Watershed: Are you disapointed with it?
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x_OPETH_x
Member
That certainly wasn't what I was trying to say... It's quite possible to make a major riff sound interesting and unique...it depends on the context within a song, as well. What i'm noting about Opeth's new material is the lack of complexity or randomness within these parts, and the increasingly "light" feel I get from the songs. What drew me to Opeth initially were the oppressive progressions, the underlying dissonance they showcased, and the overwhelming sadness in the overall sound. I'm not ruling out all "happy" music from my life...you have no idea what music I listen to, aside from Opeth.
Kazraine
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- Aug 30, 2007
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What I was saying, in relation to his statement about the music before it was released is that metal bands always write about death and murder and demons and evil, its cool, its exciting... but its not dark.
In movies, you couldn't call a horror film like "Friday The 13th Part 98" or whatever "dark", its just cheesy camp horror naffness, like metal music... whereas some psychological dramas with a similar theme and tone to "Watershed" could be considered very dark, by some people.
Of course the director or script writers, or actors could miss the point entirely and turn it into just another awful Hollywood psychological drama... and maybe in your opinion Mike did that with this album and turned something he hoped to be dark, personal and not so naff and cheesy (compared to metal in general) into something overly sentimental and lacking in the atmosphere you hoped for, and in your opinion it turned out to perhaps be even more cheesy than the usual metal gurglings of "Rahhhh! Blood! Murder! Death!"?
Wow I can't believe what I'm reading. Watershed is amazing in so many ways. Axenrot is now my favorite drummer and Akesson is the perfect complement for Mikael's emotional soloing. I can agree that this album doesn't contain any ''classic'' but Heir Apparent, TLE, Burden, Hessian Peel are incredible songs. It's the best flowing album since Still Life. Good job Mr. Akerfeldt and Opeth!
hibernal_dream
A Mind Forever Voyaging
Examples? Proof? Reasoning? you haven't convinced me of anything.
How is death/murder/demons/evil not dark?
Cerberus III
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- May 14, 2008
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Kenneth R.
Cináed
I think I understand what Kazraine means.
Take Bloodbath for example:
We know that this band is not really to be taken seriously as far as the lyrical themes go. A song like Eaten cannot really be considered dark due to the fact that it was written to be over the top, for shock effect and not for conveying sincere feelings. However, if Peter (I believe he wrote the lyrics for that album) truly wants to be eaten alive, that is pretty twisted.
I believe Kazraine's referring to the actual feelings behind songs. If Watershed comes from a dark place in Mikael's head, then it is an intentionally dark album, while maybe not particularly shocking in a metal sense. Bloodbath's albums were written more for fun and to pay homage to old school death metal rather than to convey some inner darkness begging to be unleashed.
Cerberus III
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The Don
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I don't understand why Opeth fans always tend to have to spell out the obvious because they think when people say something negative or make a joke they didn't really "understand" the "true intention" of the "genius". Obviously everyone can see what Mike meant by the heavier and darker comment. My point was that this record is about as heavy as Damnation, and about as dark as a lit stadium. This sounds like their least depressive, happiest record Opeth have ever recorded (Heir Apparant aside of course). The lyrics really don't lend well to the songs (as dark as they may be) since they're executed in major keys and like 80% clean.
I thought Demon of the Fall was pretty fucking dark... But I guess Coil, Burden, Porcelain Heart, and Hessian Peel are pretty dark too...
Kazraine
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Because we live in reality. Demons aren't real.
Examples of Demons and Murder and Death being fun to listen to in a silly metal way, but not "dark" in a serious way that actually relates to anything that has ever happened in the real life of the person writing or listening to the material:
Just about every metal band that has a skull, demon, blood or violence on the front cover. :Smug:
I wasn't supposed to convince you of anything, I was just saying my interpretation of what the song writer in the band could have meant when he said what he did about the songs before they were released.
And I probably misinterpreted it, as he was probably referring to the more speedy solos and hectic drum fills or whatever
Kazraine
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To all the critics of Watershed in here; Listen to the album again.. and again.
