Technical Death Metal

[probertvscoxe]

crom-tech

 

[Slayed Necros]

No.

But the others were good choices...

No? Perhaps these albums aren't conventionally technical, particularly by modern standards, but to outright deny they're technical albums is pretty ridiculous.

I'll throw these out there.

Hellwitch - Syzygial Miscreancy
Psychosis - Face
Septic Flesh - Mystic Places Of Dawn
Liers in Wait - Spiritually Uncontrolled Art
Jumpin' Jesus - The Art of Crucifying

 

[Satanstoenail]

There's very little speed metal in Unquestionable Presence - people hear the relatively thin guitar sound and interpret that as 'speed metal,' but what they're hearing is an artifact of production designed to integrate the bass more fully into the overall sound than more typical death metal production allows. Their actual style and technical approach is rooted firmly in death metal.

Actually I wasn't thinking of just the guitar sound, the music itself has a lot of thrash elements going on in it, and the vocals are very thrash. They also used standard tuning which adds to it as well. I realise they are rooted in death metal, but so was Human.

what makes it not death metal is its near total embrace of technical speed metal stylings. Only the vocals retain any connection to death metal, and that's just not enough.

I don't understand where you get "near total embrace" from. It sounds like a death metal album. Much of the riffage is pure death metal. The drumming and vocals are death metal. The guitar sound is thick. The production is pure Scott Burns early 90's death metal.

It's pretty obvious that they're responsible for much of the riffing and percussive shading on the album, which is pure early Cynic.

And Cynic were also rooted in death metal.

Can you name a single speed metal band that DIDN'T use double bass?

I'm talking about the way it was used. Flat out double kick passages are predominant through every song on the album. In speed/thrash metal double kick is generally used to accentuate certain parts and not used so predominantly.

Something they had in common with Coroner, Kreator, Anacrusis, Slayer, Dark Angel...the list goes on an on.

Coroner, Kreator and Slayer all used either standard tuning or half a step down at the time of Human's release. The full step down tuning used on Human had more in common with Morbid Angel, Obituary, Carcass, Cannibal Corpse, Suffocation and Napalm Death at the time.

 

[probertvscoxe]

crom tech

 

[Scourge of God]

Actually I wasn't thinking of just the guitar sound, the music itself has a lot of thrash elements going on in it

, and the vocals are very thrash. They also used standard tuning which adds to it as well. I realise they are rooted in death metal, but so was Human.

Your obsession with tunings is misplaced: downtuning has never been been a hallmark of death metal. Some bands use it, some don't. The bottom line is that there's absolutely NOTHING speed metal oriented about Unquestionable Presence. The rhythmic patterns lack the the symmetry and simplicity of resolution that is the calling card of speed metal, and tonally, there's none of the pentatonic intrusion that is so prominent in the work of most speed metal acts. Structurally, the songs clearly reference death metal, not speed metal, as does the emphasis on melodic construction over simple violence in rhythm. Kelly Schaefer's voice is pitched higher than many death metal vocalists, but the vocal patterns, with their asymmetrical phrasing, are pure death metal.

I don't understand where you get "near total embrace" from. It sounds like a death metal album.

In what way? The riffs sound like Coroner and early vintage Cynic - complex, yes, but compact and even, with the rhythmic emphasis falling predictably at the end of each (fairly short) phrase. There's very little of the melodic interplay or chromatic movement that was death metal's stock in trade from the word go. The vocal patterns are are classic speed metal (TO-GE-THER, AS ONE!), as are the arrangements.

And Cynic were also rooted in death metal.

The '88 and '89 demos (the obvious reference point here) were speed metal in every sense. Go download them. They're not at all hard to find.

I'm talking about the way it was used. Flat out double kick passages are predominant through every song on the album. In speed/thrash metal double kick is generally used to accentuate certain parts and not used so predominantly.

What speed metal have YOU been listening to? Really, outside of some of the Bay Area acts (read: Metallica) and Anthrax, constant double bass rolls are the rule, not the exception.

Coroner, Kreator and Slayer all used either standard tuning or half a step down at the time of Human's release. The full step down tuning used on Human had more in common with Morbid Angel, Obituary, Carcass, Cannibal Corpse, Suffocation and Napalm Death at the time.

I don't give a crap what Kreator and Slayer were doing in 1991, what I'm concerned with are their classic albums, which are downtuned.

 

[Satanstoenail]

Your obsession with tunings is misplaced: downtuning has never been been a hallmark of death metal. Some bands use it, some don't.

I was merely using it as an example of characteristics. Thrash/speed metal bands generally tuned their guitars to E or E flat. Death metal bands generally tuned their guitars to D or lower. I realise there are exceptions.

