Pedophilia

[AIDS]

I agree.

In Ancient Cultures, the taking of a young boy as a sexual companion by an older, experienced man was quite the norm. However, this was entirely commonplace, so there was no trauma involved, per se. Today, such an act is socially forbidden, and thus doing so can traumatise the child/family to such a large extent it is quite unfathomable. In turn this drives paedophiles to become predatory in their search for a sexual companion - and THAT area is what sickens me the most.

My studies of ancient cultures has led me to believe the intrinsic act of sex with a child is not evil without some social context, and given our current social context, paedophilia is outright abhorrent.

If we look at the greek culture (which often is asociated with the behaviour you described) the taking of a younger boy must be seen in a greater context because sexuality was just one of many sides of the relationship, others being for example teaching (when the older shares his knowledge to the younger). This creates a kind of companionship where they both give and take, something that differs greatly from pedophilia. It's also important to note that the boys where taken by the older men from the day they turned 14 and onwards until military service, so one could argue that they mostly already had reached sexual maturity.

This behaviour was not by any means the norm in greek society. It was strictly an aristocratic trend.

 

[Kenneth R.]

the 2nd sentance seems to contradict the 3rd sentance

not in the slightest.

i am through with this topic, i've said all i can say, and it seems a few of you are just beyond understanding (or attached to it in some disgusting way) so i will not further waste my time on such deaf ears.

 

[ranma187]

this is a horrifically inacurate generalization different people develop psychologically at vastly different speeds there are 13 year-old girls that suck dick instead of doing the act that produces children because they understand enough to be suductively/maliciously getting money/drugs and/or "favors" from "people with power" but on the otherside of that is the girls that suck dick or "experiment with women" instead of doing intercourse because they are scared to death of getting pregnant because they are observant enough to notice how immature they are and that there's no way in hell they are going to be able to be good mothers
BTW the movie the "40 year-old virgin" was based on a true story

This can be true in a sense. some of the most disgusting talk i have ever heard came from 12-14 year old girls. The fact that they are aware of it but really don't know what they are talking about concerns me

 

[derek]

If we look at the greek culture (which often is asociated with the behaviour you described) the taking of a younger boy must be seen in a greater context because sexuality was just one of many sides of the relationship, others being for example teaching (when the older shares his knowledge to the younger). This creates a kind of companionship where they both give and take, something that differs greatly from pedophilia. It's also important to note that the boys where taken by the older men from the day they turned 14 and onwards until military service, so one could argue that they mostly already had reached sexual maturity.

This behaviour was not by any means the norm in greek society. It was strictly an aristocratic trend.

My point was more to illustrate the different sexual attitudes apparent through time, in order to show that sexual desires are often not intrinsically evil but more contextually evil. Although I do concur with what you've said.

 

[mengeloid]

one of the reasons pedophilia is so commonplace is because the broader culture worships the virginal and infantilises everyone.. FP is right, this has been with us probably forever. and its unlikely to go away.but perhaps a less exploitative and predatory society than this would produce adults better able to restrain themselves for the sake of another's quality of life.. that'd be nice

 

[AIDS]

My point was more to illustrate the different sexual attitudes apparent through time, in order to show that sexual desires are often not intrinsically evil but more contextually evil.

And I agree with that, my post being more of an attempt to make distictions between pedophilia (as seen in the first post) and the traditions of the ancients.

 

[derek]

And I agree with that, my post being more of an attempt to make distictions between pedophilia (as seen in the first post) and the traditions of the ancients.

No worries then.

I probably equated it to pedophilia too readily. There was an element of child-love in the relationship the ancients had with young men that we would regard pedophilic, and that was where I was focusing my attention.

 

[LORD_RED_DRAGON]

This can be true in a sense. some of the most disgusting talk i have ever heard came from 12-14 year old girls.

same here the last time i saw a pregnant girl she was only 12 and i know girls that are even younger that are already using blowjobs and eating pussy as a contraceptive because all the females i know are getting their first periods at 8 or 9 these young girls' minds getting warped is partially (if not mostly) (in the usa atleast) the result of the locally produced and distributed (usa) food that doesn't meet the quality standards of being able to get shipped across state lines being crammed full of steroids and hormones
the tallest female that i've ever seen in person also had freaky wide hips with buns of steel, 6-pack abs and double-D cup boobs standing on her knees in the grass of her front lawn with her hands inside my pants groping my dick and going on and on about how much she loves sucking dick and she's wanting to suck my dick but the reason i turn down the blowjob is because she wants to do it in public because we are on her front lawn and we can't go into her house because she's only 12 and her parents are in the house. the girl i just described was only 12 years-old
the biggest boobs i've ever seen in person that i know for a fact weren't breast implants was a girl wearing an H-cup bra and bitching about it being a little too small and i know that those boobs couldn't possibly have been implants because i knew that this girl was only 13
so i think that maybe the reason that tr_ofdallas was getting so emotional about this subject is because i know that just about every single female she's ever met is using fake IDs to get laid which i think is something she's already talked about here

