If Mort Divine ruled the world

I'll give him credit for referring to the rebuttals to the Vox piece, which was typical tripe from that outlet. But the whole piece looks like a combination of virtue signaling with an attempt to divert the attention of any of its readership from the "dense obscurity" of the science because at the end of the day, what we always need is progressive policies unless you're a racist.

The reason IQ influence needs to be dealt with is, in part, to combat the "disparate outcome" based policies which assume "systemic racism" or "systemic sexism" are the only possible explanations.
 
your quote does not depict his position as neither for or against, just admits it will keep existing

but I was incorrect, he is clearly against discussing the issue to which I took a step further to mean he has no interest in researching it.

n sum, various thinkers insist, some more publicly than others, that we are at fault in not openly “facing” that there is a genetic IQ gap between black people and others. Yet there would seem to be no constructive benefit in “facing” this gap if it exists.

Read more at: http://www.nationalreview.com/article/449208/race-iq-debate-serves-no-purpose

But the IQ issue is different. To discuss it would shed not more heat than light, but all heat and no light.

Read more at: http://www.nationalreview.com/article/449208/race-iq-debate-serves-no-purpose
 
I'll give him credit for referring to the rebuttals to the Vox piece, which was typical tripe from that outlet. But the whole piece looks like a combination of virtue signaling with an attempt to divert the attention of any of its readership from the "dense obscurity" of the science because at the end of the day, what we always need is progressive policies unless you're a racist.

The reason IQ influence needs to be dealt with is, in part, to combat the "disparate outcome" based policies which assume "systemic racism" or "systemic sexism" are the only possible explanations.

Just to let you know, you're part of the reason why no one wants to have the kind of conversation that McWhorter is deigning to participate in. Because even a level-headed and remarkably cogent piece like this is automatically "virtue signalling" or some other alt-online terminology.

You and others have built up this rhetoric of anti-criticism: "We can't say anything because we're labeled as racists." Now someone like McWhorter actually tries to say "Well no, you're not, race is biological and some of the work being done on race and IQ is scientifically sound, if not definitive; but the relationship between this science and the public sphere needs to be addressed."

McWhorter's point, with which I agree, is that even if IQ differences turn out to be, in part, biological (i.e. racial), that doesn't justify the dismantling of programs intended to counteract social disparities. You're basically saying that you want the research to pan out in order to make yourself feel better--i.e. to affirm that it isn't entirely "systemic." But McWhorter is already saying that it's probably not entirely systemic, that there are biological factors.

If the research does pan out, it will be published and it will be discussed--and you can cite it when you get into arguments like this. But it doesn't need to become fodder for public discourse, and the reason is that there are plenty of non- (even anti-) intellectuals out there who will make the most inane and propagandistic bullshit out of such research.

your quote does not depict his position as neither for or against, just admits it will keep existing

but I was incorrect, he is clearly against discussing the issue to which I took a step further to mean he has no interest in researching it.

Yes, you're right he's not explicit about whether he's for or against the research being done. But he admits that it will keep being done, most likely, and he doesn't say that it shouldn't keep being done. The implication is that he doesn't want it to be eliminated. He may very well harbor some personal desire to see the research go away, but I'm confident that McWhorter believes in the power of research, and that he's comfortable in letting all research speak for itself, no matter what it's on.
 
Just to let you know, you're part of the reason why no one wants to have the kind of conversation that McWhorter is deigning to participate in. Because even a level-headed and remarkably cogent piece like this is automatically "virtue signalling" or some other alt-online terminology.

You and others have built up this rhetoric of anti-criticism: "We can't say anything because we're labeled as racists." Now someone like McWhorter actually tries to say "Well no, you're not, race is biological and some of the work being done on race and IQ is scientifically sound, if not definitive; but the relationship between this science and the public sphere needs to be addressed."

Well the piece is level-headed and cogent, but that doesn't make it not an exercise in virtue signaling nor bereft of straw-manning. If you have a different label to describe the behavior the label "virtue-signaling" describes I'd be fine using it instead. The problem I have with that piece is it's an extremely long article that can be summarized as "with all due respect, [enter disrespectful comment]". Or at a minimum "Well that's true but it doesn't matter." Nothing before the comma or the but really matters.


