Music Downloading and his consequences

[darcy]

About downloading. I have never ever downloaded a single song from the internet and yet I get along just fine in life and music. I have a collection that spans 1300+ cds and all styles of hardrock and metal. Of course I've bought a few cds which I then discovered weren't that good. That's part of the charm for me though. I love placing an order for 4-5 albums/bands I've never heard (=only heard OF) and then sitting down in my comfy sofa to listen through them. If the album really, really sucks I sell it at Tradera or Ebay and get half/a third of my money back. That money is then used to buy another album. That way I can buy a really good album (or another bad one hahaha) for half the cost A fool's logic, I know, but it works for me

That's great and all, if you can afford it... but I don't have that kind of money.
I rarely download full albums, I much prefer to buy, but ultimately I blame the labels & records stores for horribly gouging the buying public for CD's. It was working fine for them back maybe 10 or 15 years ago when everyone was re-buying albums they have on vinyl or tape, and nobody could download music... they had us by the balls. Downloading is more or less the result of horribly overpriced CD's being combatted by internet technology.

Also- nobody wants to buy a CD for $20 if they only want to here 1 or 2 songs on it, but record labels stopped releasing singles because, again, they had us by the balls and we could only buy what they would sell. So little kids who only have a couple dollars get in the habit of downloading, rather than spending their pocket change on a single. They'll never get into the habit of buying CD's if there's no reason to start.

Of course, record labels also have their artists at their mercy more or less (until you're very big) so when record sales go down, they take it out on the artists instead of dealing with it themselves.

This is all more to do with major labels etc than indie metal stuff of course- but I find most metal fans buy what CD's they can, most of the time. Metal fans are usually more devoted than casual pop music fans.

 

[s0nspark]

Downloading:These matters has been discussed many times before and I don't want to spend more time on the subject. The only thing I feel is important to understand is that you can't get everything in life for free. It feel like that the modern society has become like that, people get uppset if they don't get it for free....

mr V

Exactly... and I have a question. This is not meant as a troll or an attempt to start some kind of argument... it is just an honest question...

What is the best way to support the artist? What I mean is, if I have $25 to spend and want as much of that to benefit the artist, what would be the best way to spend it?

I ask because CD prices for imports are rather high and I suspect that 99% of that money goes to all the middlemen between the artist and me.

Please understand, I'm not trying to build a case to support downloading rather than buying CDs!! When I can find them, I always buy CDs of the music I listen to ... for the artwork, liner notes, and higher fidelity. I am just genuinely interested in seeing as much of the money I spend go to the artist as possible. To put it another way, I am tired of seeing everyone but the artist profit from their art and genius... I want my money going in the right hands.

So mr V ... what, besides sending you cash, works best?

Oh, I do know this will vary from artist to artist as they often have different arrangements depending on whether they are independently signed or run their own label or what ever... I'd just like some insight.

Cheers,
Tim

 

[Draugen]

Perhaps a bit off the topic, but I just have to add something to this discussion.
I talked a bit with my friend in Blodsrit a few weeks ago and he said that, out of the 500 CDs and 100 t-shirts they got from their record company, within a couple of weeks they had sold 3 CDs and ALL of the t-shirts(!).
Basicly, people seem to download the records and buy the shirts. Another example; I don't think it's a big secret any longer that Cradle Of Filth sells way more shirts than records - this is just how the world looks today...

 

[Naglfar]

Perhaps a bit off the topic, but I just have to add something to this discussion.
I talked a bit with my friend in Blodsrit a few weeks ago and he said that, out of the 500 CDs and 100 t-shirts they got from their record company, within a couple of weeks they had sold 3 CDs and ALL of the t-shirts(!).
Basicly, people seem to download the records and buy the shirts. Another example; I don't think it's a big secret any longer that Cradle Of Filth sells way more shirts than records - this is just how the world looks today...

Be surprised how many people would have purchased songs if they made them available on iTunes or downloadable online... ahehehe...

