This guy fucking LOVES me!

[NvmbrsDoom5]

And yes, personally I'd rather he stayed with SYL if he was forced to choose.

 

[mattcira]

Trust me, FF will be touring sooner than that......that's all I can say.

Two of my friends are working the SYL tour and when asked, neither could confirm who was playing bass... then again, I am so behind with buying new albums, checking tours, attending shows, etc... the tour could have started already making this post irrelevant...

 

[dan of bereavement]

holy shit!!!!! lol the kid that wrote this review is a fucking tool!!!! he used to date our singer!!! Guys fuck this jerk off. He is a fat un talented loser who stalked kelly for like 9 months. Every time they LOL "opened" for my band, we would get stares and rude remarks under their breath. his lame band the acurssed couldn't hold a match to novembers doom!!!! This kid is a medicore bassist at best....seriously, pay no attention to him and his gay reviews. It's funny how he would kiss my ass and tell me how great my band is, we play death/doom and we are from america. He's a hypocrite and a loser.
ohh and his zine sucks too. who wants to read 300 bad reviews anyway.

 

[NvmbrsDoom5]

We've had bad reviews a plenty over the years, that's not really what phases us at this point. Guys like George who review us the way he did come across as if he has something personal against us, or against Paul. When you get insulting on a level such as that, well then you're crossing the line in my book. I know other people who write for that particular site and they're much better writers than him, and they also say they're sometimes shocked at the way he reviews bands. But y'know, I'm sure the negative shock-value is what he's going for anyhow. It does manage to get him noticed, in a sense, doesn't it? lol Ironically he is a contributing writer/reviewer for Metal Maniacs as well, so I guess some people out there don't mind his crap as much as others. Whatever, I couldn't ultimately give a fuck to be honest. Any one of us here could start writing for websites or magazines if we really wanted to, reviewing discs and such, and it honestly wouldn't make us any more of an authoritative voice than anyone else or any more knowledgable......same as ol' Georgie. Opinions are like assholes, and some people's assholes are more smelly and loose than others LOL

 

[circus_brimstone]

Ironically he is a contributing writer/reviewer for Metal Maniacs as well, so I guess some people out there don't mind his crap as much as others.

This is the worst fucking news I've heard all day. On a lighter note, though, even if you don't like something there's a way to be cordial about it.

 

[Greg B.]

man, it isnt' my fault that you can't handle one person's opinion. i thought that record sucked, and told it how i felt it was. so you disagree? so what? i give my opinions on records, and i take it very seriously. it's my job, and while you're right in saying i am attempting to sway opinions, i wonder why MY opinion bothers you so much that you feel the need to write to insult me.
whatever.
while i enjoy some DT, i feel he is highly overrated, and wanted to stress that. sometimes i get over -emotional, sure, but that's just because I LIVE for music, and BAD music (like the SYL self-titled record) INSULTS me as a music fan.
that said, i'm glad my writing influenced to in some way, be it via anger or otherwise. i'm going to take the high road on this one(as opposed to my original email), and just wish you a good one.

takin' yer stinkin' order,
metalgeorge
>From: "Tito Puente Ownz Ye All" <devy_st@hotmail.com>
>To: metalgeorge666@hotmail.com
>Subject: RE: So I was wondering...
>Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 09:43:19 -0500
>
>>hey man. think whatever you like. i care not for the opinions of
>>subhumans.
>
>Then why bother writing music reviews? The way you do it, you're
>clearly trying to sway opinions but it's in a style that will only
>move "subhumans." You're not going to persuade articulate,
>intelligent people with that pap no matter what you do.
>
>>for your info, i actually dig the new SYL record. finally stopped
>>ripping off fear factory and actually PLAYING the guitar for a
>>change.
>>JOY!
>
>First of all, I'm not sure what SYL has to do with your
>vagina-beard. Second, I'll grant you that the first two SYL albums
>sounded a good deal like Fear Factory on steroids. However, the
>self-titled didn't. That had much more of a vintage thrash/death
>tone to it. Third, dude... 70's porn muff. On your chin!

 

[WhiteBeastofWotan]

he responded civilly i suppose

 

[NvmbrsDoom5]

Okay, here's an interesting situation I want to bring up, for the hell of it.