McWhorter's point, with which I agree, is that even if IQ differences turn out to be, in part, biological (i.e. racial), that doesn't justify the dismantling of programs intended to counteract social disparities.

If the research does pan out, it will be published and it will be discussed--and you can cite it when you get into arguments like this. But it doesn't need to become fodder for public discourse, and the reason is that there are plenty of non- (even anti-) intellectuals out there who will make the most inane and propagandistic bullshit out of such research.

It wouldn't justify dismantling them, rather it would eliminate one of the justifications for having them to begin with. There are other empirical considerations though (like how they aren't improving outcomes).

The complaint that we can't discuss the truth because some people will misinterpret it is a nonstarter for both ethical and empirical reasons. The truth cannot be "problematic", and not allowing it into public discourse cedes the frame on the issue to exactly those sorts of anti-intellectuals you're concerned about. "You're not racist, you're just enabling the racists." Whew, and I almost thought science and the pursuit of truth was in the clear.
 
Well the piece is level-headed and cogent, but that doesn't make it not an exercise in virtue signaling nor bereft of straw-manning. If you have a different label to describe the behavior the label "virtue-signaling" describes I'd be fine using it instead. The problem I have with that piece is it's an extremely long article that can be summarized as "with all due respect, [enter disrespectful comment]". Or at a minimum "Well that's true but it doesn't matter." Nothing before the comma or the but really matters.

It's long because it's an article. And it makes all the points it does because if it didn't, you'd criticize it for that too.

There's really no winning with you.

It wouldn't justify dismantling them, rather it would eliminate one of the justifications for having them to begin with. There are other empirical considerations though (like how they aren't improving outcomes).

That's laughable.

It could be that people on welfare (or comparable programs) would die without the support. But we won't ever know that, will we?

The complaint that we can't discuss the truth because some people will misinterpret it is a nonstarter for both ethical and empirical reasons. The truth cannot be "problematic", and not allowing it into public discourse cedes the frame on the issue to exactly those sorts of anti-intellectuals you're concerned about. "You're not racist, you're just enabling the racists." Whew, and I almost thought science and the pursuit of truth was in the clear.

The truth is often problematic. Thank goodness we don't just succumb to base biological instincts.
 
It's long because it's an article. And it makes all the points it does because if it didn't, you'd criticize it for that too.

There's really no winning with you.

Not when an article is pushing goodthinkfulness or more limitedly, possibly, in the case of this article, goodspeakfulness.

It could be that people on welfare (or comparable programs) would die without the support. But we won't ever know that, will we?

They are dying on the support, just for different reasons. Transfer payments, at the receiving end, are simply an enabler. There's nothing inherently positive about that enabling.
 
Virtue-signalling as a phrase goes back way before the alt-right existed, pretty slimy to slip that insinuation in there @Einherjar86

Sorry if it pissed you off. I gave about 0.3 seconds' thought to that comment, mainly because I've seen Dak and other like-minded posters use it. I wasn't insinuating anything about its history.

Not when an article is pushing goodthinkfulness or more limitedly, possibly, in the case of this article, goodspeakfulness.

They are dying on the support, just for different reasons. Transfer payments, at the receiving end, are simply an enabler. There's nothing inherently positive about that enabling.

Maybe you don't realize that transfer payments could be "enablers" and still help people survive who otherwise wouldn't.

But of course, you're talking about enablement as if it's fact, when it's not.

So thanks for your opinion. I think this is over.
 
Suit yourself.

Speaking of not liking saying something despite just saying everything should be aired (and also speaking of a shitty "journalism" site):

https://www.vox.com/conversations/2017/6/27/15873072/google-porn-addiction-america-everybody-lies

Porn featuring violence against women is also extremely popular among women. It is far more popular among women than men. I hate saying that because misogynists seem to love this fact. Fantasy life isn't always politically correct.

The rate at which women watch violent porn is roughly the same in every part of the world. It isn’t correlated with how women are treated.

Here's where I can offer a similar criticism to the criticism I offered of the USMC "hitpiece" in the News Thread: Numbers would be nice.
 
I don't even know what a real army one was like, mine was such a joke. Head DS got fired around 5 week point, 2nd in command was FOB hispanic who no one could understand when he spoke and I think we only had 1 more DS the rest of the cycle
 
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All other artillery guys went to OK for basic too and I went to the one in SC which is usually for everyone but combat MOS's lol