Seriously Feminists, WTF?!?!
- Thread starter TheWinterSnow
- Start date
This is the same oversensitive politically correct argument that sparked this whole thread in the first place. Society changes, views and morals on topics change, the best we can do is accept that, not sit on some high horse about how everyone is a biggot for changing the dichotomy of culture, words, and moral beliefs. If you ever were in a High School English class, you will learn that words change definition, that new words are made up and others become archaic, just as much as culture changes. As a music theory class taught me, life reflect art and art reflects life, literacy and language are very much an art and they change with the times for better or for worse. What really bothers me is the politically correctness to refuse these changes.
Being politically incorrect to me only proves in satire fashion the "idiocracy" of certain sensitivity where being politically correct only separates groups especially minorities and makes them feel as victims or it can prove the bigotry of an individual which either one has the same ultimate outcome in which its point is shown, to decontruct the separation through such bigotry or emotional norms. This is why I love being politically incorrect in the comic sense, it breaks those boundaries down more than activist movements of any group playing the victim, which in the long run, constructs the walls of separation so much more. Solidarity among all can only come from making satire of politically correct and being able to laugh about it. With that in mind look at most comedians now a days, most of their comedy is on racism, sexism, and many other politically incorrect things. And what is the result? Well the result is that I have made Black friends (not African American as some of them are of South American decent) by walking into the conversation that my pals means an ignorant person, not a person of black skin. Of them one friend when he does not respond to his name anyone, including black friends of his call him my pals and he instantly responds and everyone laughs. The friends who are relative newcomers look in horror until they realize that person is not mad and actually finds it funny. The moral of the story, satire and changing the definition to sensitive words truly does bring solidarity, the sensitive use of the same words, only proves again the bigots exist and proves that we need solidarity and attack what has been considered taboo. To me, words mean nothing, actions prove so much more, lets get emotional about other's actions other than the words or terminology than they use.
I don't. Every time I hear the word feminist it is always depicted as the bat shit crazy man hating feminist movement. To call a large amount of people changing the cultural norm stupid is highly arrogant. Instead of worrying about minute issues, we should be again, worried about solidarity, being politically correct can take the back seat.
At this point Jeff, you can respond with whatever white knight response you want, but honestly, since I am really trying to bite my tongue out of the respect that I have for you, I just won't care. Its a situation where we have two different realities and we can agree to disagree, so please don't try to act like I am so wrong and bigoted and that your opinion is so superior and that I am ignorant for having adverse opinions to you, because, I just won't care.
This thread was more intended to be about sexism in video games, I am really over the whole topic now, as I feel this about to turn into a Mac vs PC thread, or rather in reality, Democrat vs Republican thread, as I am sure it will go that way in the next few posts. Again totally over the whole thing.
JakeAC5253
Frozen Sun Audio
- Nov 19, 2010
- 936
- 1
- 18
TesticleMilkshake
pewpewlazrz
Also, while we are talking feminism, I'm just gonna go an post this:
http://kateharding.net/2009/10/08/g...pproaching-strange-women-without-being-maced/
There's also a Schrodinger's Racist article, but I haven't looked at it.
JakeAC5253
Frozen Sun Audio
- Nov 19, 2010
- 936
- 1
- 18
I just have to say, this is fucking embarrassing. I saw the E3 trailer and it seems completely reasonable for what they're trying to pull off. It seems like the rape thing may be like one possible cutscene in the entire game. I can easily tell from reading that she just wants to complain about something, you don't have to read into it very deep to get that.
I also get the feeling that she's the real pink blooded type of gal that would have written a bad review for this game even if it were more like the previous games, that she inevitably comes to desire and appreciate by the end of her article, which I find makes her argument futile. If the new Tomb Raider were exactly like the older ones, I can almost guarantee her article might have gone something like this... "Oh great, yet another regurgitated episode of a female heroine with huge tits made by the male charged gaming industry to put down the female population that wasn't born with large breasts. Ooh, so sexy. They must have spent 5 days writing the storyline and 5 months designing her intricate breast size, dimensions, and physics. Women getting breast implants... feel insecure... male dominated... conspiracy... bleh bleh bleh, whine whine..." omg lady, just don't play the game. She was shown a handful of sand and now she's in fucking Egypt. That article was totally uncalled for, I'm sorry for her braincells.
