If Mort Divine ruled the world

[Omni]

Where did I say that it was a form of sexual assault in that post? Come to think of it, I asked where Mort said that and nobody volunteered any evidence that he said so.

Last time that I checked, not making a kid do something that they don't want to do isn't the same as calling the act sexual assault.

 

[Dak]

Where did I say that it was a form of sexual assault in that post? Come to think of it, I asked where Mort said that and nobody volunteered any evidence that he said so.

Last time that I checked, not making a kid do something that they don't want to do isn't the same as calling the act sexual assault.

The bottom line here is that there appears to be a schism between those who believe a child should have 100% say in the physical contact they receive (as well as pretty much everything else - this issue isn't some one off sort of rant), and those who believe that not all physical contact is the same - and that children are ignorant of what they should and shouldn't do and as a result need, you know, parenting.

 

[CiG]

The problem is people projecting how they'd like to be treated as an adult onto how one should treat a child.

 

[Mort Divine]

In the most literal sense of "don't fucking touch me if i don't want it" yes, not at all how you mean it.

 

[Dak]

The problem is people projecting how they'd like to be treated as an adult onto how one should treat a child.

This "adultifying" of children while at the same time infantilizing adults is a really big problem, and I'm not sure if it's closer to a cause or an effect of progressivism. Confusion regarding abilities, which leads to confusion regarding roles - social, gender, or otherwise, is on display across every domain. "I found an exception!" is taken as proof against the rule - because they are confused about rules.

 

[CiG]

In the most literal sense of "don't fucking touch me if i don't want it" yes, not at all how you mean it.

Could you be more clear please, that went over my head I have to admit.

This "adultifying" of children while at the same time infantilizing adults is a really big problem, and I'm not sure if it's closer to a cause or an effect of progressivism. Confusion regarding abilities, which leads to confusion regarding roles - social, gender, or otherwise, is on display across every domain. "I found an exception!" is taken as proof against the rule - because they are confused about rules.

It seems as if it got really bad in the 80's when parents, especially mothers, began to restrict their children's freedom, not being allowed to play outside much, constant surveillance, boycotting certain toys because they weren't "safe" enough and on and on.

 

[Dak]

It seems as if it got really bad in the 80's when parents, especially mothers, began to restrict their children's freedom, not being allowed to play outside much, constant surveillance, boycotting certain toys because they weren't "safe" enough and on and on.

Well, to be fair to parents in the 80s, crime was pretty high. Now I'm more concerned about inattentiveness than malevolence. Like, don't go anywhere near the street cause some texting/driving idiot might hop the curb. I've seen it happen - almost right next to me - a mile from my house.

My parents were stupid protective about media influence, although we played out after dark in a neighborhood where thieves ran through our yard running from the police or bled in our yard hiding from the police and neighborhood black kids we played with on some days shot at us with bb guns on other days. We grew up on black and white films, Andy Griffith, and WW2 era Looney Toons for TV, and Frank Garlock/Ron Hamilton for music. The former wasn't so bad but the latter omg. I stumbled on a MIDI of Enter Sandman in my early internet years, and then Dragula from Rob Zombie/Matrix Soundtrack. My first encounters with "metal". Had no idea where that would wind up.

 

[CiG]

Crime was high, but with next to no relation to the safety of children, but nonetheless the panic happened and I think we're still all in recovery of that.

My own situation was ridiculous, I had a very strict, emotionally reserved father with an intense work ethic and my mother is an extremely liberal alcoholic prone to raw emotion and suicide attempts, in and out of rehab etc.

So as a result I'd bounce between their homes, learning nothing positive and picking up all negative aspects of both.
Coming home from school and there's no food in the cupboard, my mother is gone but left no note, no dinner, then about 1 in the morning she'd return home and bring the party with her, they'd still be drinking by the time I left for another day of school.

My father, a functioning alcoholic-workaholic, zero emotional connection which made it hard for him to initiate bonding which often times is how fathers impart skills and lessons to their children, very strict so I could never have friends visit and it was hard to cultivate a sense of individuality and personality.

Anyway, how old are you? That story bears no relation to my own experiences. Haha.

 

[Dak]

Crime was high, but with next to no relation to the safety of children, but nonetheless the panic happened and I think we're still all in recovery of that.

