Dream Theater - Octavarium

[Jeremy Krull]

lol Portnoy.

You probably don't get banned if you mention the leak, and praise the record.

Because I'm sure the person who speaks the highest of this record, and thinks it's the most amazing,

is Mike Portnoy.

god, drummers....lol

 

[Rifugium]

Anyone who discusses the album is banned until June 7th.

 

[Jeremy Krull]

that's the absolute dumbest thing I have ever heard.

At least the cats over at the Petrucci Forum have the decency and restraint not to mention spoilers, without having to threatened to be banned by the Lars Ulrich of Prog.

 

[Rose Immortal]

Oh and to the guy talking about technical wankery, I find it ironic how you are posting on the symphony x board, I mean I love this band to death but for someone for is annoyed by this type of thing Symphony X do it alot more than Dt in my opinon.

Um...there's a difference between fast-placed playing and wankery. The thing with Pinnella and Romeo is they have an extremely good sense of when to STOP. They show their skills, definitely, but they never go on too long with a solo in the studio.

 

[Kenneth R.]

There is no such thing as a bad DT album.

Yes, There Is. any band has the ability (or lack thereof) to make a BAD album. which if any these are when pertaining to this particular band, is up to interpretation.

Enough complaining about "wankery" already. Emotion is a part of music but technique is as well. The two work together, and occasionally alone.

The pure intellectual appreciation of complex and difficult passages is not subordinate to the emotional appreciation of a beautiful melodic line.

If you don't like technique to be an equal part of the music--and I mean for its own sake, not merely as a prop for lyrics or so-called 'emotional content'--then maybe progressive metal isn't your choicest milieu.

1. they do not work alone. technical skill without emotion is called warm up practice routines.
2. yes, it does bow to melody
3. i believe you are gravely mistaken. PROG != PROGRESSIVE. i love progressive music of all forms. "prog" as you seem to think it is, however, is losing my interest. technique for it's own sake is stupidity.

Wowowowowow....
I don't mind calling The dance of Eternity/Metropolis Pt.1/The Glass Prison/whatever DT song wankery but definitely not Erotomania.

It's the most intelligent and fully-packed-with-great-ideas Instrumental piece of music I've ever heard. To just call it wankery is simply stupid. Take a closer listen.

this is subjective. stop debating my OPINIONS when i clearly even marked them as such. you disagree. that's your right. your post is unnecessary, and to claim it is a favorite of yours, and i am stupid for disagreeing is sheer absurdity. no amount of repeated listens (trust me i wore the cd out) will change my mind about that particular track. you'll have to live with my disagreement.

Um...there's a difference between fast-placed playing and wankery. The thing with Pinnella and Romeo is they have an extremely good sense of when to STOP. They show their skills, definitely, but they never go on too long with a solo in the studio.

precisely my point in most cases with SX. i left this out in my arguments above since i do NOT want to start a feud again. i do enjoy both bands. if the naysayers had read what i wrote carefully, they would have seen i am not against "shredding" but am against mindless stupidity at high velocity. when used appropriately, such technique can be a powerful tool. it should be used tastefully, for its full impact to be felt.

as i stated above for those who didn't seem to read it, my position is: i don't care how big your toolbox is, i care about the kinds of works you can build and with what kind of beauty they are wrought. tools are tools, and nothing more.

 

[Meedleyx10]

Pinnella is a celibate nun who would rather implode than touch her genitalia compared to Rudess in terms of wankery. Similarly Romeo is far more reserved than Petrucci

that made me laugh on the inside

 

[MorphineChild205]

I love the title track, especially during the evil-sounding Dave Mustaine part. "Trapped inside this octavarium!" That part sent shivers down my spine when I first heard it.

By the way, I love This Dying Soul. I agree that the end drags on too long -- mainly because of Rudess' and Petrucci's individual solos -- but the unison in the last minute or so is amazing. Sure, it's on the verge of wankery, but it fits very well.

 

[Yngtchie Blacksteen]

I love the title track, especially during the evil-sounding Dave Mustaine part. "Trapped inside this octavarium!" That part sent shivers down my spine when I first heard it.

Haha, exactly how I felt during that section, it's the high point of the song for me.

 

[Moonchild141]

im surprised you guys hate "wankery" seeing we are on a syx board, and you cant say they dont do their share of wankery as well. but that being said the new DT grows on me with every listen. and it always cracks me up DT ripped this band off. or that band. every metal band rips off another band. i mean every riff you can find something similar by another band somewhere. its all in how you interperet the riffs in your playing. and i think DT does an excellent job with thier "influnces"

 

[kazahana]

For the love of god name one song where Symphony X wank. Please! Tell me which one it is because I haven't heard it yet.

 

[Smoke and Fire]

And for the love of satan stop turning every thread into a Symphony X vs. Dream Theater fight.

 

[kazahana]

I didn't mention DT in that post. I happen to think DT display show off a bit more in solos but I still love both bands.