I do feel that I must point out that the label on the game says "Mature" and not a specific age requirement, because everybody ages, though not everyone matures in every aspect that a Mature game may be rated for... that is all.
This is the kind of junk that spawns this kind of junk... these kind of uptight flag wavers are the kind of people keeping these negative ideas like racism and sexism alive in everyone's mind.
http://sayanythingblog.com/entry/look-out-black-holes-naacp-protest-2/
JakeAC5253
Frozen Sun Audio
- Nov 19, 2010
- 936
- 1
- 18
That does remind me a few times of walking to or from a late class/dinner at the university and finding that my path converges with a young woman in front of me. As soon as she notices that I am walking behind her, her pace quickens and she clutches her purse/bag in her hands. Wait, really? Do I really look like a creep? Does she really think that because we both share the same paved walking path at a well lit University that I am intently trying to rape her? That shit pisses me off. Whenever that kind of thing happens, it almost makes me want to do something to fuck with her, just to be a dick. I mean you need to realize how people respond to these kinds of things, because you can be bringing on a certain reaction from someone based on some action you are performing.
Also, TM, I greatly respect that you are able to keep such an open mind among all us men chatting about our negative experiences and thoughts about some small section of the female population. We're not always like this, at least I'm not, I swear
TravisW
Member
kaomao
Member
I guess the Girl of the kick start project never played games like these:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syberia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jade_(Beyond_Good_&_Evil)
Trip in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enslaved:_Odyssey_to_the_West
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Half-Life_2 (Alyx)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/April_Ryan
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elaine_Marley
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/April_Ryan
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grace_Nakamura
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rebecca_Chambers_(character)
not always there are games where women are prostitutes lol
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syberia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jade_(Beyond_Good_&_Evil)
Trip in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enslaved:_Odyssey_to_the_West
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Half-Life_2 (Alyx)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/April_Ryan
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elaine_Marley
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/April_Ryan
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grace_Nakamura
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rebecca_Chambers_(character)
not always there are games where women are prostitutes lol
drew_drummer
Dancefap
JeffTD
Senhor Testiculo
Who said anything about political correctness? This is about using appropriate terms for the subject at hand - you're the one who introduced pejorative and derogatory terms into the discussion by means of a shitty analogy.
Great jab about high school english - If you were ever in a university level course on sociology, social movements, or political movements, you'd realize what I'm talking about in regards to feminism has happened in the last 20-30 years and continues today. It's not some archaic change of meaning or culture, as if your example were even relevant.
Again, you're the one talking about political correctness. I'm talking about accuracy of terms.
Your suggestion that comedy breaks down boundaries more than activist movements do is totally bunk, and just because you have a few examples and token black friends who can laugh about the word my pals does not in any way, shape, or form justify or explain the fact that it is still an offensive word and that the definition hasn't been changed. You're being willfully ignorant if you think the word my pals doesn't carry a load of historical racial baggage with it, and that's not going to change any time soon. 300+ years of oppression doesn't just disappear and make a word OK to use, just like suburban white kids using the word faggot constantly doesn't and won't change the fact that it compares gays as kindling for burning other heretics at the stake with.
Again, nothing about political correctness; that and this solidarity business is completely your doing as I have mentioned neither.
White knight response? I could very obviously not give any less of a shit of what people on here think of me - I'm not trying to win brownie points with this one. I'm not saying that you're wrong and bigoted and that my opinion is superior, I'm saying that you're using terms you don't fully understand in ways that perpetuate further misunderstanding of them. That's it. This does not mean that I don't respect you as a person, deny how you perceive the world around you, think that you're a bigoted, ignorant asshole, etc.
Then why did you in both title and OP rail against feminists and feminism? You can't disregard a discussion as irrelevant just because you tripped yourself into it.
Skinny Viking
¯\(°_o)/¯ How do Lydian?
Not understanding why anyone would ever pull out intentionally so you can just place me in column B
Line666
Fendurr
- Sep 2, 2006
- 3,342
- 1
- 36
I do love a good guilty before proven innocent spiel. I have a hard time believing most rape statistics as well because a lot of women will say they got raped to save face because they inadvertently fucked some ugly dude when they got smashed; so I struggle with the one in six or one in four stuff as I think most statistics that high reflect a level of regret at ones own action and attempt pass culpability onto someone else. It's one of these loaded questions like if you asked the entirety of the male population how many women they have slept with, the answer will be high above the reality because it's a pride thing. I don't think I've ever known a woman that was flat out raped but I know a few who, if you phrased the question ambiguously enough, would probably pass off an awkward sexual encounter as something more serious. Because hey, we all have things we regret doing drunk.
