Scalloped neck...

it might seem the same to you, but i will now go into detail why what i said earlier about fucking up tuning is true:

if you tune your guitar normally, and push down a string to the fretboard, it increases the tension slightly (call it negligble) which in turn makes the note a tiny bit sharp. we don't normally care about this because it's on the order of 1-5 cents on a tuner.

now scallop the neck. you push down further. if you push a string down to the fretboard on a scalloped neck, the distance you moved it is greater. therefore, the tension increase (from stretching the string a longer distance between the fixed endpoints) is greater, and it is more out of tune. this time, it's noticeable and not pleasant.

for that reason, I agree with Ptah (and what I originally said) that it is only good for light-touch techniques where you don't push all the way down. this includes heavily strummed chords, prebent releases, and any other occasion where you have to exert more than minimal force. tapping for example does not require this as you can simply touch lightly (without pushing down all the way) on a scalloped neck, and that is the original point of scalloping - making sweeps and tapping fast and easier. there's a reason the original generation scalloped necks had scallops only on the upper frets.
Sorry man, you are not going into detail in explaining why a scalloped fretboard will make you play out of tune, you are, however, explaining why bad technique will make you play out of tune...

I know I'm jumping in quite a bit late in this discussion, but there seems to be so much mumbo jumbo and misinformation floating around concerning scalloped fretboards, that I thought a bit of clarification was in order...

The fact of the matter is that you should always play with light touch, whether playing chords, tapping, sweeping or bending. In short: if you always use as much force on your instrument, as is needed to bring a guitar with a scalloped fretboard out of tune, you are allways playing out of tune regardless of the guitar you are playing.

I have played scalloped fretboards for close to 5 years now, and have NO problem playing in tune - regardless of which technique I decide to molest my poor guitar with.

Then why do a lot of guitarists experience the "out of tune" phenomena when trying scalloped fretboards for the first time? In honesty, this has nothing to do with the scalloped fretboard in itself, but something to do with mindset of the player. What happens, is that many players are used to feeling the fretboard (even if only ever so slightly) and uses it to gauge how much further the string needs to be moved, in order for it to be fretted properly. When such a player (who is used to gauging the distance between the string and the fret by the fingers' relative proximity to the fretboard) tries a scalloped fretboard, that player will invariably play out of tune (because his mind will tell him to keep pressing, until he can feel his fingers touching the fretboard). Still, any competent guitarist should be capable of relearning this minute bit of technique within a few minutes on a scalloped board... and given 30 minutes, you'll be flying across the fretboard, just as you did before.

However, a scalloped fretboard will not help you play faster, it simply won't make taps easier and sweeping is just as hard/easy on a scalloped fretboard as it is on a regular one... if you are playing with proper fingering technique (precise fingering, light touch etc.), that is! If your technique is lacking, a scalloped fretboard will make it harder to play, not easier.

The only true benefits of a scalloped fretboard are that bends and vibrato are much easier to both perform and control (no more slipping strings) and that you are never slowed down, even the slightest bit, by your fingertips touching a fretboard. However, the scalloped fretboard will force you to clean up your technique... which eventually will help you play faster, sweep better and perform better legato.
An added bonus for me is that I prefer the tone of a maple fretboard, but hate the feel of the laquer usually used to protect the maple. With scalloping, I get the tone of maple without the need to touch a laquered fretboard.

Despite my own preference to scalloped fretboards (I own two scalloped 6-strings and have a custom scalloped 7-string in the works), I highly suggest trying a guitar with a scalloped fretboard for at least a couple of days before taking the plunge and doing an irreversible scallop mod. BTW, I have heard that musiciansfriend.com have a 45 day return policy on the Yngwie Strat...

Cheers

Eske
 
Well said ESKE.

I'm scalloping the rosewood fretboard of an old strat copy at the moment. Can't wait to have it all finished. Recommend if you want to do it yourself, find an old cheap neck to use as a tester before rasping your favourite axe.
 
Too bad he's wrong. Bending requires increasing the tension to raise the resonant frequency of the string, you pull it tighter. This requires (gasp) some degree of force greater than "a light touch" if you want to bend anything more than 1/4th of a tone. You could debate that the majority of this force is directed laterally, but there must also be enough downward such that the string touches the fret ahead of your finger (duh).

Other than that I agree with him about the benefits and drawbacks, as I initially posted.

