Democratic plan to abandon our troops

[Jurched]

thanks, T.

things like this will help me get over my unrequited love for Jurched.

Sue, don't be hurtin' my feelings, now! You're big-hearted enough to love T-Man and me, aren't you?

Geez, though. I'm away for a day or two or three, and eveyone goes totally fuckin ape-shit on this topic and one another. I wouldn't know where to begin my vitriolic complaints and virulent name-calling in all this...

Jurched

 

[MyHatred]

3 pages of fighting/arguing and not one mean-spirited comment from me

 

[Patrick R.]

I have a question and I guarantee nobody will give a reasonable answer. My question is…why the hell are American troops still in Iraq?

1.There are no weapons of mass in Iraq.

2. Saddam is dead.

3. These Muslims don’t want a Westminster form of government.

4. These Muslims don’t want freedom.

5. The insurgency will never die out.

6. We have already lost over 3000 troops.

7. This war has drained billions from Americans pockets.

8. An entire army of terrorist could sneak across our southern border…shouldn’t their be a ‘troop surge’ down there?

9. Many Americans don’t even understand how their own Federal government works, so it is impossible for them to ‘build’ a democracy in the Middle East.

10. Our own health care system is in decay.

11. The United States Federal government is planning a war with Iran.

ETC.

So why are we there? To give Iraq’s freedom? So Iraq’s can have democratic elections? So Israel is safe in the Middle East? To protect Iraq’s from the insurgents? To ‘step down’ when the Iraq’s will ‘step up’ ? (that will never happen) For Israel’s security in the Middle East? For women’s rights thousands of miles away? Hell…that is all I here from so called conservative ass clowns…the question still remains (DOES THE UNITED STATES BENEFIT FROM ANY OF THIS? The answer is NO we don’t.

 

[fah-q]

I have a question and I guarantee nobody will give a reasonable answer. My question is…why the hell are American troops still in Iraq?

1.There are no weapons of mass in Iraq.
There aren't now but, there were. (see Syria)
2. Saddam is dead.
Hooray!
3. These Muslims don’t want a Westminster form of government.
Explain?
4. These Muslims don’t want freedom.
They certainly aren't acting like it.
5. The insurgency will never die out.
It seems that way now because terrorists are posing as insurgents.
6. We have already lost over 3000 troops.
Losing even one soldier is too many. However, we don't pull out once we hit a certain #.
7. This war has drained billions from Americans pockets.
I would rather see the money invested in a border fence.
8. An entire army of terrorist could sneak across our southern border…shouldn’t their be a ‘troop surge’ down there?
We don't have to worry about the southern border. Papajosh has that covered.
9. Many Americans don’t even understand how their own Federal government works, so it is impossible for them to ‘build’ a democracy in the Middle East.
I am not sure I understand what the average American's knowledge of the federal gov't has to do with Iraq?
10. Our own health care system is in decay.
I would be interested in hearing what you think is a better alternative to what we have now? I am happy with my benefits.
11. The United States Federal government is planning a war with Iran.
It is the United States responsibility to stop Iran if they go nuclear.
ETC.

So why are we there? To give Iraq’s freedom? So Iraq’s can have democratic elections? So Israel is safe in the Middle East? To protect Iraq’s from the insurgents? To ‘step down’ when the Iraq’s will ‘step up’ ? (that will never happen) For Israel’s security in the Middle East? For women’s rights thousands of miles away? Hell…that is all I here from so called conservative ass clowns…the question still remains (DOES THE UNITED STATES BENEFIT FROM ANY OF THIS? The answer is NO we don’t.

It is my opinion that we have remained friendly with Israel for military reasons. Strategically, Israel is a great place to be if the need to go after a terrorist nation arises. Is it possible that the US is building permanent bases in Iraq so that we do not have to be so friendly to Israel?

 

[Patrick R.]

It is my opinion that we have remained friendly with Israel for military reasons. Strategically, Israel is a great place to be if the need to go after a terrorist nation arises. Is it possible that the US is building permanent bases in Iraq so that we do not have to be so friendly to Israel?

There aren't now but, there were. (see Syria)

So in theory, we should bomb Syria rather then Iran considering the fact they have Mr. Hussein’s weapons of mass destruction?

Hooray!