I think though that the power does swing both ways again because whilst men are capable of wrecking a womans life the same is also true for women wrecking mens - all it needs is an allegation of physical or sexual abuse and you can utterly destroy a mans credibility even without any evidence - am I to assume that all women are Schroedinger lifewreckers because of that?
I remember I was in a nightclub with some friends once and everyone was moving on but a friend was still on the floor somewhere dancing away and this girl who had been trying to make me do her bidding all night rolls up to me and practically snarls at me "you have to get X friend for me, its your job to get X friend for me, do it", well I (stupidly) turned round and gave her a (small) one handed shove in the flat of her back towards X friend and said "Do it yourself".
Next thing I know:
"He hit me, he hit me in the face!"
I swear every guy within a 30 foot radius is grinding their teeth together at this point and I'm peppering my angus for getting absolutely blootered, I'm now preparing to get the crap kicked out of me because of one allegation of supposed misconduct that I didn't even commit, even my friends start asking me in serious monotones whether I actually hit this girl whilst they're dragging her away from scratching my eyes out and when I respond no you can tell there's no belief there. Luckily I managed to escape that situation in tact but it took her a week to admit that she'd made the whole fucking thing up and to restore my reputation as a non woman beater.
Skinny Viking
¯\(°_o)/¯ How do Lydian?
^ my buddy got into an argument with his girlfriend he was living with at the time. He had been planning to leave her and finally told her one day. She got furious and attacked him with a flurry of slaps and monkey-fists to the chest, then ran out and called the cops. My buddy is just about the most non-violent and non-threatening guy you could meet. He never even yelled at her. Few minutes later the cops show up. He goes outside to talk to the police and explain the situation to them in his usual very calm & matter of fact way of speaking, just trying to diffuse the situation and apologize to them for having their time wasted. All of a sudden, she blurts out "He hit me!"
My buddy just looked at the cop he was talking to and without saying a word, turned around and placed his hands behind his back. Spent the night in the police station and after all was said and done, was ordered to attend anger management counseling for X amount of hours
There was never anything he could have done and it shows just how fucked up and tailor fit for women a lot of "family" law actually is. Don't even get me started on custody battles
My buddy just looked at the cop he was talking to and without saying a word, turned around and placed his hands behind his back. Spent the night in the police station and after all was said and done, was ordered to attend anger management counseling for X amount of hours
There was never anything he could have done and it shows just how fucked up and tailor fit for women a lot of "family" law actually is. Don't even get me started on custody battles
GeertSamuel
Member
There's a thin line between feminism and sexism. This girl is clearly on the far side of sexism.
drew_drummer
Dancefap
Was fucking a girl. Fell in love. She fucked someone else and got pregnant. Moved to London. Met a Jap. Fell in love. Married her 7 years later.
My life.
My life.
Skinny Viking
¯\(°_o)/¯ How do Lydian?
TesticleMilkshake
pewpewlazrz
Öwen;10315659 said:
Keep in mind this is the Interbutts, and this blog is certainly geared more left of center. There are many numbers out about rape and sexual assault, but people will pick the "facts" which best suit their needs. I guarantee this blogger may not have all their facts straight, although I agree with the general sentiment of this post. I'm from suburbs of NY, and I travel almost daily to Manhattan. Nothing pisses me off more when a someone who is clearly shady (high on drugs, drunk, altered state of mind) tries to do something nice for me (and clearly as an advance) with the expectation of acknowledgement in return. So what do I do? How do I approach this situation being the petite little country bumpkin in the big, bad city? Do I thank the person and open myself up to further advances, potential uncomfortable conversation to satisfy the lust of this dirty bastard? Do I play the bitch card and ignore him, potentially angering this questionable guy and putting myself as well as possibly other people in danger? Not to mention, the bitch card goes against my persona. If I do say thanks, is this guy going to follow me when I get off the subway? The list goes on, and unfortunately, thanks to personal experience with perverts and derelicts, this how I HAVE to think, and how many young women HAVE to think DO to risk becoming a victim. I realize that not all men are out to get me, but I would rather not put myself at risk of becoming a victim of rape or sexual assault, so I don't talk to strangers, and even with men I'm close with, if you make anything that remotely feels like an unwarranted sexual advance that is not mutual, I'm probably not going to want to hang out with one on one, or drink around you. Only times I have cried fowl to other people was when men were making inappropriate advances (i.e., married, close family friend making sexual comments toward me, and one case where a drunk elderly man threatened to throw himself in front of a train unless I held his hand) Once bitten, twice shy, I guess you could say.
