If Mort Divine ruled the world

[Einherjar86]

Why are the overwhelming majority in these "good" majors asians and white people? It's just a fact, look around a graduate student in stats classroom. or math. or physics. Nearly/All asians or white people. I believe any race can do the work, why don't they attempt it?

Races don't do work. Individuals do. You can't randomly pluck anyone off the street and shove them in a graduate program. Even with all the vetting, selected people don't always graduate. If people don't want to be in a program, that would have an effect on their likelihood of success.

This.

Anybody from any race "can" do the work, but that doesn't mean that any twenty-two year-old (or however old you are when you enter a grad program) is prepared and equipped to do the work. Grad level study isn't something that just anyone can step into. And it just so happens that those who tend to be "prepared and equipped" also tend to be from particular demographics. Not going to get into the particulars of why that's the case, but it is the case.

 

[Carpe Mortem]

I started school again for the first time in about five years, and it's given me a bit of a theory in relation the above. When you're working your ass off to pay bills or get ahead in life, intellectual improvement tends to fall by the wayside. I'm in a pretty basic algebra class and it isn't effortless, it's actually difficult for me and time consuming. And I made algebra my bitch in high school.

A lot of non-white, non-Asian people tend to be a wee bit downtrodden and forced into employment responsibility at a younger age like I was. And who the hell has time for all the difficult, critical thinking homework that even the most basic math or science class entails when there's bills to pay? Especially when your life and mind have been geared for years towards just working your job and making a paycheck? You can get an okay career with those easier social degrees. You'll never be impressive, but it is less time consuming, and you'll still come out further than not getting a degree.

 

[Carpe Mortem]

I know that seems like a pretty basic commentary if you break it down to privilege, but I feel a lot of folks focus on privilege as financial or social only. There's a whole different mindset between someone who has to work and someone who can afford not to.

 

[Dak]

I would argue that if you need quick + money, a social science degree is the worst way to go.

 

[Carpe Mortem]

Maybe it depends on the area and your application of the degree but I've been trolling job boards for years and see the qualifications for related positions all the time. Medicaid assistance, domestic abuse admins, etc etc. Asking associates in human resources and social sciences usually.

I think you're interpreting it as the part of the spectrum SJW's linger.

 

[Dak]

How much do those jobs pay though? An associates degree is ~2 years. You could get certified in a skill in the same time or less for a job that would usually pay more.

 

[Baroque]

This.

Anybody from any race "can" do the work, but that doesn't mean that any twenty-two year-old (or however old you are when you enter a grad program) is prepared and equipped to do the work. Grad level study isn't something that just anyone can step into. And it just so happens that those who tend to be "prepared and equipped" also tend to be from particular demographics. Not going to get into the particulars of why that's the case, but it is the case.

I know trying to assign causation, especially in a racial context, is a dangerous game. I think the why in this case is still very important though, the problem must be fully described before it can be solved. There are social "scientists" who blame systemic racism as the cause, but I don't think that is entirely the case. There are definitely opportunities for black students to be in a phd statistics program for example, but there is not a single one at my school. This is at a school which is statistically one of the top 10 most diverse universities in the nation. A school which advocates diversity in acceptance policies and would be more than happy to accept a black phd stats student to show off how diverse they are. The fact is, either none applied, or none had the qualifications. Why?

I think Emily made a good point, but I also think there are more factors than just those. Perhaps cultural, the way parents raise their kids, etc. I can't seem to put my finger on the exact cause though.

 

[Einherjar86]

Well, I agree that the "why" is important, I just know how the argument is probably going to go...

Personally, I don't think there's only one cause. I think there is probably an unfortunate combination of factors, but I think the most likely one has to do with economic disparities among black families since the nineteenth century. I won't even call this "systemic racism" - I'll just chalk it up to the historical contingencies of American slavery.

That opportunities for black graduate students exist doesn't necessarily mean that a wide number of black students are aware of such opportunities, or that their background has fostered any interest in applying to such programs. I think we see so few black graduate students because higher education, especially graduate school, resonates overwhelmingly with wealthy and upper-middle class families, and occasionally with students from lower-middle class families; and these tend to be white.

 

[CiG]

The single parent household in the black community is much more prevalent than the two parent household and is practically a guarantee of certain economic hardships regardless of race, two parent black families have a poverty rate of 7%, it seems to me that one of the biggest barriers here is the fact that most black people grow up with one parent, usually one that doesn't work.

 

[Baroque]

The single parent household in the black community is much more prevalent than the two parent household and is practically a guarantee of certain economic hardships regardless of race, two parent black families have a poverty rate of 7%, it seems to me that one of the biggest barriers here is the fact that most black people grow up with one parent, usually one that doesn't work.

This would make sense but it is also the case that there are no Mexican students in the program, in an area with an overwhelmingly large Mexican population. A culture that traditionally has two parents as well.

 

[CiG]

I remember reading something a year ago that claimed Mexican immigrants, Hispanics and Latino people tend to fill other areas like the trades, but I'd have to get back to you on that.

 

[Dak]

Hispanics (particularly ruralized) generally have a cultural disdain for higher ed. That might be starting to shift, but it's there looming in the background.

http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2016/07/28/5-facts-about-latinos-and-education/

Notice the 2 year college trend. I guarantee the bulk of those are specific skills degrees or certs.

 

[CiG]

All the news I'm seeing and hearing about the Charlotte riots is kinda crazy. Saw the footage of the random white guy in the parking lot being beaten up and head-kicked by a group of black "protesters."

 

[Dak]

Every BLM riot about the killing of armed and uncompliant and/or aggressive suspect with a violent rapsheet further discredits the "movement".

 

[rms]

just waiting on the video for that one, but the Tulsa one is undefendable from the police's perspective imo

 

[CiG]

She shouldn't have shot him, but from what I've seen and read it wasn't exactly a good example of racism or clear cut police brutality, since according to police accounts he was completely noncompliant, acting eratic, moving towards his car and going in and out of his pockets and behaving like someone on drugs. Turns out he had a history of PCP.

Just saying.

http://bearingarms.com/bob-o/2016/09/22/betty-shelby-was-justified-in-shooting-terence-crutcher/

 

[rms]

This article's argument is hard to trust since it's literally going to be supported by her fellow cops that day and ambiguous to everyone else. But their body language in the video did not demonstrate a distrust or fear until he got to the window...didn't seem like he was doing his own thing up to that point.

 

[CiG]

This article's argument is hard to trust since it's literally going to be supported by her fellow cops that day and ambiguous to everyone else. But their body language in the video did not demonstrate a distrust or fear until he got to the window...didn't seem like he was doing his own thing up to that point.

That's my hesitation too, but in general I don't believe the narrative that cops are just out looking for any reason to shoot a black person, so I'm willing to grant their version of events. Also what they said seems to align with the things you see and hear in the helicopter footage.

Did you watch that one?

 

[rms]

Yeah I watched the helicopter and the ground one. There's no audio to verify or not verify what she said to him

She pulled out a gun instead of a Taser because she thought he had a weapon, and she was planning to arrest him for being intoxicated in public and possibly obstructing the investigation, Wood said.

dude took like 12 steps before he got to his car, never a warning shot nor taser being used first

Hard to agree with this assessment.

 

[CiG]

The helicopter footage features a man saying "he keeps walking, he's not responding to commands, I think it's time for a taser."

That to me would suggest that they know he was being told to do something other than walk towards his car.

dude took like 12 steps before he got to his car, never a warning shot nor taser being used first

Not sure what your point is here.