Someone like George here, when receiving criticism on his writing and opinions, says he can't help it if someone gets bothered by "one person's opinion", such as his own. In a sense, he's right, why should someone care about one person's opinion, and why let it get to you? Ah but here's the thing...
At the same time, you're (i.e. George) putting forth an opinion via a magazine, website, etc., for many people to read, and you are also admitting that your purpose is to potentially "sway" people's opinions towards your own. So in essence, you're not merely just stating that you don't like a band or album or whatever, but you're in a sense actively putting forth your opinions against said bands, albums, etc., in hopes of getting people to follow your lead and dislike or disregard the same things you do.
It is here where I say it becomes personal, and not so easy to disregard as just "one man's opinion". I think it's kind of comical actually when these reviewers put forth such venom-spewing hatred in print, no matter how insulting or belittling they get towards the artist, but then when actually confronted directly on the matter, they cop the whole "hey, its just my opinion, don't let it bother you so much"-thing. You can't have it both ways, if you're going to publicly put forth such strong opinions against someone, in an effort to sway the public's opinions towards yours, then you have to take responsibility for it and realise that you've stepped beyond just humbly being "one man's opinion" anymore.
If Greg here is a staunch enough supporter of Devin Townsend and his art, and feels that the man's music means enough to him personally, then why SHOULDN'T he feel the need to debate with George over his negative diatribe against DT, especially when George is not only voicing his personal opinions, but doing it in a very public way and admitting that he hopes to sway people's opinions as well? I'm rather baffled by the fact that George can't seem to comprehend this fact, actually. If I were to use this forum now as a means to spew hatred and distaste for certain artists, people, etc., and I admitted that I was doing it in hopes of influencing other's to agree with me, could I or should I really be surprised if some people (be it fans or even the artists and people themselves I'm speaking out against) were to come after me to spew their hate or disagreement back at me?

Myself and the other guys in ND have spoken out pretty regularly on here about our distaste for alot of reviewers/writers and their "lazy journalism" and other quirks. Ironically, we've received some feedback from different writers/reviewers, who've taken offense to this and made a point of stating that they in fact work very hard at what they do, take their craft seriously, and put in alot of time and effort to properly listen to promos and read band bios, etc. I respect that, completely. What's funny is that many of the writers/reviewers don't realise that it's merely the tables being turned on them, because while they're so quick to criticise and tear something to shreds that we've recorded, they're not thinking about how WE in fact work very hard at what we do, take our craft seriously, and put in alot of time and effort to do what we've done. All I'm saying is, if you're going to be openly vocal about your opinions and criticisms, then you should be well prepared to expect the same back at you, regardless.
I don't have a problem with the fact that people dislike our music or even hate it. That's fine, everyone is in fact entitled to such opinions and feelings, as am I. But it's the notion that someone can actually in a sense campaign their negative opinions of us in public forums such as magazines and websites, in hopes of getting others to join them in their dislike or hatred against us. I mean what else do I say to that but "Go fuck yourselves"? LOL I personally never believed that any review ought to be meant to "sway" anyone at all, based on what the reviewer's personal tastes are. I want a review to tell me the basics-- who the band is, how long is the record, how many songs, what style of music it is, and maybe even factor in things like the recording/sound quality and hell, even the controversial "comparisons" to other bands can be helpful at times. But I couldn't really give a flying fuck about whether or not George or any other reviewer feels that an album "insults" him as a music fan. I'll make those kinds of decisions for myself if and when I hear the cd in question. I don't need to be swayed by you, thanks. But so many people do allow themselves to be swayed because they think that's how it's supposed to be, and thats what people like Georgie here thrive upon. I wish more people would think for themselves, and at the same time, speak out against these overly opinionated fuckers such as Greg did.

I recently had an interesting back and forth with Jay over at the Royal Carnage forum over a lengthy review he did with us. There were things he said that I didn't completely agree with or things that I wanted to speak my opinion on, and I did. We had an intelligent, reasonable back and forth conversation/debate on it, and at the end of it, not only do I think he understood certain points of mine but I also came to understand some of his points much better as well. I have respect for the guy because even though he stated things that I disagreed with and felt somewhat challenged by as the artist, he stated them in a well spoken and intelligent manner that was thought provoking, not insulting and filled with malice. He also didn't come across as though he was hoping to seriously "sway" anyone away from buying or listening to our cd. If more writers were like that, I'd have a whole new respect for the media. I'm not meaning to be an asskisser towards him by saying all this, just merely presenting an example of someone who in fact gets it "right".

