Slate Samples/Phase....just wow

[kaomao]

On PT LE on my mac works like a charm, no phase issues at all!
When I hear the drums loosing a bit of bottom end, it is just because I have a section with a strong roll making the OH's tracks being louder than the actual snare track (reaplaced with trigger).
...Of course this is not the case Lasse is mentioning. I even tried printing the samples in PT just to see if there's any incosistency, but I didn't notice any.

 

[Lasse Lammert]

On PT LE on my mac works like a charm, no phase issues at all!
When I hear the drums loosing a bit of bottom end, it is just because I have a section with a strong roll making the OH's tracks being louder than the actual snare track (reaplaced with trigger).
...Of course this is not the case Lasse is mentioning. I even tried printing the samples in PT just to see if there's any incosistency, but I didn't notice any.

Hey, are you on a PPC?
cause that was the same with the instrument maker, it worked great on the intel macs but not on PPC before they fixed it.
might be something similar with trigger

 

[MetalSound]

1: Trigger is really not working on my system like it should:
solution: I have to help the developers fixing a product that I paid for and that should have been working in the first place....no thanks

i did help them to get it working in nuendo 3.....and got my money back.

 

[greyskull]

i did an album where trigger did a 'drumagog' no matter what i did with the settings.
I also did an album where it was bang on... go figure.
im using Massey DTM to trigger it. now

 

[nwright]

1: Trigger is really not working on my system like it should:
solution: I have to help the developers fixing a product that I paid for and that should have been working in the first place....no thanks

2.: I'm too stupid to operate a plugin (and I like to believe that I'm rather smart, although I can understand that this would be the favoured option for the company)
solution: I can't use this plugin cause I'm too stupid.

so what am I doing now?
nothing, I believe that in this case the first possibility is true, so I'm sitting back and hoping for other customers who have the same issues with trigger on Mac PPC/PT (and they are there) to send slate tracks...then eventually there'll be an update to fx it..THEN I start using this plugin.

Rather than look at it the way your are for your #1 reason, I'd look at it as Slate offering to help YOU figure out why it's not working for YOU rather than you being a "beta tester" for THEM. After all, YOU are the one having the problem, and the manufacturer is attempting to help you fix it...Same as with anything that doesn't work like it's supposed to.

Also, in looking at the bevy of posts you've made in this thread, I would think you could have pulled a track or 2 to submit for analysis to the Slate team in the time it has taken away from your day to make these posts (some of which are long).

I'm not calling you out at all, but I see Slate extending an offer to help you, but you saying you don't have time to let them help you, all the while you've posted numerous times in the thread saying why, rather than work to find a solution.

Maybe I'm tougher to part with my dollars, but if I spent money on something, I expect it to work for me. If it doesn't, I tell the manufacturer and see if they can help me fix it. If not, I get a refund. Have you asked for a refund?

 

[nwright]

FWIW I've never had an issue with any drum replacement plugin as far as how easy they are to get tracks to trigger. If any were a bit more difficult I found Aptrigga harder to work with. Drumagog always did a great job triggering, but the phase and sound of the samples wasn't to my liking. Running the same samples in Aptrigga (blended and 100% replaced) just sounded better in tone than drumagog. I think Trigger is the same as Aptrigga, sounds great. But, for me it's easier to use.

 

[ahjteam]

@Lasse, a bit of shot in the dark... Are your ddrum triggertracks in phase with the miced tracks? The problem might also be there...

 

[Lasse Lammert]

@Lasse, a bit of shot in the dark... Are your ddrum triggertracks in phase with the miced tracks? The problem might also be there...

yep, created them from the mic tracks.

nwright: I'm posting on this board while I'm working on my projects (during editing etc, completely different thing from unarchiving 15DVDs, opening several songs, trying to find out which one was causing the trouble etc.

also, like I said, I appreciate Slates offer, and if option2 is valid (see above) that's indeed great help and great customerservice, if option1 is true though it IS me being the beta-tester.
But I'm not trying to bash Slate or anything, I'm just saying there IS something wrong with trigger in PT on a PPC with SOME songs (many tempochanges etc), it's not my responsibility to fix that.
Greyskull just confirmed this problem...perhaps he's too stupid to use a plugin too?

but I think everything that's important has been said already.
I think there's a problem with trigger on my system
Slate says it's working perfectly, I'm just using the wrong settings.
I'll wait until they aknowlege this problem and fix it, no biggy, I was able to do my job before trigger, I'll be able to do it now.

I appreciate Slates offer but I'm not taking it, so he's done what he could right now, no grudge.
I believe that eventually they'll find out what's causing this problem and that it's not PEBKAC

 

[kaomao]

Hey, are you on a PPC?
cause that was the same with the instrument maker, it worked great on the intel macs but not on PPC before they fixed it.
might be something similar with trigger

nope! on a intel mac!

 

[guitarguru777]

Lasse, bro you know I love you and would have your babies, but honestly I think you are being a little stubborn on this one. I mean come on you can un-archive 1 project a day before you go to bed each night to find 1 that was fucked.

You will probably find it in 1 or 2 days and then you can send it off for fixing. I understand having to make rent, and I understand being busy all the time. But you Slate to come out and offer you this kind of personal service is pretty impressive. Its not beta testing, its getting your shit fixed so you can use it.

Over the course of 8 or 9 projects the time you will save using Trigger vs (your sound replacer of choice) will more then pay for the 2 or 3 hours it takes to find a project to send them.