My own situation was ridiculous, I had a very strict, emotionally reserved father with an intense work ethic and my mother is an extremely liberal alcoholic prone to raw emotion and suicide attempts, in and out of rehab etc.

So as a result I'd bounce between their homes, learning nothing positive and picking up all negative aspects of both.
Coming home from school and there's no food in the cupboard, my mother is gone but left no note, no dinner, then about 1 in the morning she'd return home and bring the party with her, they'd still be drinking by the time I left for another day of school.

My father, a functioning alcoholic-workaholic, zero emotional connection which made it hard for him to initiate bonding which often times is how fathers impart skills and lessons to their children, very strict so I could never have friends visit and it was hard to cultivate a sense of individuality and personality.

Anyway, how old are you? That story bears no relation to my own experiences. Haha.

31. My father is/was an emotional robot (I give him credit for trying at least)/workaholic due to a combination of an essentially absentee/workaholic father/stepfather/overbearing mother.My mother might have been an alcoholic liberal if she was raised different but instead she was an intense fundy at the time. Now she's practically a Wiccan and married to an emotionally/intellectually handicapped machoman and my father remarried a pathological liar who has been rendered physically invalid/ is probably going to die early from following a combination of all sorts of progressivist memes. Extreme to extreme. Fortunately my oldest younger brother and I bonded via mutual dealing with the roller coaster of stupidity and were able to kind of reason/work our way out of the mess. He's leveraged his extroverted personality into a 6 figure income in a sales position and I'm leveraging my own strengths into other areas. We're very tight despite out geographic and personality differences.

Edit: I should be clear that we never lacked for a meal, but the meals weren't necessarily healthy. OTOH my wife had it way worse. Physical (at least not sexual) abuse and often no food except school lunches.

Edit x2: My brother and I did get spanked growing up. That shit was legitimate spankings though. I can only think of couple of times that I was "beaten". I learned the difference in the Marines. I heard other guys/girls talk about getting "spanked" and then when they went into detail I was like "uhhhhh, no thats a goddamn beating" . Same thing with the wife(she was physically abused). We only ever got hit on the butt, and my 'rents had a short strip of belt to do it with, and in adult retrospect we were being shits in those situations and deserved it except in those couple of times - and even then I understand the "over"reaction. The reaction might have been rationally over the top but I understand the overreaction.

As a parent myself now, I try to square my remembrances as a kid with my knowledge as an adult in my reactions and punishments. Since I have a pretty good memory going back to 4, it's been very helpful.

 

[CiG]

Funny you mention that as it was my younger (and only) brother that helped me (and I helped him in return) get through a lot of that stuff, though I often had to put myself more into the fray in order to keep some of it from fucking him up.

But yeah, my brother is actually my best friend, weirdly enough.

 

[Dak]

I have other siblings/half/step siblings but they are mostly much younger. I do have an equivalent step sibling or two but know nothing about them/they disappeared themselves. Im slightly older than the "best friend" brother and way older than the rest. Almost more of a parent figure to the rest to be honest, since the actual parents are fucking clueless. My close brother and I have felt obligated to be pseudoparents to the younger cadre.

 

[The Butt]

I was spanked as a child, and even had the belt used on me a few times. I turned out alright.

My younger brother never got spanked or hit, and is 22, jobless, has a kid, and is living with my parents.

 

[CiG]

I was never disciplined, just physically assaulted occasionally by my drunken maniac mother.

 

[The Butt]

I was never disciplined, just physically assaulted occasionally by my drunken maniac mother.

Jesus. That's insane.

Like... full-on beaten with fists?

 

[CiG]

Ha! No, with broomsticks and rakes and stuff.

That didn't go on forever though, I guess I was also a cunt kid back then.

But I was never disciplined and I turned out like shit, so people should take heed.

 

[The Butt]

Beaten with broomsticks. Fuuuck. :I

 

[The Ozzman]

I was spanked as a child. I was hit with an open hand by my father only a handful of times. I think I adjusted okay..

 

[Dak]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...tart-new-life-as-a-six-year-old-a6769051.html

..........

 

[Omni]

I was extremely well-behaved as a child. None of my siblings were well-behaved. The handful of times that I was disciplined during my childhood were all for things that were blamed on me unfairly that were done by my siblings. My parents always found out about it after the fact.

 

[Dak]

The primary reason my brother and I ever got in trouble was for fighting with each other in some form lol