Maybe I just find scalloped necks and other gimmicks to be pure novelty and dislike the amount of glorification they receive. It is entirely possible, yet do not pretend to lecture me about guitar mechanics.
 
Kenneth_R said:
and it will seriously mess up bends and tuning if you push down hard to play. it only works for light-touch techniques

Nope. I scalloped frets 12-21 on one of my guitars and there's no difference, even though I play very hard. I was worried about the "light touch" thing before I tried it but I can play however I want and it still reacts the same, even with gauge 9-46 strings.

I can understand why Yngwie says it's harder to play fast...sliding up the neck is a bit harder because there's no wood under your fingers to guide you, you're just "bumping" over the fret wire so it slows you down.
 
Too bad he's wrong. Bending requires increasing the tension to raise the resonant frequency of the string, you pull it tighter. This requires (gasp) some degree of force greater than "a light touch" if you want to bend anything more than 1/4th of a tone. You could debate that the majority of this force is directed laterally, but there must also be enough downward such that the string touches the fret ahead of your finger (duh).

Other than that I agree with him about the benefits and drawbacks, as I initially posted.

Maybe I just find scalloped necks and other gimmicks to be pure novelty and dislike the amount of glorification they receive. It is entirely possible, yet do not pretend to lecture me about guitar mechanics.
I'm absolutely not trying to lecture you on mechanics... However, once again, you are explaining quite wonderfully why bad technique will make you play out of tune! ...and you are not more right for repeating yourself.

You should simply not increase your downward pressure (relative to a regular fretted note) when bending - the increased pressure should be used parallel to the fret.

I'm sorry to repeat myself... However, if above scenario sees you playing out of tune on a scalloped fretboard, you are playing out of tune on each and every guitar you touch! Seriously, grab your guitar and try pushing the string all the way to the fretboard. Now, unless your frets are the hight of (the width of) a pubic hair, it will take an excessive amount of force to bring it all the way down to the fretboard - bringing the guitar terribly out of tune in the process. Now, ask the freightfully obvious question: "Do I ever use this much force when fretting a note"? If the answer is "no", you just figured out, that there is absolutely no "mechanical" reason why scalloped fretboards should affect intonation... and if the answer is "yes", you seriously need to take either an anger management course or quite a few guitar lessons.

Cheers

Eske
 
Sorry if my last post pissed you off, but I guess your "to bad he's wrong", "(duh)" and "(gasp)" attitude sort of annoyed me.
I was not trying to glorify scalloping, but trying to explain what it does and doesn't offer a guitarist.

Now, you may consider me condescending for pointing out that you are spreading misinformation, but that was in no way my intention... My intent was solely information and clarification.

Rock on!
 
I'm not spreading anything other than what I've found to be correct. What exactly do you have to bring to the table? Besides being a musician, have you ever constructed an instrument? Designed one? Into physics, mechanics, engineering at all? Everyone has an opinion and everyone thinks theirs is right.

I think scalloped necks are a novel gimmick. That's my opinion. However your attacks on my PoV as 'misinformation' and 'bad technique' are quite the literary stretch. You either misread all my posts, or there is certainly misinformation going around, but not at my hands.

Misinformation :lol:
 
there is no reason scallops will mess up your bends unless you have a poor sense of intonation, but that holds true for any guitar scalloped or not. My jem has the top 4 frets scalloped, which makes bending on those frets a bit easier since I can dig into it a little bit more and don't have to worry about the string slipping out from under my finger. If your bends are going sharp on any guitar, it's because you have poor intonation, not because of anything else. True, on a scalloped you might find yourself prone to pressing the string down further. However, bending a string isn't a matter of distance (ie how far you are bending the string), but rather a matter of hitting a certain pitch. Your sense of intonation (if you have one) will tell you when you've hit the desired pitch. If you are pressing down on the string too hard then you'll just not bend as far to reach the pitch...simple as that.

Scallops shouldn't affect tapping and sweeping (or any other technique) at all...if it does, it's all in your head. The amount of force required to play a non-scalloped guitar and a scalloped guitar are exactly the same. Even the feel shouldn't be all that different.

Eske-just ignore Kenneth. I wish when people were on my ignore list, it also blocked me from seeing when other people quoted their posts. By disagreeing with him, you've already established (in his eyes) that you are an inferior person he's just going to keep spouting his elitist bullshit in your direction until he runs out of shit to say and puts you on his ignore list.
 