Let me just say that, much like George's claims, I too LIVE for music, and have for as long as I can remember. But I've never felt like it was my need nor my duty to have to sway anyone else's opinions about the music they buy or listen to, in order to match my own. Even when I have heard music that I couldn't stand or tolerate personally, I don't campaign against it. Because I realise that no matter how much you think you've got a clue about what's good and what's not, ultimately the listening experience is a personal one for each one of us, and how you hear things depends on the individual, and shouldn't be based on what I or anyone else has to say about it. Develop your own ear and your own tastes and likes/dislikes based on what moves you, not on what someone at a magazine or a website or in some band tells you is good or not. In my opinion, it's what people like George basically stand against by spewing his bullshit and expecting, or hoping, that people will follow his lead. It is for this that I dislike the guy, not simply because he didn't personally like my album.

 

[dan of bereavement]

Well said brother! Not only did he tear apart your efforts, but imho he bashed the whole death/doom movement, basically calling it a thing of the past and whatnot. That's like a slap in the face, and I won't forget that. Yeah, it was an opinion, but he disrespected 100's of hard working doom bands in general! Hats off to fellow American death/doom bands!!!!!

 

[NvmbrsDoom5]

Also, all criticism aside, I'm a bit perplexed as to why he'd think the way he does about us or about Paul's vocals. If he doesn't like the lyrical content, well that's his personal tastes or whatever. But I'd have hoped that someone like George, who listens to and supposedly appreciates stuff like Edge Of Sanity, Katatonia, Celtic Frost, Pyogenesis, etc., wouldn't be able to hear those obvious influences in our music, and instead resort to the tired old "sounds like My Dying Bride" comparison. If he can't listen to TPHD and realise that there's very little if anything at all that really compares to MDB, then man, I dunno! I have this feeling that perhaps he is going into it with a very preconceived notion of what to expect when listening to us, and it's a misguided notion at best.

I'm gonna say this once and for all, LOL.....Paul doesn't sound like Aaron from MDB. Maybe at one time there were some similarities but now, I just don't hear them. And our music writing is not influenced by them, particularly on TPHD. I'm absolutely perplexed that people could listen to this album and put any form of doom tag on it, honestly. There's moody slow shit here and there, but that certainly doesn't make it doom.

On the next album I'd love to throw in double bass frenzies, blast beats, black metal screeching and sweeping solos, just to see what happens. And I guarantee you more than 50% of the reviews will still call us "melancholy sad doom/death in the vein of the British bands", I'll fucking BET YOU on this one hahaha

 

[Billy Steele]

I'm gonna say this once and for all, LOL.....Paul doesn't sound like Aaron from MDB.

I'll say. I don't think I ever heard Paul's voice crack once during a song.

 

[Usurper Dan]

On the next album I'd love to throw in double bass frenzies, blast beats, black metal screeching and sweeping solos, just to see what happens. And I guarantee you more than 50% of the reviews will still call us "melancholy sad doom/death in the vein of the British bands", I'll fucking BET YOU on this one hahaha

Im with you there, Larry.
One internet chumpstain said this of our new cd 'Cryptobeast'
"Well, its everything that you would expect from Usurper... and by that, I mean a note for note rehashing of classic Celtic Frost tunes, but not quite as good." Obviously this guy either didnt actually listen to the album, or he has no idea who Celtic Frost is.
For $10 you can register a domain name, think up a spooky title for your metal webpage, and freely type all sorts of nonsense.
The reviews that Ive seen for TPHD in REPUTABLE PRINT MAGAZINES have all been overwhelmingly positive.
I wouldnt give two squirts of piss about these douchebags.

 

[NvmbrsDoom5]

Well, ol' Georgie writes for some reputable magazines, as do some of the other writers I've taken issue with in the past, so....*shrug* Oh well. Fuck 'em.

I can't believe anyone could listen to the new Usurper and call it rehashed Celtic Frost tunes, that's absolutely ludicrous. The FIRST thing that struck me about the songwriting when you played the new cd for me was the fact that it did NOT sound like CF at all!

It all goes back to what I said about people having personal preconceived notions and issues with bands. You cannot listen to something with such a closed mind, much less when you have a strong opinion of the cd before you've even heard a note. Someone please tell me, in case I'm wrong here, what songs by MDB or Anathema sound like "Dark World Burden", "Pale Haunt Departure", "Swallowed By the Moon"....if they do exist, I haven't heard them.

When we have friends/supporters like Swano, James Murphy, Moonspell, My Dying Bride who offer us praise for our work, you'd kinda think it'd make someone like George wonder what it is that these highly talented people see in us that he somehow cannot? But that'd require him to open his mind a bit and let go of whatever preformed prejudices he seems to have against us, and I don't think that's going to happen.