 

[Smoke and Fire]

You did mention them in your previous post, and I wasn't talking only about you...

 

[Barking Pumpkin]

Well....since there's no discussion allowed on the Dream Theater boards yet, I'll post a little tiny bit here.

Dream Theater are going downhill fast. Most of this album isn't really prog at all, and there aren't really any truly amazing songs. A few good ones, but there are some awful moments. Meanwhile, Pain Of Salvation released probably one of the best Prog albums ever last year. If Dream Theater keep going this way with there next album, I'm going to stop buying Dream Theater albums.

 

[Jeremy Krull]

YES finally someone else willing to bring this out in the open!

And what the fuck is an Octavarium, and why is it the stupidest sounding thing I have ever heard of?

 

[turke]

This is written by "Legatoman" who writes to Petrucciforum usually. And if Myung made a statement like this, i totally agree with him. Please read:

"Even though this is mainly directed at my fellow "golden-age-DT-fans", I thought I might address this matter in public. What John Myung said in the commentary on "When Dream And Day Re-Unite" was amazing. Not only did he speak more than ever, he also proposed that the band should resurrect their more traditional approach to writing music and that he found the modern in-ear-monitor concept too impersonal. A reasonable point, don't you think? And exactly my point of view as well. As it was to be expected, the other Dream Theater members didn't take him seriously at all, and even laughed about him towards the end of the DVD by saying: "Want to talk a bit more about the olden days before the show ends, Johnny?" I can understand his observation that he doesn't look like he fits in the band anymore. It seems to me that wants to maintain their melodic and experimental side, whereas the rest of the band goes all "heavy metal" on him. I personally hope the other Dream Theater members take his musical thoughts and ideas seriously- and so we can maybe get a taste of what Dream Theater was like in their "golden age" again."

 

[Barking Pumpkin]

It is still growing on me a bit, but this is pretty bad for a Dream Theater album. This should be graded harshly, because they can do better. There are some really cool moments on the album, but it really seems to be a mediocre effort.

Also, to note something that is absolutely unacceptable from Dream Theater. I was alerted that the song Never Enough sounds a lot like the band Muse. They sent me the Muse song "Stockholm Syndrone." Really.....this is pitiful for "Never Enough." It's a cool song, but it is completely ripping off Muse. This isn't "paying tribute," this is completely copying another band's style. The chorus of "I Walk Beside You" is completely U2, but the whole song isn't like that, so I can deal with that, it also sounds pretty nice.

Besides those specifics, there's the whole "let's try and add lots of generic modern rock elements to prog" going on throughout a whole lot of the album that I also don't think should be acceptable material from Dream Theater.

I also would like to comment that John Petrucci overuses downtuning WAY too much on this album. That's not innovative or creative at all. As I said elsewhere, it used to be that he could write a nice, tasteful song with a seven-string that used it effectively (Lie, The Mirror, The Dance Of Eternity). On this album it almost seems like if it's a faster paced song he's automatically downtuning to C or something on his guitar.

Again, maybe it seems harsh, and it's a decent album, but it's Dream Theater. I know what they can do, so this isn't good enough. They need to realize that they're hardly the only prog band out there and they need to actually work and come up with new ideas to make a great album, not just recycle things, especially from other bands. There's a difference between, "let's add a bit of U2 feel to this song" and "let's be Dream Theater doing Muse in this song." Quit "paying tribute" and be more original.

 

[Prog Maiden]

Also, to note something that is absolutely unacceptable from Dream Theater. I was alerted that the song Never Enough sounds a lot like the band Muse. They sent me the Muse song "Stockholm Syndrone." Really.....this is pitiful for "Never Enough." It's a cool song, but it is completely ripping off Muse. This isn't "paying tribute," this is completely copying another band's style. The chorus of "I Walk Beside You" is completely U2, but the whole song isn't like that, so I can deal with that, it also sounds pretty nice.

Oh, it's not just Never Enough that sounds like a Muse song. I take it you're not all that familiar with their material, but if you've ever heard Absolution in its entirety, you'd realize that Muse is a VERY prominent influence on Octavarium. I hear it all over the place, especially on parts of These Walls, Panic Attack, Never Enough, and Sacrificed Sons.

That being said, I like Octavarium better than their last two efforts. It's nice to hear them being more restrained (JP must've gotten all the wankery out of his system between ToT and his solo album). I'm also quite pleased with how LaBrie sounds on this album. He sounds more within his element, and it's nice hearing him stick to the mid-ranged vocals since that's his real forte (at least nowadays).

 

[Kenneth R.]

you guys need to wake up and realize the genre "prog" hasn't been progressive in at least 5 years.

 

[Snowmaker]

you guys need to wake up and realize the genre "prog" hasn't been progressive in at least 5 years.

And just what is "prog". Everyone seems to have a different idea of what it is.