I'm not spreading anything other than what I've found to be correct. What exactly do you have to bring to the table? Besides being a musician, have you ever constructed an instrument? Designed one? Into physics, mechanics, engineering at all? Everyone has an opinion and everyone thinks theirs is right.

I think scalloped necks are a novel gimmick. That's my opinion. However your attacks on my PoV as 'misinformation' and 'bad technique' are quite the literary stretch. You either misread all my posts, or there is certainly misinformation going around, but not at my hands.

Misinformation :lol:

Interestingly enough, what you have found to be correct simply isn’t!

Apart from having played the instrument for nearly 20 years, having actually built a rather nice (scalloped neck) guitar from the ground up, having put together more parts guitars (Warmoth et al) than I care to count… oh, and actually having played guitars fitted with scalloped necks for the last 5 years, I really don’t have much to bring to the table. Still, I think that's just a slight bit of experience and practical knowledge on the subject. No, I don’t study science at university, but as is blatantly obvious, neither do you. So, from which magic lake did you draw your vast wisdom?

And yes: I actually went to the trouble of reading your senseless posts... where you say nothing of "POV" or "opinion". I may be as "clueless" as Julz, but making blanket statements and speaking of "mechanics" (i.e. science facts) has absolutely nothing to do with "point of view". Your present argument makes as much sense as telling us that it is you “opinion” and “experience” (formerly known as science fact) that the earth is flat and hence, (duh), (gasp) we are wrong for telling you that it is round.

I never once claimed that your opinion was wrong (e.g. "scalloped necks are a novel gimmick"... used on lutes, sitars and various other novel gimmicky instruments), I am telling you that you are incorrect and from a physics standpoint might even more "clueless" than Julz and I put together. Could you please explain to me why removing a bit of wood from the fretboard should somehow magically change the laws of physics and force a guitarist to use more energy than he did before the wood was removed?

Did I ever write that you had bad technique? I have no way of knowing how exceedingly virtuos you playing really is – which is why I never commented on your level of skill. If you actually read my posts you would see that I only stated the fact that (on the sadly non-existent perfectly in tune guitar), only poor technique (including poor pitch recognition) will make a player play out of tune on a scalloped neck… Just as only poor technique will make a player play out of tune on jumbo frets, medium frets or even tiny vintage frets. With your reasoning a guitarist using jumbo frets should be more out of tune than a guitarist using medium frets… and a guitarist using the tiniest of tiny fretwire should be as close to in tune as physically possible. Tell me, does that seriously make sense to you?

Please share any information or scientific knowledge you might have on the subject… I am certainly looking forward to being enlightened!

Cheers

Eske

P.s.: Meedleyx10 - read your post after the fact... and you are right.
 
Congratulations on your assumptions about me, which were all wrong. Thanks for playing, my ignorant friend.

I won't bother with my BSEE or how many guitars I've built, because clearly you just want to pick a fight defending your pride and the pathetic scalloped necks you love so much. Enjoy.
 
Eske-just ignore Kenneth. I wish when people were on my ignore list, it also blocked me from seeing when other people quoted their posts. By disagreeing with him, you've already established (in his eyes) that you are an inferior person he's just going to keep spouting his elitist bullshit in your direction until he runs out of shit to say and puts you on his ignore list.
Awww, I'm sorry I hurt your feelings and popped your little bubble of joyful happy pastures.
 
No magic....Kenneth is just a complete elitist jackass, and very predictable I might add.

However, magic sounds cooler....
Indeed it does :lol:

Again Kenneth_R... (though this is repetition ad nauseam) I never made a single assumption about you, I am not picking a fight, the only thing I am defending is comon sense and... thank you, I will enjoy!

Still, congratulations are in order: You have not shared one single piece of valid information... which is rather disturbing considering how much fuss you made over something you won't bother us with.

I am sorry to hear about your BSE, though... Maybe I should just avoid beef altogether.
 
However, bending a string isn't a matter of distance (ie how far you are bending the string), but rather a matter of hitting a certain pitch. Your sense of intonation (if you have one) will tell you when you've hit the desired pitch. If you are pressing down on the string too hard then you'll just not bend as far to reach the pitch...simple as that.

Exactly - End of discussion