 

[paradoxile]

ehm...my guess is not that many
cd= better sound quality+lasting for years(protection layer)+artwork

 

[Naglfar]

ehm...my guess is not that many
cd= better sound quality+lasting for years(protection layer)+artwork

I dunno about Israel, but in the US, if it's not digital, people don't like to buy it. It's one of the reason that CD sales, for every genre, are doing so wretchedly over here. Americans like to click on their itunes and find the song they want in a couple of seconds. If you charge for convenience, Americans will pay!

 

[George]

I dunno about Israel, but in the US, if it's not digital, people don't like to buy it. It's one of the reason that CD sales, for every genre, are doing so wretchedly over here. Americans like to click on their itunes and find the song they want in a couple of seconds. If you charge for convenience, Americans will pay!

Most, but not all.

 

[Alteredmindeath]

Im american and I am very patient, i don't need to rush through life like some spoiled little girl and download everything and demand everything. I patiently await the new Vintersorg on cd format for my stereo, which will be purchased in u.s. funds.

 

[paradoxile]

I dunno about Israel, but in the US, if it's not digital, people don't like to buy it. It's one of the reason that CD sales, for every genre, are doing so wretchedly over here. Americans like to click on their itunes and find the song they want in a couple of seconds. If you charge for convenience, Americans will pay!

In Israel digital downloads are unavailable and I don't it would work here even if it was available.

there are too many people here who download music illegaly via various p2p softwares and they would say...hey why pay for song to download off the internet when i can not pay for a song to download of the internet.
The download thing as an alternative to bootleg cd's started because of the incredible high prices original cd's are sold today in the country.
in just 8 years standard cd prices have almost doubled from 60NIS to nearly a 100NIS(100NIS according to todays currency is 23.70$US)
it's no wonder that singles to get imported here...the few singles that do get imported here cost 45NIS(10.66$US).
I used to wait to my yearly trip to the city of Eilat which was almost at its entirety duty free and would blow about 1000NIS there on cd's every time becasue prices were normal.
I assume that in the us the digital download flourished because a lot of americans are fat and lazy as fuck...too lazy to go to the mall or the walmart to get their music.

 

[Naglfar]

In Israel digital downloads are unavailable and I don't it would work here even if it was available.

there are too many people here who download music illegaly via various p2p softwares and they would say...hey why pay for song to download off the internet when i can not pay for a song to download of the internet.
The download thing as an alternative to bootleg cd's started because of the incredible high prices original cd's are sold today in the country.
in just 8 years standard cd prices have almost doubled from 60NIS to nearly a 100NIS(100NIS according to todays currency is 23.70$US)
it's no wonder that singles to get imported here...the few singles that do get imported here cost 45NIS(10.66$US).
I used to wait to my yearly trip to the city of Eilat which was almost at its entirety duty free and would blow about 1000NIS there on cd's every time becasue prices were normal.
I assume that in the us the digital download flourished because a lot of americans are fat and lazy as fuck...too lazy to go to the mall or the walmart to get their music.

I don't know any statistics off the top of my head, but it may be because Americans, at least younger ones, are larely internet addicts, and those who aren't still are really comfy with the internet. So if you can give them stuff on the internet, they'll buy it.

I dunno about lazy, though... Americans are fat because of their eating habits, not because they don't have the will to drive to the mall. It's also a lot more convenient to buy just a couple of songs you like, and not 17 bucks for an album.

 

[Alec Walter Conway]

Perhaps a bit off the topic, but I just have to add something to this discussion.
I talked a bit with my friend in Blodsrit a few weeks ago and he said that, out of the 500 CDs and 100 t-shirts they got from their record company, within a couple of weeks they had sold 3 CDs and ALL of the t-shirts(!).
Basicly, people seem to download the records and buy the shirts. Another example; I don't think it's a big secret any longer that Cradle Of Filth sells way more shirts than records - this is just how the world looks today...

Gotta start distributing the album as a goodie when you buy the shirt then hehe

 

[Braighs]

I assume that in the us the digital download flourished because a lot of americans are fat and lazy as fuck...too lazy to go to the mall or the walmart to get their music.

If I saw a Vintersorg cd in my walmart (The biggest in the world or maybe that's just because it's the newest and they keep getting bigger ) I would have to check my pulse.