The bottom line is that there's absolutely NOTHING speed metal oriented about Unquestionable Presence. The rhythmic patterns lack the the symmetry and simplicity of resolution that is the calling card of speed metal, and tonally, there's none of the pentatonic intrusion that is so prominent in the work of most speed metal acts. Structurally, the songs clearly reference death metal, not speed metal, as does the emphasis on melodic construction over simple violence in rhythm. Kelly Schaefer's voice is pitched higher than many death metal vocalists, but the vocal patterns, with their asymmetrical phrasing, are pure death metal.

I think the distinction is nowhere near as clear cut as you make it out to be. Thrash/speed and death share many musical qualities. There are many passages on Unquestionable Presence that reference thrash rhythmically, as well as tonally. On Piece Of Time this was even more apparent. To say there's NOTHING speed metal oriented about Unquestionable Presence is just being silly. The arrangements on the album borrow heavily from jazz/fusion, they certainly aren't standard death metal.

In what way?

In the ways that I have already stated.

The riffs sound like Coroner and early vintage Cynic - complex, yes, but compact and even, with the rhythmic emphasis falling predictably at the end of each (fairly short) phrase. There's very little of the melodic interplay or chromatic movement that was death metal's stock in trade from the word go. The vocal patterns are are classic speed metal (TO-GE-THER, AS ONE!), as are the arrangements.

You're lumping all the riffs on the album into one basket. The whole album isn't speed metal riffing. There was definitely a large Coroner/Cynic influence compared to earlier Death albums, but he certainly hadn't abandoned his death metal roots.

The '88 and '89 demos (the obvious reference point here) were speed metal in every sense. Go download them. They're not at all hard to find.

Ok fair enough, yeah those demos were quite thrash sounding, but at the time of Human's recording, they were a death metal band, and the influence is clear.

What speed metal have YOU been listening to? Really, outside of some of the Bay Area acts (read: Metallica) and Anthrax, constant double bass rolls are the rule, not the exception.

The sheer volume of double kick on Human is extremely death metal. The constant 16th note passages through flat out parts as well as half time parts was death metal drumming to a tee. Reinert's double kick work on Human had more in common with Steve Asheim than Ventor or Lombardo.

I don't give a crap what Kreator and Slayer were doing in 1991, what I'm concerned with are their classic albums, which are downtuned.

Kreator didn't downtune, and Slayer only ever tuned down to E Flat, but whatever.

 

[sceloporus]

Why has necrophagist not been mentioned yet???

 

[Death Aflame]

^ 'cause they make bad music.

Speaking of Atrocity, Hallucinations seems to be awfully overlooked. I think I even enjoy it more than Longing For Death. Great 'technical' DM album too.

 

[Krigloch the Furious]

hows the new Kronos? worth buying?

 

[Narg n Lamb]

Why has necrophagist not been mentioned yet???

^ 'cause they make bad music.

I STRROONGGGLLYYY Disagree. Explain yourself why you think so...

 

[Pessimism]

A lot of people feel they have no real emotion within their music. At least, that's what I have been told by every single person who has shown disgust for Necrophagist Smug

 

[Krigloch the Furious]

hows the new Kronos? worth buying?

.

 

[AchrisK]

Neglected Fields - Mephisto Lettonica

I have also heard good things about a band called Gory Blister.

 

[Skepticism]

hows the new Kronos? worth buying?

I have only heard it maybe 2-3 times so I'm not the best judge. It tends to get very melodic at times, but from the little I have listened to it, it seemed decent, nothing amazing though. I really should listen to it more before fully recommending it.

 

[Death Aflame]

The Red in the Sky is Ours is quite a technical album. Just not in the same (gay) sense as Necrophagist is 'technical'.

 

[Krigloch the Furious]

I have only heard it maybe 2-3 times so I'm not the best judge. It tends to get very melodic at times, but from the little I have listened to it, it seemed decent, nothing amazing though. I really should listen to it more before fully recommending it.

hmm, I wont get it then. well untill someone says its awesome

 

[DarkBliss]

It's freakin' awesome

Seriously though, download, run through it several times, decide whether it's good or not, delete, purchase/don't purchase. It's not so unlikely, that this album will only keep your interest for merely a couple of weeks or so, anyway.

 

[CF87]

Deicide - Legion
[/i]

 

[Scourge of God]

Laugh all you want, then try to play it, chump.

 

[Blue_Jay]

Deicide - Legion

lmao!!!

Deicide is far from technical death metal. They aren't even hard to get into their easy!