Are humans inherently evil?

[razoredge]

If the world was down to one man and one woman and the man did not kill her for the sake of saving the world, it would be sad.

What if she was 300 lb with a face like a Gorilla ?

So we have people killing and eating other people on desert islands for survival ?

Our jails are full of people that cant figure out the difference between right and wrong, it saddens me to think here we have people that just dont get it. Excusive ?

Watched a interesting program on two English guys busted for trying to transport Coke from Venezuela to England. Nice little bunch of info there regarding prisons in less civilized parts of the world.... "gee I wish I didnt understand the difference between right and wrong so I could wish that kind of behavior on the whole world... then I would be such a bad mother fucker, totally sick, demonic, what a glorious day it would be"

 

[Blowtus]

No need to bring 'right and wrong' into it - the people in jails haven't effectively managed their choices with a view to all ramifications. Nobody here is suggesting anyone should do that.

 

[razoredge]

No need to bring 'right and wrong' into it - the people in jails haven't effectively managed their choices with a view to all ramifications. Nobody here is suggesting anyone should do that.

your point is lost on me, Im not following. Right and wrong is the basis of good and evil, is it not ? The people in jails are the same type those that are saying there is no such thing as evil are condoning. My point was that if you want to find evil look to the prisons, if you want to find some of those that are not born evil as the initial item of the topic questioned, look elsewhere, unless someone wants to suggest that laws and consequences are the only thing that keeps decent people decent......

 

[Blowtus]

I am saying there is no such thing as evil yet I am perfectly comfortable with locking up people I don't want around me.

 

[monoxide_child]

The notion of "good" and "evil" is stupid, it implies some sort of universal sense of right and wrong, but right and wrong are entirely dependent on the person and their point of view. All living creatures are inherently selfish as a manner of survival, and good is merely what benefits us, and evil is what would harm us.

The idea that anything committed against someone's will is invalid in my opinion. You kill and eat animals to survive, and they do the same, this is the nature of the world. We do not kill and eat each other in most situations because it's more beneficial to our survival to have a functioning community where we get along. But when people are stranded out in the middle of no where, and run out of food, they often resort to cannibalism because the need to eat overrides the need to have a community.

You can say there things like rape are always wrong. But what if there's 1 man on earth left and 1 woman on earth left, and the woman doesn't want to have sex. Is it wrong for the man to rape her for the sake of preserving the species? It's easy to sit on your high horse in society, and say "no it's still wrong, I wouldn't do it". But to me it's no different than eating animals for food, and while it's preferable to have sex be consensual so you can work together to raise the child, rape can be necessary under the proper circumstances, as can almost any act that humans can commit.

There's no good, and no evil, simply what we need to do to survive and spread our seed.

this is exactly the point i was trying to make this whole thread

 

[razoredge]

Are ya'll beaming into this satelite from another solar system or something ? On this planet I live on there is good and evil around me all the time

 

[Blowtus]

And I commune with God every morning because I have decided that God shows himself in the form of my toaster. It is easy to ascribe some objective existence to ideas, I don't really see the use of it though.

 

[razoredge]

Toasters have a imporance relevance to this thread. When they toast your bread they are good. When you stick someones hand in them and turn them on its evil... well, no... I guess it wouldnt be if you came from a culture that eats toasted hands, then its a perfectly legitmate action. not sure if God would show his face or not.

 

[NinjaGeek]

Are ya'll beaming into this satelite from another solar system or something ? On this planet I live on there is good and evil around me all the time

Good and evil are just ideas people use to illusion themselves into thinking they have some sort of universal order behind them. And interestingly enough it's often used to get people to commit acts, they might normally consider evil. Oftentimes we are alright going to war because we consider the other side to be "evil" and we represent "good". Not to say war is wrong (doing so would be hypocritical), but people should acknowledge that when we're going to war, it's not because we're good, and they're evil, it's because we don't want them on our planet and we're gonna kick them off.

 

[razoredge]

whodda ever thought it worked that way. So I can stick someones hand in a toaster and not be evil ? OK good I shall try that. I can throw a woman to the ground, punch her in the face, tell her not to scream and rip her panties off and have my way and not be evil. OK I shall try that too. This is working real good, I like the idea of abandoning the idea of right and wrong, I can just go through live as I please, fuck all. What an awesome concept. Fucking people and their damn development of words with definations, they just did it to repress my ideas of a good time.

 

[monoxide_child]

Good and evil are just ideas people use to illusion themselves into thinking they have some sort of universal order behind them.

this explains the existance of religion, God/Alla/Vishnu etc etc etc exist because random people's minds are too feeble to function in a reality without a deity-type entity

 

[Blowtus]

whodda ever thought it worked that way. So I can stick someones hand in a toaster and not be evil ? OK good I shall try that. I can throw a woman to the ground, punch her in the face, tell her not to scream and rip her panties off and have my way and not be evil. OK I shall try that too. This is working real good, I like the idea of abandoning the idea of right and wrong, I can just go through live as I please, fuck all.

Are you telling me that you only refrain from doing the above at the moment because you think it's 'evil'? Not because of the consequences that will ensue?

 

[razoredge]

Are you telling me that you only refrain from doing the above at the moment because you think it's 'evil'? Not because of the consequences that will ensue?

