understand convolution reverb much in the first place. So if anything here comes out silly-sounding, that's entirely my fault.

I don't think that Nebula's doing things the same way KeFIR is doing things. Where KeFIR or SIR operates on just that one static snapshot, that single sine sweep, I have no idea what Nebula operates on. The sampling involves tons of the sweeps, and I have no idea how it uses the data.

I envision something a little more appropriate than Nebula. Maybe it already works like this, so maybe I'm wrong, but I REALLY think that a new kind of static processing VST, let's call it CabX, would be tons better. Imagine it working like this: Say you take 10 sine sweeps. Your amp's master volume is at 6, but your sine sweeps are different. One's at 0db, one at -1db, one at -2db, and so on. You make 10 different impulses. You load all 10 impulses into CabX. When your signal is at 0db, it's using that 0db impulse. When your signal is at -1db, it's using the -1db impulse. If your signal is at -0.6db, it's using both the 0db and -1db impulses, but it blends and you hear 40% 0db and 60% -1db. If your signal is at -9db (the tenth impulse), or below, it's using that tenth impulse.

I had thought that Nebula was basically doing this, and that's why it uses so much processing power. But it's GOT to be doing something different in the NAT phase. We've heard KeFIR versus SIR versus Boogex, and they all sound almost exactly the same. But when you do an impulse with one 30-second sweep, and you do a Nebula program with one 30-second sweep, they sound vastly different. Nebula isn't making impulses. It's sampling differently, and so it's rendering differently.

I'm not interested in changing the integrity of Nebula. I love the way it works, and I want it to push harder to emulate more things.

As a matter of fact, I'm going to contact some convolution reverb creators and see what can be done with my idea.

 

[Sickan]

I've already proven twice (I'm too lazy to find the posts where I did so right now) that a post curve EQ A/B'd to the original cab tone gives an almost 100% match across the frequency spectrum so we can safely ditch the idea that we would have to fix the fizz and out-of-balance tone with some surgical EQ in our chain. Actually maybe the term fizz is misguiding, it is the overall upper frequencies that have a very unpleasant, harsh and unnatural sound to it, very edgy and metallic sounding whereas a cab has a creamier, smoother tone there. And I am not being picky here, this is some issue that has been present throughout all the clips that have been posted so far and it is something that impulses seem to get right. That, and as mentioned before the lowend doesn't seem to be quite alright.

Now I understand what you guys are talking about, I can agree with what you say but I don't find it unpleasant when it's in a full band mix (using my impulses after nebula).

 

[Acusticaudio.net]

I have a Fender at home, when i will have some spare time, i will sample the cabinet with Nat and with impulses and i will process a guitar through the real cab, than with impulses and than with Nebula and i will show you the differences.

Stay tuned!

 

[noarin]

awesome, can't wait!

 

[blackbird]

Great!

 

[FF666]

So, Impulses 1 - 0 Nebula
:danceboy:

 

[Ermz]

Basically. Still waiting to hear on any progress here whatsoever.

 

[Triplever]

My opinion = nebula 1 impulses 0

After hearing and feeling the difference in my setup, I find it very fake sounding with impulses. I can't see myself using impulses any longer.
With impulses I wasted many hours tying to coax a decent metal tone out of revalver.
Nebula fills in the missing piece and just feels better right from the start.


To my ears, Nebula is a majior improvement. Thanks to AE for sharing his programs, I will be using them, untill something else comes even closer!

 

[Acusticaudio.net]

My opinion = nebula 1 impulses 0

After hearing and feeling the difference in my setup, I find it very fake sounding with impulses. I can't see myself using impulses any longer.
With impulses I wasted many hours tying to coax a decent metal tone out of revalver.
Nebula fills in the missing piece and just feels better right from the start.


To my ears, Nebula is a majior improvement. Thanks to AE for sharing his programs, I will be using them, untill something else comes even closer!

Thank you very much. For any problem don't hesitate to contact us on our forum or by email.

If somebody is interested there is an amazing original fender reverb for Nebula2 or Nebula3 commercial on nebula-programs.com. It is sampled by Stedal i think.

 

[onemorelie]

Oh I know it's noob question but I can not download Nebula 3 free edition.
Can you help me ?

 

[Salamander1973]

Sorry to bump this old thread, but I would like to try the programs AE posted in this thread but Megaupload is no longer working. Does anyone know of any mirrors or other sites where this programs are hosted?. I finally learned how to use nebula 3 and I tried the free programs from AE and I'm loving it and I'm going to buy Nebula2. Thank you very much.

Regards

 

[naash_g]

Hi! Re-upload, please, impulses of 1 post! Thanks!