That didn’t help me out, it didn’t help the United States either.

explain

They don’t want a government based on that of the West…even if they did why should we give that to them?

They certainly aren't acting like it.

Then lets get out of their and leave them to themselves.

It seems that way now because terrorists are posing as insurgents.

You kill one, and then another one comes, if we are in their land they have the upper hand which is obvious, but in here in the United States they don't stand a chance at all.

Losing even one soldier is too many. However, we don't pull out once we hit a certain #.

So, if our soldiers were outnumbered 5 to 1, you wouldn’t suggesting pulling out? Furthermore, explain to me why we shouldn’t leave these people to their own government…it isn’t our job to build their nation.

I would rather see the money invested in a border fence.

Same here…a wall would be better though.

We don't have to worry about the southern border. Papajosh has that covered.

Yes we do…we don’t need another 9/11 on our hands.

Also, don’t believe the cheap campaign rhetoric of the democrats when they claim they will ‘pull out’ of Iraq when they can’t even prevent a troop surge initiated by the executive branch. It isn’t like they ever had any intention to do that in the first place…it just sounds good for the ill-informed voter.

 

[Dr Demented]

I think a few well-placed low altitude nukes would cure the problem in a very satisfactory way. I would only wish that I could watch the destruction via satellite so I could enjoy it more...

 

[SueNC]

Sue, don't be hurtin' my feelings, now! You're big-hearted enough to love T-Man and me, aren't you?

Jurched

*sigh*

 

[Jurched]

3 pages of fighting/arguing and not one mean-spirited comment from me

And THIS comes from a man whose name contains the word HATRED!

Sir, every time you exhale, hate billows from you like emissions from a soviet smokestack! Don't deny it. You are THE Hatred. The forger of animosity. The foundry of brutal confrontation.

You... are... MyHatred (formerly MyHatredForYouRunsDeep).

Jurched

 

[MyHatred]

And THIS comes from a man whose name contains the word HATRED!

Sir, every time you exhale, hate billows from you like emissions from a soviet smokestack! Don't deny it. You are THE Hatred. The forger of animosity. The foundry of brutal confrontation.

You... are... MyHatred (formerly MyHatredForYouRunsDeep).

Jurched

HA that made me laugh....Errrr, I mean, that really pisses me off, Jurched I am going to go kick a puppy, burn an orphanage down and drink some goat's blood now

 

[Hell_Awaits]

Excellent point about Cheney. He is the reason I voted for Bush the 2nd time. If they do try to impeach GW, I would be real confident in Dick.

The party would never let this happen....They would force Cheney into retirement behind closed doors....They would'nt be able to stomach seeing one of their boys in the highest seat in the land with a 20% approval rating....which would most certainly happen since Cheney is one of the most hated men in America........

 

[fah-q]

The party would never let this happen....They would force Cheney into retirement behind closed doors....They would'nt be able to stomach seeing one of their boys in the highest seat in the land with a 20% approval rating....which would most certainly happen since Cheney is one of the most hated men in America........

Is Cheney disliked that much? I know there is a lot of hatred for W but, Cheney too? Most Americans know little about him. Other than his daughter being gay and him telling a Senator to Fuck Off, what does your average person know about him?
For the record, I was quite pleased when I read that Cheney told Leahy to fuck off.

 

[Patrick R.]

Is Cheney disliked that much? I know there is a lot of hatred for W but, Cheney too? Most Americans know little about him. Other than his daughter being gay and him telling a Senator to Fuck Off, what does your average person know about him?
For the record, I was quite pleased when I read that Cheney told Leahy to fuck off.

He is some what similar to Donald Rumsfeld. Most Americans know very little about their own Federal government in general ( that is why we are in Iraq) and provoking another illegal war with Iran.

 

[fah-q]

What does the average American's knowledge base of the Federal gov't have to do with us being in Iraq? What is an "illegal war" anyway?

 

[Jurched]

I was wondering the same thing. Judging by the Democrats' behaviour as of late, an illegal war is when:

1. The UN provides a time table for a country's compliance with certain demands.

2. The President receives a mandate from the UN to enforce its demands.

3. Key opposition figures (Democrats) publicly denounce the enemy country and declare them a threat to the rest of the world.