Yes, nothing to do with consequences what so ever. I have no desire to do such things and many far less radical. Yes I think about myself all the time but when there is a concern regarding others I am not devious what so ever. I always remember seeing any disappointment in my fathers eyes actually hurt me. I've thought about the consequences to other people or objects in any given situation as long as I can remember and not just from that of my own hand but from other people or circumstance as well. I remember seeing my father shoot a woodchuck and it took him like 2 seconds to fall, he just stood there on his back legs with a hole in him then fell over dead. I pondered that for years and still have a vivid picture of it today. Yep, never understood these things in people... Im comfortable with it.

 

[Xarthaz]

Yes, nothing to do with consequences what so ever. I have no desire to do such things and many far less radical. Yes I think about myself all the time but when there is a concern regarding others I am not devious what so ever. I always remember seeing any disappointment in my fathers eyes actually hurt me. I've thought about the consequences to other people or objects in any given situation as long as I can remember and not just from that of my own hand but from other people or circumstance as well. I remember seeing my father shoot a woodchuck and it took him like 2 seconds to fall, he just stood there on his back legs with a hole in him then fell over dead. I pondered that for years and still have a vivid picture of it today. Yep, never understood these things in people... Im comfortable with it.

Come on dude, it has everything to do with consequences and social programming. If some action has been established to be evil in society, then it is, and vice versa. People might think that throwing people to death with stones and tormenting the jews is evil, but when conditioned right(ie nazi germani or arab countries), it will not cause remorse.

The western world (in general) on the other hand has conditioned people to be "soft" consuming-crazed slabs with very critical attitudes towards any discrimination, which is why you dont want to rip ladies' panties off. You may think that you wouldnt do it without consequences, but thats because growing up in a human-rights centered society has given you an unconscious disposition to be wary of doing that stuff.

 

[Richard Mongler]

Simple question, are we?

I believe so. I make it no secret I despise many people in my life and people within my family, I would do something about it. Don't we all agree if if there were no laws or moral codes in this world, chaos will ensue because we as humans are incapable of good if there are no laws in place. Come on, if there were no laws in this world, would you steal a car or kill somebody you hate so much, commit some hate crimes maybe?

You just know someone would.

Haha, you are a silly. You say "If there were no laws in this world". But that is just the thing. These laws were constructed by man. The only thing keeping you from doing these things is yourself.

"Do what thou wilt, shall be the whole of the law." As Aleister Crowley once popularized I believe.

This does not mean I encourage one to foray into the depths of depravity though.

 

[Richard Mongler]

this explains the existance of religion, God/Alla/Vishnu etc etc etc exist because random people's minds are too feeble to function in a reality without a deity-type entity

Are you suggesting that religious people are feeble minded, based solely on the fact that they believe in something? That's terribly arrogant.

 

[Richard Mongler]

The notion of "good" and "evil" is stupid, it implies some sort of universal sense of right and wrong, but right and wrong are entirely dependent on the person and their point of view. All living creatures are inherently selfish as a manner of survival, and good is merely what benefits us, and evil is what would harm us.

The idea that anything committed against someone's will is invalid in my opinion. You kill and eat animals to survive, and they do the same, this is the nature of the world. We do not kill and eat each other in most situations because it's more beneficial to our survival to have a functioning community where we get along. But when people are stranded out in the middle of no where, and run out of food, they often resort to cannibalism because the need to eat overrides the need to have a community.

You can say there things like rape are always wrong. But what if there's 1 man on earth left and 1 woman on earth left, and the woman doesn't want to have sex. Is it wrong for the man to rape her for the sake of preserving the species? It's easy to sit on your high horse in society, and say "no it's still wrong, I wouldn't do it". But to me it's no different than eating animals for food, and while it's preferable to have sex be consensual so you can work together to raise the child, rape can be necessary under the proper circumstances, as can almost any act that humans can commit.

There's no good, and no evil, simply what we need to do to survive and spread our seed.

You say that we are inherently selfish as a means of survival, then whence came compassion? If we were so selfish we wouldn't have made it this far as a species. We'd have died off long ago. The truth is that we need each other in this world, because as much as we know, we are all that we have. We learn from each other, share ideas, write,create music, etc.

And who is to say that we need to preserve the species? Where is it written in law that it is an absolute? What if I don't want to preserve the species? What if I do not feel the desire to procreate? What if I am content with masturbation?

 

[Rayy]

Milgram's obedience experiment anyone?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milgram_experiment

Very interesting. Basically, 65% of us would shock someone to death if encouraged to by an authority figure, despite your own personal morals.

 

[vinny14]

this is me just thinking out loud... but what if humans arnt evil but we have a twisted society that tells us that we are evil? if evil is described as the opposit of good... whos the most non evil guy/ thing i can think of... god and if humans were made in gods image maybe we arnt evil... maybe its corprate america telling us we are evil to get us to act the way they want to buy the things they want to buy to elect who they want elected... idk... just me throwing out an idea...

 

[TurboDestructor]

Humans are inherently animal that's the bottom line. Evil, morality, these are just things we create to separate ourselves form the animals we know deep down we are. We inherently do what we think is best for ourselves, what WE want. We may indeed want to kill someone, or sleep with our friends girlfriend or nick a car, whatever the hell it is, it is what WE want. And what we want may be interpreted as evil, but this is a human interpretation. Do we call it murder when a lion kills a rival lion? Do we call it rape when a male animal mates with female who clearly doesn't feel like it (My head hurts/I'm tired)? NO. Humans are not inherently evil, they are inherently an animal that feels the same desires, has the same instincts, plus a few more emotions and inhibitions due to the higher level of brain function we are lucky (or unlucky) enough to possess.