 

[ranma187]

same here the last time i saw a pregnant girl she was only 12 and i know girls that are even younger that are already using blowjobs and eating pussy as a contraceptive because all the females i know are getting their first periods at 8 or 9 these young girls' minds getting warped is partially (if not mostly) (in the usa atleast) the result of the locally produced and distributed (usa) food that doesn't meet the quality standards of being able to get shipped across state lines being crammed full of steroids and hormones
the tallest female that i've ever seen in person also had freaky wide hips with buns of steel, 6-pack abs and double-D cup boobs standing on her knees in the grass of her front lawn with her hands inside my pants groping my dick and going on and on about how much she loves sucking dick and she's wanting to suck my dick but the reason i turn down the blowjob is because she wants to do it in public because we are on her front lawn and we can't go into her house because she's only 12 and her parents are in the house. the girl i just described was only 12 years-old
the biggest boobs i've ever seen in person that i know for a fact weren't breast implants was a girl wearing an H-cup bra and bitching about it being a little too small and i know that those boobs couldn't possibly have been implants because i knew that this girl was only 13
so i think that maybe the reason that tr_ofdallas was getting so emotional about this subject is because i know that just about every single female she's ever met is using fake IDs to get laid which i think is something she's already talked about here

that is fucking funnily disturbing, it's not funny!

 

[LORD_RED_DRAGON]

that is fucking funnily disturbing, it's not funny!

it wasn't supposed to be funny... for a lot of people what i described is the status quo of their lives/lives of ther close personal freinds... it was supposed to be scary/food for thought NOT humorous

 

[VikingSF]

This thread is getting to be as disturbing as the topic that started it. uke:

 

[LORD_RED_DRAGON]

This thread is getting to be as disturbing as the topic that started it. uke:

and you're surprized?!?

 

[Norsemaiden]

I totally believe what LRD says about the situation where he lives. It may seem freaky to the people who don't live in a black ghetto area - but its a completely different planet there. I truly recommend that people open their eyes to the different types of communities there are and why they are like that and can't be "up graded" into anything much better. If anything, what you've got there is going to spread and become the norm everywhere else, because liberals stick their heads in the sand and believe lies about humans being all the same and all wanting the same things.
Blacks natuarlly reach puberty before whites as they are primitive - but the hormones in food are having an effect.

I live in a white middleclass area in Northern England and I have talked to a very nice and intelligent girl , aged 13, who I know is 100% trustworthy. She has difficulties finding anyone nice to be her friend at school and has a gang of girls she hangs out with and she's sort of vying to be the top girl in the group with her former friend who she's fallen out with as this girl is always boasting about having sex and that she has shagged every guy in the rugby team. She wants my friend to appologise to her for calling her whore and falling out. The other girls don't mind much, but they buy "Playboy" branded products and think it would be brilliant to be a topless model. They are more like chavs, and the ones that are metal heads (commercial stuff like system of a down) brag that they are bi-sexual as if that alone was something to admire them for. So this poor girl often weeps about how sick they all are.
She shouldn't have to deal with this situation at such a young age.

LRD's posts are upsetting or annoying to some of you, but I think he presents views that are alien to most people on this board and it is a kind of hpocritical racism to say that he shouldn't be allowed to contribute. LRD can tell us so much about a side of America that if I tried to speculate on, as a white woman, you would think I was being really prejudiced.

 

[LORD_RED_DRAGON]

I totally believe what LRD says about the situation where he lives. It may seem freaky to the people who don't live in a black ghetto area - but its a completely different planet there. I truly recommend that people open their eyes to the different types of communities there are and why they are like that and can't be "up graded" into anything much better. If anything, what you've got there is going to spread and become the norm everywhere else, because liberals stick their heads in the sand and believe lies about humans being all the same and all wanting the same things.
Blacks natuarlly reach puberty before whites as they are primitive - but the hormones in food are having an effect.

I live in a white middleclass area in Northern England and I have talked to a very nice and intelligent girl , aged 13, who I know is 100% trustworthy. She has difficulties finding anyone nice to be her friend at school and has a gang of girls she hangs out with and she's sort of vying to be the top girl in the group with her former friend who she's fallen out with as this girl is always boasting about having sex and that she has shagged every guy in the rugby team. She wants my friend to appologise to her for calling her whore and falling out. The other girls don't mind much, but they buy "Playboy" branded products and think it would be brilliant to be a topless model. They are more like chavs, and the ones that are metal heads (commercial stuff like system of a down) brag that they are bi-sexual as if that alone was something to admire them for. So this poor girl often weeps about how sick they all are.
She shouldn't have to deal with this situation at such a young age.