 

[paradoxile]

If I saw a Vintersorg cd in my walmart (The biggest in the world or maybe that's just because it's the newest and they keep getting bigger ) I would have to check my pulse.

I don't know...I heared at the time they sold Ghost Reveries at walmart so I imagined they had a big selection of cd's and assumed they get good stuff from sweden.
here we barely have metal at the metal department at tower records.

 

[Alteredmindeath]

First off in america...You don't get good music at wall mart or the mall, we are lucky to find a cool underground music shop somewhere and most of them usually end up closing down due to lack of business anyway. The best place to find metal cd's now is online.

The fast food industry is creating new generations of obese kids here(Mcdonalds, Wendys, Burger King, Rallys, Pizza hut), these unhealthy franchises are leading to many premature deaths and heart attacks. Not enough healthy food spots here, but I have also met some fat people that don't have one lazy bone in their body, they are just cursed with bad genes.

 

[paradoxile]

First off in america...You don't get good music at wall mart or the mall, we are lucky to find a cool underground music shop somewhere and most of them usually end up closing down due to lack of business anyway. The best place to find metal cd's now is online.

The fast food industry is creating new generations of obese kids here(Mcdonalds, Wendys, Burger King, Rallys, Pizza hut), these unhealthy franchises are leading to many premature deaths and heart attacks. Not enough healthy food spots here, but I have also met some fat people that don't have one lazy bone in their body, they are just cursed with bad genes.

so it's not very different from here just on a bigger scale.
Off course there are also people with bad genes who are fat because of nature, I never spoke of those people

 

[Naglfar]

First off in america...You don't get good music at wall mart or the mall, we are lucky to find a cool underground music shop somewhere and most of them usually end up closing down due to lack of business anyway. The best place to find metal cd's now is online.

The fast food industry is creating new generations of obese kids here(Mcdonalds, Wendys, Burger King, Rallys, Pizza hut), these unhealthy franchises are leading to many premature deaths and heart attacks. Not enough healthy food spots here, but I have also met some fat people that don't have one lazy bone in their body, they are just cursed with bad genes.

It's better in some states than in others. Like, in college towns and the city in New York you can find plenty. South Florida is pretty good too, and the big midwest cities, especially Chicago, are really good about music in general, not just metal. I'm sure it's also similar in California.

Funny though, in San Juan, Puerto Rico (where I'm from) the absolute best place to buy metal is in the trendiest shop in one of the largest, trendiest malls in the world. The manager is a metalhead with his own small label, and there's a fucking great power metal / assorted metal (that's how it's divided) shrine, plus local bands he produces. Good stuff!

 

[Braighs]

I don't know...I heared at the time they sold Ghost Reveries at walmart so I imagined they had a big selection of cd's and assumed they get good stuff from sweden.
here we barely have metal at the metal department at tower records.

I bought GR at a Walmart on release day. Opeth tours extensively here and has the biggest fanbase of any supposed "underground" metal band. It's funny though, because they don't have a metal section. I was trying to figure out if Opeth was Rock, Pop, or R'n'B .

 

[paradoxile]

it is R'n'B...
to quote Mikael :"the first song i ever wrote was called, I hate Hiphop"
Opeth aren't underground anymore...not when signed to Roadrunner, they aren't plus they made a video...they're still "extreme" and a mighty fine band...just not underground

 

[tit]

well i agree about the kids today. they are dipshits anyways, so i don't even get mad. i just let them go on with their nonsense. actually i have cd's older than most of them anyways so i don't care. as for dl. i use it to check out bands and get some advanced stuff. however i love holding the cd. i love the artwork and i want to read the inlay to see who wrote what or who sung and played what. to me i don't get any more high than holding a cd that i love. if you have a music collection on your hard drive you are either a. dirt poor, which i can't understand, or you are as mr v. says want everything for free. i have a band and i record but i have a good job too so i just rather get on with that. you guys are right, bands don't make shit but i still love getting the cd's and just having it and reading it. it's like a prize i get for working my nuts off all week!!

t

 

[paradoxile]

with all due respect there's a thick grey area between a and b