Now, rape statistics can be really tricky, because it has a lot to do with the legal definitions of rape and sexual assault (some sexual assaults are rape, but not all rapes are sexual assaults) And referring to Jeff's comment, some people use the terms "rape" and "sexual assault" interchangeable, when they can be two entirely different circumstances. You also have to keep in mind the population which is being surveyed; while this blog was written by an American, this is more likely to be a global estimate. Keep in mind this could include a huge range of victims, both in age, circumstance, and nationality. This could include the now 60 year old Cambodian woman who was raped when her village was taken over by the Khmer Rouge in the 1970s, the 80 year-old Chinese grandmother who was sexually assaulted with a crow bar by a gang of Japanese militants during the rape of Nanking in 1938, or the 85 year-old German civilian who was raped by a Russian soldier after the Fall of the Third Reich, the 25 year-old drug mule raped then murdered by rival gang members in Mexico or perhaps the child bride in Afghanistan who was married off at 10 year-old to a 60 year-old feudal lord. Globally speaking and over a hundred year time span, yes, I would say there is a 1 in 4 chance a woman could be raped.
In the Industrialized nations, stats. also vary greatly. Let's say I'm doing a survey among women residing in public housing projects in the South Bronx, I wouldn't be surprised if the rape stats. is 1 in 6. From there, let's go 30 miles north to Mount Kisco, NY, the rape stats. would probably be like 1 in 200. There's also the issue of reporting rape and sexual assault. Victims of these crimes have to deal with the stigma of being a victim, being viewed as tainted, or possibly even inviting the crime on to themselves. Maybe he/she was afraid of going to the hospital to get a rape kit done? Maybe the victim is tied to other crimes and concerned that reporting a rape will lead to their arrest as well? What if its a lover or a family member? How do you deal with that psychologically? Then there's the lengthly court process, having the face the perpetrator in court, (depending on local procedure is) cross-examination, dealing with the defense, etc., etc. This is why it's difficult to get an exact number that truly reflects rape and sexual assault.
I personally really look down upon women who get drunk and willingly hooked up with a less than desirable guy, then call it "rape" the next morning, because it detracts from the issues regarding the rights and circumstances of REAL victims.
Lastly, I want to throw in a story about a friend from my undergrad years, who we will call 'C.' C. is a gorgeous little punk girl from the LES working on a degree in art, she has some issues with self-esteem, but she's as loving and as sweet as can be. C. started dating this older guy named M., who was a little off, but seemed extremely smart. M. gets involved with cocaine and transforms into a completely different person when he's high. They have intense fights when he's high and she often feel under his thumb, but she knows deep-down, he's a "good guy." So one day, when C. is alone in her dorm, M. comes over, all coked-up, demanding to have sex. C. needs to finish up a painting for a class and is a little disturbed by her boyfriend's behavior. She refuses his advances, so M. throws down her art supplies, beats her up a little, then rapes her. After the rape, he brushes his hair and leaves. C.'s roommate returns finding C. crying and the dorm a mess. So her roommate calls UPD. C. goes to the hospital for a rape kit, and one of the police officers asks C. if she wants to press charges (there is enough evidence for him to be taken to jail). However, C. refuses, saying this is all because of M." has a coke problem, and normally isn't like this." They date on and off for the rest of the school year, despite the fact that M. has also given her a raging case of genital herpes. He can't be that bad of a guy, right?
A few weeks later, a girl reports being stalked by M.. University Police take it seriously, going to Student Affairs. While there isn't necessarily a crime being committed, he eventually violates a no-contact order with the girl being stalked. M. gets thrown out of school. And all the shit comes out: M. was in psychiatric facility for two years, having sexually abused his younger sister. The parents decided not to deal with on a criminal level, because their son clearly has a mental illness, and, in their mind, is not a sexual predator. An ex-girlfriend comes forward (who had to leave school as the result of a nervous breakdown) stating similar circumstances, of beatings and rape, and choose not to report these crimes because she was "afraid of him." Other reports come out of him spiking girl's drinks with shots of grain alcohol at party's held in his apartment, and then having sex with them while passed out. Charges were never pressed, and this kid is still out on the street.
