Relentless Reckless Forever (Out March 8th, 2011)
- Thread starter (__Joonas__)
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Andry_Wildchild
Member
Gotta start preparing my neck already for some severe headbanging I guess.
But, like I said, ALWAYS when a new album comes out, it's hyped as the best. This time - after the somewhat (commonly considered) idea-lacking Blooddrunk, the same shit again attitude, no-comments this year before they're in studio, the producer etc - you should not have high expectations for this album, which could be why the label made this "magnified tenfold" slogan, and the impression that it's gonna please old and new fans alike; to save the situation and get sold.
The band would NEVER describe their music as "the perfect storm", they're too professional for that. They're not The Darkness who once stated 'we'll soon be the only band people ever knew of' after they got one new pop song out in MTV. But they're musicians who deliver an analytical description, not marketing people / label. I'll rather be skeptical and then be surprised, than go along with all the hype and be disappointed. But it's really cool if they're making a stunning record and that press statement is justified, then I'll kneel in front of the music.
The recent comments have made me thrilled, as I wasn't expecting this silence to end up in "we took all you love about the band and made it shitloads better." They're better musicians than us, they owe us nothing, and if their album doesn't suit some fan's pink-ass taste of metal, then too bad, but of course when giving a piece of your soul to the band's music you expect it to be good enough to worship, not just good enough to listen to.
I pray it's so good I can't stop blasting it, it would make drinking beer so much more fun, and life worth living even if you were vegetable!
But, like I said, ALWAYS when a new album comes out, it's hyped as the best. This time - after the somewhat (commonly considered) idea-lacking Blooddrunk, the same shit again attitude, no-comments this year before they're in studio, the producer etc - you should not have high expectations for this album, which could be why the label made this "magnified tenfold" slogan, and the impression that it's gonna please old and new fans alike; to save the situation and get sold.
The band would NEVER describe their music as "the perfect storm", they're too professional for that. They're not The Darkness who once stated 'we'll soon be the only band people ever knew of' after they got one new pop song out in MTV. But they're musicians who deliver an analytical description, not marketing people / label. I'll rather be skeptical and then be surprised, than go along with all the hype and be disappointed. But it's really cool if they're making a stunning record and that press statement is justified, then I'll kneel in front of the music.
The recent comments have made me thrilled, as I wasn't expecting this silence to end up in "we took all you love about the band and made it shitloads better." They're better musicians than us, they owe us nothing, and if their album doesn't suit some fan's pink-ass taste of metal, then too bad, but of course when giving a piece of your soul to the band's music you expect it to be good enough to worship, not just good enough to listen to.
I pray it's so good I can't stop blasting it, it would make drinking beer so much more fun, and life worth living even if you were vegetable!
"K-Man studio update. The guys are rock'n through this and Janne should be showing up any min 
This shit be proper!"
http://twitter.com/KmanCOBHC
This shit be proper!"http://twitter.com/KmanCOBHC
Hi K-Man,
do you happen to know Matt Hyde's policy on the loudness war? Do you think there's a chance COB's new album will have an increased dynamic range compared to, say, BD and AYDY?
do you happen to know Matt Hyde's policy on the loudness war? Do you think there's a chance COB's new album will have an increased dynamic range compared to, say, BD and AYDY?
children of COB
Deadnight Drinker
No, he himself won't let that happen. Plus, Janne knows some shit of his own in that (iirc he recorded, mixed and mastered, helped by K-man, the whole Japanese Hospitality by Warmen, his other band), so I'm fairly confident that COB's new album won't go Death Magnetic-style as far as the mixing and mastering goes.
How do you think it should be done / mixed / mastered?