 

[Lasse Lammert]

....

well, it'll be at least 3-4 hours in total, that means 200€...that's more than I paid for trigger....not interested.
I would do it if I desperately needed trigger...I don't.
also, as soon as they acknowledge that there might be a problem I'm willing to do that, but so far it's only "you just can't set it up properly, send us the tracks and we set it up for you, then show you how we did it"...that doesn't help me at all, cause I don't care how accurate it might be on their system.
If they accept the fact that there IS a problem with some (I admit "few") projects on some PPC machines (and I'm not the only one having this problem), THEN I see a point in helping to solve it with files, screenshots or whatever.
but so far that's not the point, all you hear from them is "nah, it's working perfectly, read all the good reviews, you just don't know how to use it", which I find insulting, I've got a degree in physics and audio engineering, I'm doing this for some time now, I honestly don't think I'm too stupid to use a plugin correctly.

still, I DO see that they're trying to help me (adjusting the settings)...something I appreciate.
That's why I said I'm not really pissed or anything, I'm just waiting until they accept the fact that it's not phase consistent on some systems and fix it.
I'm not in a hurry, I'm perfectly fine w/o it till then.

And on top of that...yes, I'm known for being a stubborn person

 

[MetalSound]

i completely understand your point of view. you paid for a plugin that is supposed to work 100% (just as i did).
i wouldn´t be interested in helping any company to get their program to work (better). it´s YOUR money and THEY should have tested everything BEFORE they released the program.
being stubborn in your case is absolutely understable.

 

[Mikaël-ange]

I have anything to say about Slate product (since I don't use it) but just to say:

Lasse, you're not too anal about sample slicing. I slice the same way and every samples I use are sliced the same way (many hours of works for doing this). I always feel bad when I get outside sliced samples

Btw, your sample pack was a great surprise for me (no need for additionnal slicing/editing).

I mean...I can understand that not everyone is as anal as I am when it comes to slicing samples (I'm always using 1 smpl grid mode and am cuting EXACTLY at the beginning, not a sample early or late)...

 

[Trevoire520]

Without meaning to sound like a dick:

Try the demo before you shell out on a plugin. If it works buy it, if it doesn't then don't. Spending money on a plugin without demo'ing it first to make sure it works for you is a bit daft imo.

I'm sure you can appreciate that there are hundreds of combinations of pc/mac, daw, daw version, operating system etc etc etc etc so it's incredibly difficult, if not impossible to have a plugin that works 100% of the time on 100% of the systems out there. In this case where it's not working properly either help Slate to figure out the problem or get a refund.

It seems odd to me that it works ok on some projects and not on others though...

 

[Lasse Lammert]

It seems odd to me that it works ok on some projects and not on others though...

that's what made demoing difficult (I did demo it).
seems like it's mainly long songs with many tempo changes that are having problems (very much the same with DrumRehab btw)

 

[rlcramer]

It might seem a little off topic, but I had a similar experience with some Slate samples that I was triggering via MIDI using Kontakt 4. My issue cropped up when I started layering multiple Slate kicks. What happened was that if I triggered both kicks at the same time, at a velocity of 127 for example, everything sounded good. However when I triggered the same kicks at different velocities (I believe in the range of 100 - 110) 1 of the kicks would go horribly out of phase. It was obvious to me that there was some sloppy sample chopping going on across all of the multisample levels, but it only really made itself apparent when I would layer things, since I was using Midi drums, not doing replacement. Since I don't do this for a living, it wasn't really worth my time pursuing (I just avoided the problematic velocities). I opened a case with Slate and someone was helping me initially, but after a few emails back and forth, I just gave up.

Anyway - Lasse - maybe this is what's going on? Is Trigger triggering the same velocity for all of the different samples in your screenshot? Maybe it's more on issue with the samples then with Trigger itself?

It might be completely unrelated, but I figured I'd chime in just in case. I'm on an Intel Mac, Logic 9, SSD Platinum, if it helps...

Bobby

 

[drew_drummer]

that's what made demoing difficult (I did demo it).
seems like it's mainly long songs with many tempo changes that are having problems (very much the same with DrumRehab btw)

Could it be that the tempo changes are throwing Triggers internal buffer, and thus it is processing events later than it should?

Just throwing that out there.

 

[greyskull]

yeah.. my problem showed up when layering samples up in several instances of trigger.
i used one for the kick and one for the kick room. one for the slate snare sample and one for its room, one for my snare sample and one for my room. i KNOw my samples were cut perfectly, and consistantly, but it was this sort of setup where phasing /flamming was more apparent.
With DTM it's perfect.

 

[006]

i completely understand your point of view. you paid for a plugin that is supposed to work 100% (just as i did).
i wouldn´t be interested in helping any company to get their program to work (better). it´s YOUR money and THEY should have tested everything BEFORE they released the program.
being stubborn in your case is absolutely understable.

Do you use Windows by any chance? Or ANYTHING that has ever been updated over the course of each version? If so - SHUT THE FUCK UP. Fuck.

 

[arv_foh]

A lot of companies (Apple included) don't support PPC any more. The last one was released in 2006. Maybe it's upgrade time? I find it not surprising that the 2 people on this board that have had the most problems with Trigger (MetalSound and Lasse) were using the plugins with antiquated software or hardware (I would say anything older than 4 years is definitely antiquated in the world of computers).

I'm pretty much guaranteeing that PPC is what is causing these issues (it seems to be the only difference in your system and Slate's test system which he hasn't said but I'm guessing is Intel), but honestly I don't think software companies should be required to support old versions of software/hardware. A lot of the stuff I buy (like my photography plugins for example) will say that it either requires the most recent version of the software or 1 version prior to that, and that anything beyond that is not supported. I realize hardware is the issue here but same concept.