Evolution vs. Creation: The Cosmological Argument

FEZZILLA said:
If atheist and agnostic mean the same thing.
Why are they two different words?
They are!
atheist says there is no God/god.
An atheist says he is god.
An agnostic doesn't know because he hasen't been given enough proof.

Take care!
Ill be back in a few days :wave:
Agnostic and Atheist are two different words because they discribe two different things. (A)gnosticism deals with knowledge or lack thereof, and (A)thesm deals with belief in god(s) or lack thereof. Most people can't tell them apart.
And when does atheists say there is no god? A person can be an atheist yet never in his life said that there are no gods. If an atheist is a person who don't believe in your god, then Hindus would be atheists also. But clearly they are not, so your definition seems incomplete.

If you want to discuss Creationism vs Evolution I suggest that you smurf your way over here instead:
http://www.iidb.org/vbb/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=66

You should get a better response here.
 
Unregistered- nice point- but it still is an argument based on semantics- and such arguments quite honestly I find to be pointless. Although when the argument is about God- maybe semantics is all one has.

SO, faith is based on a fear of death- thats interesting- and I think partly true. Based on my life, and its experiences, and the strange and eclectic reading habits I have decided to suffer for( however boring it may have been- and still is), I have noticed that those that have faith- seem to have faith not only because of a fear of death- but also God embodies a belief in a moral order- as well as the belief that God is an enforcer of a certain moral code( a judge if you will)- without god- there would be chaos- is the basic belief I think of most people. And we all know how much stock the common middle class american puts into morality, order, and supposed justice. ( down with the middle class- I dont want a pointless job with a clean house and 2.2 fucking kids- with a lot of material goodies, and a green lawn, and patriotism and apple pie- I say fuck it) The belief in God's Creation(Creationism) I believe to be central to so many religious minded people- as what could be more central to a belief in a Moral Creator- than the belief that God created everything around us- and holds power over every thing around us- can one imagine how deflated belief in a God would be- if it is found that God had nothing to do with creation- that small particles that react on their own- would be able to create a universe- then just who is God but a moral judge if he is not a creator? Do I wish to worship a judge of my life- that holds no power of creation- a power that any woman - or mother earth has? I would imagine that most if not all of people would not worship any judge- nor would accept that any arbritary power can judge their life. Ok well, I am tired of thinking and typing.
 
FEZZILLA said:
@dead skin mask
Can you provide a fixed axiom that proves evolution?
I believe in God by faith. But my faith is based on facts.Evolution is blind faith.
excuse me??? Faith by definition cannot be based on facts, because if it were based on facts it wouldn't be faith. Faith is:

  1. Confident belief in the truth, value, or trustworthiness of a person, idea, or thing.
  2. Belief that does not rest on logical proof or material evidence. See Synonyms at belief, trust.
  3. Loyalty to a person or thing; allegiance: keeping faith with one's supporters.
  4. often [font=arial,sans-serif][size=-1]Faith[/size][/font] Christianity The theological virtue defined as secure belief in God and a trusting acceptance of God's will.
  5. The body of dogma of a religion: the Muslim faith.
  6. A set of principles or beliefs.
ref: www.yourdictionary.com
so you see, faith is really nothing more than a synonym for belief. I will not deny that some people hang onto evolution as faith but its really no different than people such as yourself you believe in a 'god'.


You call those who believe in God Crazy????
No, I call them blind, stupid and ignorant.

You see, just as evolutionsim as this stage is neither provable nor disprovable, the same goes for religious dieties, their existence can be neither proven nor disproven, it is just a theory that has its believers and detractors. We cannot, at this stage in our evolution, comprehend the universe, it is beyond our comprehension. So we invent ways to comprehend it, first we created gods, myths, etc. as we grew more developped we discovered science, the scientific method and we developped theories which offer more plausible, reasonable explinations as to how the universe 'functions'. one of the many problems with religion is that it is unwilling, unlike science, to admit it can be mistaken.