Yesterday I listened to Hatebreeder from start to finish. After that AYDY, and it sounded so weird in comparison, a muddy sound (+ crappy guitar tone?) almost as if they tried to acquire something by placing the importance of heavy elements on top of lead elements. The echo in the drums is quite long too. I always knew this but it strikes you in straight comparison. It was stunning to hear how quiet the solos were mixed compared to HB, I realized it when the LDB unison kicked in. If I was mixing AYDY, I would put guitars more on top, synthesizers way more on top, and shorten the drum echo a bit.
I think Blooddrunk has maybe the best drums, nice heaviness, not too long echo like AYDY, not too short like HB, better balance with leads and heaviness, somewhere on the scale between AYDY and HB. The newest recordings, the few cover tracks, were probably an improvement on Blooddrunk, more character in the guitar tone, but it's difficult to imagine how actual COB songs would sound like that..
I always thought there's something wrong about Hatebreeder too and it's quite clear when you play the intro of Towards Dead End. I think it's screaming for more bass and heaviness for drums, especially as the guitar tone is clear like a dentist's drill.. well at least they all sound different.
Yesterday I listened to Hatebreeder from start to finish. After that AYDY, and it sounded so weird in comparison, a muddy sound (+ crappy guitar tone?) almost as if they tried to acquire something by placing the importance of heavy elements on top of lead elements. The echo in the drums is quite long too. I always knew this but it strikes you in straight comparison. It was stunning to hear how quiet the solos were mixed compared to HB, I realized it when the LDB unison kicked in. If I was mixing AYDY, I would put guitars more on top, synthesizers way more on top, and shorten the drum echo a bit.
I think Blooddrunk has maybe the best drums, nice heaviness, not too long echo like AYDY, not too short like HB, better balance with leads and heaviness, somewhere on the scale between AYDY and HB. The newest recordings, the few cover tracks, were probably an improvement on Blooddrunk, more character in the guitar tone, but it's difficult to imagine how actual COB songs would sound like that..
I always thought there's something wrong about Hatebreeder too and it's quite clear when you play the intro of Towards Dead End. I think it's screaming for more bass and heaviness for drums, especially as the guitar tone is clear like a dentist's drill.. well at least they all sound different.
children of COB
Deadnight Drinker
What do I think they should do?
Get rid of the "crispyness" of Blooddrunk. It was good for a change and felt good because guitars were again strong on top unlike AYDY, but listening to it with some time, it's too crispy and not clear enough imho. AYDY's tone was mixed a bit too low maybe, but still was clear and it did have strength, just that it needed a bit more presence, HCD's for me COB at it's best as far as sound is concerned, FTR is different but great too, HB is crystal clear production and it may had done with a bit more bass but I don't think it'd have the same effect then, so I don't want to see that production again but because I think it only fits (and really good) HB. SW is out of question, it was the first and could've done with much cleaner guitar tones and more defined sound in genera.
As far as the new album is concerned, I like how bass sounded in BD (separate tracks for DWEDFN show clearly that the bass sound is ace), I dig the vocals and the drums are quite ok (bass drum a bit stronger/deeper sound maybe) but I thought guitars and keys were a bit too sharp. Get the keys a bit more body, the guitars maybe a bit less treble and I think it's good to go.
If I'm to choose an already existing tone, T,L&S tone is to me the best COB has had.
Get rid of the "crispyness" of Blooddrunk. It was good for a change and felt good because guitars were again strong on top unlike AYDY, but listening to it with some time, it's too crispy and not clear enough imho. AYDY's tone was mixed a bit too low maybe, but still was clear and it did have strength, just that it needed a bit more presence, HCD's for me COB at it's best as far as sound is concerned, FTR is different but great too, HB is crystal clear production and it may had done with a bit more bass but I don't think it'd have the same effect then, so I don't want to see that production again but because I think it only fits (and really good) HB. SW is out of question, it was the first and could've done with much cleaner guitar tones and more defined sound in genera.
As far as the new album is concerned, I like how bass sounded in BD (separate tracks for DWEDFN show clearly that the bass sound is ace), I dig the vocals and the drums are quite ok (bass drum a bit stronger/deeper sound maybe) but I thought guitars and keys were a bit too sharp. Get the keys a bit more body, the guitars maybe a bit less treble and I think it's good to go.