 

[zmetallica]

Someone please tell me, in case I'm wrong here, what songs by MDB or Anathema sound like "Dark World Burden", "Pale Haunt Departure", "Swallowed By the Moon"....if they do exist, I haven't heard them.

eh i wouldn't even think of using those bands as comparison cause there's only one band i can think of that those songs sound like... novembers doom

seriously though, you guys really have a great sound, very unique with influences from all over. people tend to hear the ones they are most familiar with.

 

[Septembers Marc]

Yeah; I totally agree with "zmetallica" about the fact that you sound like yourselves. This is a fact, because your sound is recognizable as your own. And you don't have to be totally into your music to hear it.

I think at this point in your carreers you shouldn't bother to spoil a lot of energy defining what others care to compare you with. You just play heavy music and there's a touch of melancholy in it. And people have a tendency to fence things in as to understand it.

I think enough is said about this subject an I think (hope) the recordsales speak for themselves.

Have fun in what you do; that's all that matters!!!

 

[mattcira]

holy shit!!!!! lol the kid that wrote this review is a fucking tool!!!! he used to date our singer!!! Guys fuck this jerk off. He is a fat un talented loser who stalked kelly for like 9 months. Every time they LOL "opened" for my band, we would get stares and rude remarks under their breath. his lame band the acurssed couldn't hold a match to novembers doom!!!! This kid is a medicore bassist at best....seriously, pay no attention to him and his gay reviews. It's funny how he would kiss my ass and tell me how great my band is, we play death/doom and we are from america. He's a hypocrite and a loser.
ohh and his zine sucks too. who wants to read 300 bad reviews anyway.

LOL

I think my statement's regarding "Heavy metal journalists" are dignified by this post.

Heavy Metal Journalist = Failed Heavy Metal Musician

 

[dan of bereavement]

I must say imho, you guys to me are a progression of what once was death/doom
and I don't think that there is anything bad about that. At least to me that's the closest description that comes to mind. I do understand why one would like to drop the "doom" name, as it does carry some reserve. But I would like to think that the death/doom movement has and will continue to grow and progress even more. Maybe even it's own genre name...who knows.
People do indeed have these pre conceived notions. Don't waste your time trying to prove anything, let the music speak for itself.

 

[dan of bereavement]

Ok, I saw Metal George tonight at the metal fest, and I must say, that I did go a bit overboard on my comments about him. He is a cool guy, and I have always liked him. I just took a few things that he said in his review mixed with things I "heard" and made an opinion before talking with him, we both agreed to squash this whole thing before we have some dumb band drama going on. so again I will say that I am sorry to all of you and to him for my previous comments. George and I had a beer and talked the whole night. I actually think we got a picture taken together.

Now on the review, I still think he was a bit harsh, and in N.D.'s defence I must say that I disagree with his review. I thought it was a bit opinionative and blunt. Eitherway I guess it's just that... his opinion. He gave me the latest copy of his zine and I will be reading it shortly. \m/

 

[AlexGuinness]

Yeah; I totally agree with "zmetallica" about the fact that you sound like yourselves. This is a fact, because your sound is recognizable as your own. And you don't have to be totally into your music to hear it.

I think at this point in your carreers you shouldn't bother to spoil a lot of energy defining what others care to compare you with. You just play heavy music and there's a touch of melancholy in it. And people have a tendency to fence things in as to understand it.

I think enough is said about this subject an I think (hope) the recordsales speak for themselves.

Have fun in what you do; that's all that matters!!!

I suppose it is inevitable that you will always have the "doom" tag, in the same way that Napalm Death will always have a "death" tag in some quarters.

They are not the most accurate of descriptions, but when the word is in the band name and there is a parallel to be drawn, it will be one of the first to be used.

Love them or hate them, comparative descriptions are important to us consumers. I am still quite new to ND, although managed to get hold of 4 albums now. I have personally used a comparative of The Silent Enigma era Anathem and mid period MDB. Not a bad thing as I am huge fans of both, not necessarily the most accurate, but most appropriate to get the point across to English Metal fans that I was talking to.

Who distributes your work over in Europe (or UK if different)? I bought the latest CD from The End, others have come from eBay from Australia, Italy and USA...

 

[strigoi9]

"inept pseudo-growl" is very strange wording. I, for one, appreciate the fact that you can understand what is being said in 'growl-mode'. If that is what he's referring to.

Odd that My Dying Bride was mentioned as much as Novembers Doom.

Surely, that review was meant to be taken with a grain of salt.