LRD's posts are upsetting or annoying to some of you, but I think he presents views that are alien to most people on this board and it is a kind of hpocritical racism to say that he shouldn't be allowed to contribute. LRD can tell us so much about a side of America that if I tried to speculate on, as a white woman, you would think I was being really prejudiced.

well, from my POV it's really pretty fucking obvious that what's going on here is that most of the people posting here (on this specific forum, not ultimatemetal.com) fit really nicely into this tiny little sub-set of society, with really similar life experiences, and that you're totally oblivious to the worlds outside your own. There are experiences like being raped and whitnessing murder that you won't really fully understand untill you've experienced them yourself, and i think that living in my world is definately one of them. You people seem to think i'm a profesional fantasy writer and that i'm just making up stuff because of my extremely detailed descriptions of ghettoville seem so completely unbelieveable to self-absobed personality type of most of the preptown people that would have any interest in visiting a philosophy type forum

 

[Demiurge]

well, see here's where you're not really getting me the way that I think Lord Red Dragon would, what I really mean is that trying to determine the age that a child is ready to have sex is something that should be determined on a completely individual level without trying to compare the child's psychological or physical development with anyone else's development in any way whatsoever

That is something a child would say. How would you ever enforce the law if each individual followed different laws? I could rape a 5 year old and say he was ready for it, then his parents would say that he wasn't. It could be proven with physical samples that I did, indeed, have sex with the child, but that wouldn't lay the matter to rest. There would be no way to resolve a case because there would be no law to reveal the legality of the action. Every case would require the construction of a jurisprudential system that would apply to that case only. Can you even begin to comprehend the degree to which these litigations would bog down the system? The very idea of it is insane.

As an aside, I would find nothing unethical per se about sex with a girl 6 years my junior(that would make her 15). I am in a period of self-imposed isolation for the nonce, though.

 

[LORD_RED_DRAGON]

That is something a child would say. How would you ever enforce the law if each individual followed different laws? I could rape a 5 year old and say he was ready for it, then his parents would say that he wasn't. It could be proven with physical samples that I did, indeed, have sex with the child, but that wouldn't lay the matter to rest. There would be no way to resolve a case because there would be no law to reveal the legality of the action. Every case would require the construction of a jurisprudential system that would apply to that case only. Can you even begin to comprehend the degree to which these litigations would bog down the system? The very idea of it is insane.

As an aside, I would find nothing unethical per se about sex with a girl 6 years my junior(that would make her 15). I am in a period of self-imposed isolation for the nonce, though.

apparently tr ofdallas isn't really as good at articulating her thoughts as i am although i think it's pretty clear that what she was trying to say was that when it comes to sexuality different kids develop at vastly different speeds

 

[NeverIsForever]

there are still issues with her logic though.

maybe he doesn't have to, maybe if a girl (or a guy) is biologically old enough to recieve orgasmic pleasure from sex their old enough to be allowed to experience that pleasure

the only solution that i can see is to lower the age of legal sexual consent. Right now it's different ages in different places with the youngest being 14. My idea would be to just make that universal. Any person anywhere can have sex at 14.

how stupid is this?

are you suggesting that any person anywhere, at age 14, would be able to deal with the potential consequences of intercourse--i.e. having and raising a child?

i want to meet the 14-year-olds, raised in American society, that you believe would be capable of this. Even supposing it is legal for them to have sex and they are emotionally mature enough for it, it’s not legal for them to do everything else necessary for parenthood. they can’t get jobs that will pay enough to support a kid, they can’t drive. either the girl has to get an abortion, give the kid up for adoption, or become a further burden to her parents by having them raise the kid for her. yeah that’s a good solution…

 

[derek]

I think the current age of 16 for the age of consent is a reasonable one. I think at 16 and over we can expect most people to be entirely aware of what they are doing (even if they do not realise the consequences).

I still believe that sex education should be taught from an early age, in a steady, truthful and open manner. Pretending sex does not exist only tempts children more, liberals and the religious right need left out of it, a pragamatic approach should be taken where sex is approached as a natural element of life.

 

[LORD_RED_DRAGON]

does anyone remember that female sex doctor that went on american TV saying that reaching orgasm through blowjobs and and pussy eating should be taught as a method of pregnancy prevention in the school system's sex ed classes??? what are you guys' thoughts on this idea???

 

[derek]

does anyone remember that female sex doctor that went on american TV saying that reaching orgasm through blowjobs and and pussy eating should be taught as a method of pregnancy prevention in the school system's sex ed classes??? what are you guys' thoughts on this idea???

I silly response to the problem.

Fair and open education about sex from an early age would prevent the need for a drastic solution.