If I'm to choose an already existing tone, T,L&S tone is to me the best COB has had.
Best tone? Definetly Follow the Reaper (whole album). I mean it sounds sharp, brutal, heavy and yet beautiful and precise. From Hatebreeder I really dig the solo sound from Downfall (1:46-2:05). Sounds so great.
Vocals... man.. I've liked the vocals off of every album so far. Tie My Rope vocals are probably the coolest of the later albums. I mean not lyrically, but the sound of them. No point in saying that Alexi sounded great on Something Wild-FTR... that just won't happen again
Bassguitar has always sounded great in my opinion. Henkka knows his stuff
Vocals... man.. I've liked the vocals off of every album so far. Tie My Rope vocals are probably the coolest of the later albums. I mean not lyrically, but the sound of them. No point in saying that Alexi sounded great on Something Wild-FTR... that just won't happen again
Bassguitar has always sounded great in my opinion. Henkka knows his stuff
You talking about the tone on that song specifically or the T,L&S cd with Knuckleduster?
I can't remember off the top of my head if both those songs had the same tone, but IMO Knuckleduster is the best tone I have ever heard from them.
children of COB
Deadnight Drinker
Couldn't agree with you more.
That's the tone I've been chasing for a while now.
Do you know if it was basically the same set up he used for AYDY? I mean it was around the same time but the tones just don't seem the same.
meh guise, you should always think about how the guitar tone is changed during the mixing process! You might never get exactly the guitar tone of some artist's album because it has been edited a lot.
children of COB
Deadnight Drinker
^That. You won't achieve album tone even if you have the same exact gear.
You can just try to mimic it with what you have, it's the best thing. No matter which equipment you have, if you want an Alexi-ish tone, crank up the mids, not too much highs and about half of bass, and cranck the distortion too. Ofc won't sound like any of the albums, but will be in the style. Still, I'd go for what sounds best (in general, not comparing to Alexi's tone) with what you have, because that'll give you the best of your gear as far as I'm concerned at least.
You can just try to mimic it with what you have, it's the best thing. No matter which equipment you have, if you want an Alexi-ish tone, crank up the mids, not too much highs and about half of bass, and cranck the distortion too. Ofc won't sound like any of the albums, but will be in the style. Still, I'd go for what sounds best (in general, not comparing to Alexi's tone) with what you have, because that'll give you the best of your gear as far as I'm concerned at least.
From your posts, I see you and I are paying attention to different aspects of mixing and mastering. Which is not surprising, seeing as there aren't quite too many metalhead audiophiles out there
This may also be due to the band's new musical attitude, which implies a heavier and less melodic sound. Muddier guitars and less prominent keyboards, together with solos that are less in the foreground, make the record sound heavier, thrashier and maybe a tad more nu-metalish. I remember reading a review for either AYDY or BD in which the reviewer wondered whether Janne was still in the band (so much for less prominent keyboards).
Yep, HB's recording was definitely kind of... dry. It could have used a slightly warmer sound with more bass.
I'd have to agree, albeit partly. Doubled guitars were a blessing to that record, though it still could have used a less boomy bass sound and a higher dynamic range (I can't recall the exact figure, but it wasn't too far from AYDY's and BD's, around 5db). That's why I asked about Matt Hydes policy on the loudness war. Avoiding the Death Magnetic effect is what I consider the very least any band could do for their records; but that doesn't necessarily mean the records won't be compressed. Quite the contrary. Modern CDs are (almost) all heavily compressed, which makes them that much less enjoyable for me. I'm not asking for otherworldly dynamic range figures, but around 10db would be pretty decent (e.g. one of my favorite Threat Signal songs, Counterbalance, has a dynamic range of 9db and it still sounds pretty loud and powerful - I don't see why the same can't be done for any other metal band).