Make it good because i don't have much time for long debates like i used to.[/QUOTE]
then why did you post in the first place? I think you came to the wrong place , this is a discussion group for the metal band Nevermore, if you wanted more insightful opinions on evolution vs. creationsism you should've gone on an evolution discussion forum.
 
Space exploration has taught us much about the cosmo's.But as much as we've learned,science cannot provide a sound answer to the mystery we all want to know:
How did the cosmo's become the cosmo's?
Scientificly,we don't know.
The argument that states:Where did God come from[?] is a valid argument.
Since science cannot explain God or anything in the spiritual realm,we must first understand that God's mind-wisdom and technology is so advanced we'll never EVER catch up with Him.
Ezekiel chapter one reveals a mystery that i encourage ALL to read! The UFO mystery!! But before i go into that you must understand that God created all life that exist.God created several different species of angels.
Has you read in ezekiel,you'll understand that God and His angels do not always appear has artist paint them up to be.
Most UFO sightings are abviously fake. But for the ones that are real documented sightings,well, there is only one explaination. Life-out-side-earth!
They are angels and there are many of the them and many different kinds. Satan too, is an angel,but he and one third of the angels were cast out from heaven.Satan too,can appear has a UFO.

O.K [you ask], So there may be a God. But where is heaven?

Everything in the universe we are a part of is built on the basis of three physical dimensions,plus the additional dimension of time.
The birth of quantum physics and Einstein's creation of general relativity shows us that the additional dimension of time in our universe;makes perfect sense.
Our universe is structured on three dimensions,plus the additional dimension of time. There is no way that our particular dimensions may be extended outside of our universe,but suppose the dimension of time is transcendent-not limited to our universe-and shared mutually by worlds out side of our own. If,as calculations indicate,there is a total of ten possible dimensions,if we subtract the three that define our universe,plus time,that leaves six dimensions left over. Three of the remaining dimensions could be the location of heaven.
Since each of these "heavenly" dimensions would be at right angles to those of our own,heaven could occupy ecactly the same space as our own world does.
In other words,it is mathematicly possible that the earth and heaven exist simultaneosly in the same space,but with dimensions at right angles to each other. It is impossible for us to visualize this mentally,for we are conditioned to think only in the dimensions of our own universe,but this is mathematiclly possible.
Each dimension would interface others by an infinite number of infinitesimally small pathways. The equations allow the possiblity of energy and matter to sometimes pass through these minute channels from one set of dimensions to another.
Maths or not,God is from another dimension and time in space.
Jesus said He was not of this world,and I don't think He was kidding.
Science has a whole, will never understand this because God is above and beyond our comprehension.

Isaiah 40:22
"He sits enthroned ABOVE the CIRCLE or the EARTH,"

This was written long before Galileo was a sperm in his daddies pants.



God Spoke;
And nothing became something and everything around us..
 
The Bible talks about "a wheel within a wheel," not UFOs specifically...it's nonspecific mumbo-jumbo, like your flood of nonsensical illogic. Such as your last argument, which is completely contradictory. You say that God is above science, and science can not explain the spiritual. Then you go on to "prove" the existence of Heaven, and thus God, using quantum physics and relativity as a basis.

Class, does anyone know what area of human study quantum physics fall under?...Anyone? Anyone?...Anyone?
 
Pyrus said:
Correct, Willy! You get a gold star!

Now, for extra credit, can you tell me what this does to Fezzilla's arguments?

puts it in a 400º circle!
but wait... how can there be a 400º?!?!?!
it turns to make itself SEEM real, but it continues, and makes itself useless, seeing as though too much thought was put into it, and the details were not completely worked out...

i understand what im tryin to say, its up to you to understand
 
"can you tell me what this does to Fezzilla's arguments?"
It makes it null and void. And also, how do UFOs prove God's existence?
 
haha deicide has a song called 'the truth above' thats about how aliens created us or somthing. heh. deicide is funny. senior year of high school i drove around with this cd (serpents of the light) in my car stereo for like 6 weeks straight haha.
-neal
 
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