4. Congress overwhelmingly approves of military action against the enemy country.

4. The congress appropriates vast funds for military action.

5. Dozens of other countries provide aid and support of enforcing the UN demands.

6. The enemy government is overthrown and key personnel arrested for crimes against humanity.

7. The army occupies the country under a UN mandate to maintain order until elections may be held.

8. A legitimate government is elected and has the authority to treat with both international organizations like the UN and allied military personnel.

9. Enemy leaders are tried and convicted by an legitimate court for a range of crimes against their own people.

10. The new government of the country asks for additional aid from its allies to fight internal unrest.

Yep! Sounds like an illegal war! All that involvement from congress, all those Democrats trumpeting the dangers of WMDs, all those UN resolutions!

What we needed for a legitimate war was for the president to personally order the 101st Airborne to paratroop onto Martha's Vineyard and burn down the Kennedy Family Compound!

Jurched

 

[Hell_Awaits]

For the record, I was quite pleased when I read that Cheney told Leahy to fuck off.

I gotta admit he is keeping it real...............

 

[MyHatred]

 

[Patrick R.]

What does the average American's knowledge base of the Federal gov't have to do with us being in Iraq? What is an "illegal war" anyway?

Well that is simple question…just apply some logic and as yourself this question. If the American people don’t have much knowledge of their own Federal government and how it is set up by the constitution, then why should they support their head of state build a government in Iraq and the Middle East?? This form of government being set up in Iraq by America is a Westminster form…how many people…even the within the educated classes of America and Europe actually understand how Westminster forms of government actually work? Westminster government are modeled after that of the United Kingdom, something that doesn’t happen over night and something that probably isn’t going to happen within Iraq anytime soon.

What is an ‘illegal war’? ? Don’t you remember the Nuremberg trials? The laws laid out there outlawing wars of aggression are still in place to this very day. That is why it isn’t surprising to learn that a neo-conservative who has had considerable influence within the Federal government from the peace talks with the Soviet Union all the way to the formulation of the Iraq war has confessed that this war is against international law. This man’s name is Richard Perle. In an extreme act of irony, this formally liberal bandit of intellectuals were left wing Trotskyites who hated the Vietnam war like the rest of the hippies…but decades later start a catastrophic war in the Middle East which.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,1089158,00.html

 

[Patrick R.]

I was wondering the same thing. Judging by the Democrats' behaviour as of late, an illegal war is when:

1. The UN provides a time table for a country's compliance with certain demands.

2. The President receives a mandate from the UN to enforce its demands.

3. Key opposition figures (Democrats) publicly denounce the enemy country and declare them a threat to the rest of the world.

4. Congress overwhelmingly approves of military action against the enemy country.

4. The congress appropriates vast funds for military action.

5. Dozens of other countries provide aid and support of enforcing the UN demands.

6. The enemy government is overthrown and key personnel arrested for crimes against humanity.

7. The army occupies the country under a UN mandate to maintain order until elections may be held.

8. A legitimate government is elected and has the authority to treat with both international organizations like the UN and allied military personnel.

9. Enemy leaders are tried and convicted by an legitimate court for a range of crimes against their own people.

10. The new government of the country asks for additional aid from its allies to fight internal unrest.

Yep! Sounds like an illegal war! All that involvement from congress, all those Democrats trumpeting the dangers of WMDs, all those UN resolutions!



What we needed for a legitimate war was for the president to personally order the 101st Airborne to paratroop onto Martha's Vineyard and burn down the Kennedy Family Compound!

Jurched

That is some nice work ‘Jurched’ but it was all in vein…one of the chief architects of the war in Iraq argued that the Iraq war was against international law. Thus a perfect title for an article about this subject is ‘War critics astonished as US hawk admits invasion was illegal’. These words speak for themselves.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,1089158,00.html

 

[Hell_Awaits]

Is Cheney disliked that much? I know there is a lot of hatred for W but, Cheney too? Most Americans know little about him. Other than his daughter being gay and him telling a Senator to Fuck Off, what does your average person know about him?
For the record, I was quite pleased when I read that Cheney told Leahy to fuck off.

Cheney getting the love downunder......

http://news.yahoo.com/photo/070223/photos_pl_afp/39a1241bf4a0f5ba6ff2aec168df8b0a

 

[Papa Josh]

How many people can shoot someone in the face and get away with it?