Once again, I'd have to agree with you.
Also one of the best songs, imho.
This may also be due to the band's new musical attitude, which implies a heavier and less melodic sound. Muddier guitars and less prominent keyboards, together with solos that are less in the foreground, make the record sound heavier, thrashier and maybe a tad more nu-metalish. I remember reading a review for either AYDY or BD in which the reviewer wondered whether Janne was still in the band (so much for less prominent keyboards).
Yep, HB's recording was definitely kind of... dry. It could have used a slightly warmer sound with more bass.
I'd have to agree, albeit partly. Doubled guitars were a blessing to that record, though it still could have used a less boomy bass sound and a higher dynamic range (I can't recall the exact figure, but it wasn't too far from AYDY's and BD's, around 5db). That's why I asked about Matt Hydes policy on the loudness war. Avoiding the Death Magnetic effect is what I consider the very least any band could do for their records; but that doesn't necessarily mean the records won't be compressed. Quite the contrary. Modern CDs are (almost) all heavily compressed, which makes them that much less enjoyable for me. I'm not asking for otherworldly dynamic range figures, but around 10db would be pretty decent (e.g. one of my favorite Threat Signal songs, Counterbalance, has a dynamic range of 9db and it still sounds pretty loud and powerful - I don't see why the same can't be done for any other metal band).
Once again, I'd have to agree with you.
Also one of the best songs, imho.
I don't know about the setup, but T,L&S is as far from AYDY as it's from HCDR. They were supposed to rerecord the song for the album and write a new solo, but they figured they can't improve it. Quoting Roope: why remake an already perfect song. Can you imagine that song sounding any better in AYDY sounds? It would probably sound horrible. Obviously there's a distinguishable difference in the song to the rest of the album, it's in a realm of its own; I'm sure many who are not aware it's an original EP song like it as their favorite off AYDY... I'm not saying the AYDY sound is SEVERELY bad, it's just not good enough for COB.
Nothing serious, but now that we're talking mixes etc, doesn't this sound a bit like ADK in FTR tone 0:26 - until before solo. Something about the guitar and Mitch's backing track keys that are quite loud here. Just for wanks. I don't know who owns this vid.
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lY-uIaAVrBc&feature=related[/ame]
FearTheReaper
Member
Angels is meant to sound heavy. I dont think going to a mixing sound in the vein of this would be a good idea. HCDR has the best sound, they need to get closer to that on this new album.
^Of course the album sounds are meant to suit the particular albums' songs. I hope someday in the future fans will be able to 'tune' an artists' songs mixing track volumes separately and maybe even alter the tones etc, always thought that would be some serious fun.
I guess posting a pic of Roope with a fur stick in ear is COB's way of telling they're working on rhythm guitars. Soon wait will be over :hotjump: Can't wait to hear track names.
I guess posting a pic of Roope with a fur stick in ear is COB's way of telling they're working on rhythm guitars. Soon wait will be over :hotjump: Can't wait to hear track names.
FearTheReaper
Member
Indeed.
I enjoyed the "Ftr" angels. It was pretty cool.
Moreover though.
I really hope the albums tone is closer to that of HCDR!
How would everyone feel if the new album regressed a touch to the HCDR sound but added more atmosphere on the keys? Maybe while keeping a touch of the Blooddrunk heaviness?
I enjoyed the "Ftr" angels. It was pretty cool.
Moreover though.
I really hope the albums tone is closer to that of HCDR!
How would everyone feel if the new album regressed a touch to the HCDR sound but added more atmosphere on the keys? Maybe while keeping a touch of the Blooddrunk heaviness?
FearTheReaper
Member
I know that Bodom ISN'T (FIXED SORRY) going to get close to the old sound of FTR and HB again. And i completly respect that. That would'nt be very good, or exciting anyhow. I just hope they dont get worse, and soften up. I hope they dont strip their sound and become more accesible.
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