At first listen I thought it was shit. Then it slowly grew on me. And now I think it's probably one of the best albums ever created. I like their new style and the direction they're heading interests me. Opeth grows significantly from album to album and the music demands a lot from the listener. It doesn't surprise me that so many people can't keep up with the intense progression in Opeths music. But somehow I manage to grow alongside the band and I'm lovin' it
- Gramm
Yeah, it couldn't be that someone actually *doesn't* like the album, now could it? /sarcasm
Let people have their opinions. If it changes later on, it changes later on. SO what, big deal get over it. Why can't fanboys just let go?
I personally love this album, like I have loved every single Opeth albume very made. That doesn't mean I think they are flawless....
Hlfreak
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- Nov 25, 2005
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I don't understand why Opeth fans always tend to have to spell out the obvious because they think when people say something negative or make a joke they didn't really "understand" the "true intention" of the "genius". Obviously everyone can see what Mike meant by the heavier and darker comment. My point was that this record is about as heavy as Damnation, and about as dark as a lit stadium. This sounds like their least depressive, happiest record Opeth have ever recorded (Heir Apparant aside of course). The lyrics really don't lend well to the songs (as dark as they may be) since they're executed in major keys and like 80% clean.
I thought Demon of the Fall was pretty fucking dark... But I guess Coil, Burden, Porcelain Heart, and Hessian Peel are pretty dark too...
Yes, the record sucks because it's not metal enough.
Metamyr
Member
There are many many many people that would disagree with this.
He was just stating his experience with this album. I think there are a lot of records out there that are hard to really appreciate on the first listen, and he makes a good point that watershed is one of them. Of course there will be people who dislike the music no matter how many times they listen, but there might also be people who just haven't given it enough of a chance yet.
kazraine...-1. hibernal dream... +1. Kazraine I love how you throw your point about metal out there like it's pure fact. Oh yeah, let's face it, it's pure cheese. Ok, or not. Metal music means a lot to me. Writing it, playing it, or listening to it helps relieve stress and anger. I'm a really laid back person and without metal, who knows, I might fuckin stab someone lol. But seriously, just because demons etc. aren't real, doesn't mean they can't be SYMBOLIC and explore the darker side of human nature etc.
But anyway, yeah Watershed was a dissapointment. It's a step back compositionally and at times during Hessian Peel and Hex Omega especially I find myself trying not to fall asleep. However, taking a step back to look at it, they have 2 new members and they could just need time to gel. So maybe WS is just leading to something better. Then again some people said the same thing about Ghost Reveries.
But anyway, yeah Watershed was a dissapointment. It's a step back compositionally and at times during Hessian Peel and Hex Omega especially I find myself trying not to fall asleep. However, taking a step back to look at it, they have 2 new members and they could just need time to gel. So maybe WS is just leading to something better. Then again some people said the same thing about Ghost Reveries.
Glad most of you like it!
To be honest I can't remember ever having gotten such great response to a new record....
As for the people not liking it, fine, I understand. It's not for everyone I guess. But don't ask us to "go back"...that will never happen I'm afraid.
Remember that even your favourite records are hated by others, and vice versa. There are no "facts" about the greatness of a record. It's purely individual. I mean, I love "The elder" by Kiss. Go and see what the general opinion on that record is....who's right? No one is....
As for me? I think Watershed is great! One of our best, maybe the best! But you all knew I'd say that....
And it IS one of the darkest and heaviest records we've ever done. To me it is...
Either way people, thanks for your support and even, thanks for your concern.
Mikey
To be honest I can't remember ever having gotten such great response to a new record....
As for the people not liking it, fine, I understand. It's not for everyone I guess. But don't ask us to "go back"...that will never happen I'm afraid.
Remember that even your favourite records are hated by others, and vice versa. There are no "facts" about the greatness of a record. It's purely individual. I mean, I love "The elder" by Kiss. Go and see what the general opinion on that record is....who's right? No one is....
As for me? I think Watershed is great! One of our best, maybe the best! But you all knew I'd say that....
And it IS one of the darkest and heaviest records we've ever done. To me it is...
Either way people, thanks for your support and even, thanks for your concern.
Mikey
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