Scum-bucket predators like him is the reason why rape needs to be taken seriously.
Line666
Fendurr
- Sep 2, 2006
- 3,342
- 1
- 36
Scotland is pretty bad for that as well, people can be very forward, nothing like walking home at 4am and being approached by various bams asking for change. I'm 180lb, well built and probably about twice as strong as your average male and I still move away very quickly when some wee 9 stone junkie comes up to me asking for drug money at the end of a night out, not because I'm at all scared of being physically overpowered but purely from a perspective of complete unpredictability; I have more than enough experience of how quickly some people can turn on a dime. So I can understand completely the desire not to dismiss the crazies if you are a woman because then even the physicality is a threat too. I could never blame men of getting protective of women purely because of that reason, there are some royally fucked up people out there.
So I don't deny these things are a problem, merely that over exaggeration of these statistics only contributes to a widespread dilution of the actual problem when it does occur. With these statistics there always seems to be an ambiguity on the scale of unwarranted sexual advance (which I'm sure occurs to every even moderately attractive girl and above - hell I'm pretty sure most males have made at least one of those; the signals can be mixed), to buyers remorse, to actual rape and they all seem to get treated as the same even though they are clearly not at all.
Stuff like the above is truly difficult to deal with purely from the perspective that is obviously a case of buyers remorse as it's a clear dismissal of guilt onto the other involved party to try and save face socially and it's fairly disgusting trying to pass off men as criminals because the woman feels bad about committing to something in hindsight. I get the impression that the above blog and its users would view this as a case of actual rape and be all about the empowerment of the sisterhood or something along those lines tho - because passing off culpability should be allowed for women but not for men. I can sympathise with the regret (because I have let some foul looking girls go near my willy and woke up the next morning instantly wanting to forget about why I let another Princess Fiona back to visit the high tower) but the rest is my stupid fault and should be any womans who finds herself in a similar situation.
So I don't deny these things are a problem, merely that over exaggeration of these statistics only contributes to a widespread dilution of the actual problem when it does occur. With these statistics there always seems to be an ambiguity on the scale of unwarranted sexual advance (which I'm sure occurs to every even moderately attractive girl and above - hell I'm pretty sure most males have made at least one of those; the signals can be mixed), to buyers remorse, to actual rape and they all seem to get treated as the same even though they are clearly not at all.
Stuff like the above is truly difficult to deal with purely from the perspective that is obviously a case of buyers remorse as it's a clear dismissal of guilt onto the other involved party to try and save face socially and it's fairly disgusting trying to pass off men as criminals because the woman feels bad about committing to something in hindsight. I get the impression that the above blog and its users would view this as a case of actual rape and be all about the empowerment of the sisterhood or something along those lines tho - because passing off culpability should be allowed for women but not for men. I can sympathise with the regret (because I have let some foul looking girls go near my willy and woke up the next morning instantly wanting to forget about why I let another Princess Fiona back to visit the high tower) but the rest is my stupid fault and should be any womans who finds herself in a similar situation.
TesticleMilkshake
pewpewlazrz
Was gonna post a picture of a nerd Asian kid holding up a sign that said, "We need feminism, because I unknowingly contribute to rape culture," but this works just as well, hahaha
I agree Owen, although I think the sexual culture of the British Isles is a little more liberated than that of the more Puritan US. Rape is a problem in the States because sex is perceived as power (which it really isn't, it's natural)
It's also funny, I was justing talking to my sister about rape at my alma mater, and my sister said "Saying you've been raped is like the 'new cool thing to do,' it's like how self-mutilation was perceived in the 1990s." Sad, but true.
TesticleMilkshake
pewpewlazrz
Also, TM, I greatly respect that you are able to keep such an open mind among all us men chatting about our negative experiences and thoughts about some small section of the female population. We're not always like this, at least I'm not, I swear
Hahahah, I know, you guys are awesome though, because I feel like many men are uncomfortable or just plain not interested in talking about this kind of stuff. It's important! We need both sides here, we have to all get along while we are on this planet
