Controversial opinions on metal

[CiG]

Anyway I'm done with this long streak of paralysed piss.

 

[Elric of Melniboné]

I think that rusty water needs to just acknowledge that some of the stuff that he said isn't correct. That's my main issue with him. Even after being shown why, he still has yet to actually do so.

 

[rusty water]

Anyway I'm done with this long streak of paralysed piss.

Thinly veiled ` I think I am special`

 

[rusty water]

I think that rusty water needs to just acknowledge that some of the stuff that he said isn't correct. That's my main issue with him. Even after being shown why, he still has yet to actually do so.

I havent posted anything incorrect.

Show me where.... Do we have to go through all this again?

 

[EternalMetal]

Although I disagree with most of what he's said, this is the one part I think has a limited degree of truth to it. As metal has evolved the blues influence has increasingly diminished - it would be pretty difficult to find any parallels with blues at all on your average death or black metal album. It's almost as if blues was a starting point metal had to transition away from in order to discover its true character, although undoubtedly most trad bands are pretty bluesy.

Diminished maybe, but it is still a strong influence in a lot of doom metal (which is probably a more appropriate, non-era-dependant label for Sabbath). My point was that blues-influenced riffs arent particularly a non-metal style of play, like this guy is leading us to believe. Even in some earlier death metal you hear a lot of blues-inspired pentatonic riffing. It may not be as pervasive in the style today, but objectively you cannot exclude a band from being metal just because it is blues influenced.

Do you like Napalm Death?

Yes, so what's your point?

 

[Elric of Melniboné]

I havent posted anything incorrect.

Show me where.... Do we have to go through all this again?

You said that the term "heavy metal" was not used in the early 1970s to describe Black Sabbath and other similar bands. That's factually wrong.

You also stated that Tony Iommi and Geezer Butler said that they aren't heavy metal, which never occurred ever or you would be able to document it. There are interviews where both musicians call their music heavy metal.

 

[rusty water]

In fairness, this is the controversial opinions thread, so the reaction against you may have been a little harsh. If it's any consolation, though, I think your opinion that Black Sabbath aren't a metal band probably wins in terms of the most controversial statement posted so far.

That happens to be because it's stupid, but still.

I stand by my opinion that Sabbath are `Heavy Rock`

Id say the most controversial comments in here were when people said Bruce Dickinson is gay

 

[Baroque]

I stand by my opinion that Sabbath are `Heavy Rock`

Id say the most controversial comments in here were when people said Bruce Dickinson is gay

Well his music sucks dick at least

 

[rusty water]

You said that the term "heavy metal" was not used in the early 1970s to describe Black Sabbath and other similar bands. That's factually wrong.

You also stated that Tony Iommi and Geezer Butler said that they aren't heavy metal, which never occurred ever or you would be able to document it. There are interviews where both musicians call their music heavy metal.

They werent using the term `heavy metal` where I am until the early 80`s. And I reiterate once again, the interviews were pre-internet.

 

[rusty water]

They werent using the term `heavy metal` where I am until the early 80`s. And I reiterate once again, the interviews were pre-internet.

I remember quoting Blackmore as saying that `after Graham Bonnet left the band I was looking for a singer and not someone who just shouted at the top of their voice`, and I havent searched for it, but people have said that they couldnt find that on line. I replied that it was in the sounds newspaper in the UK and was pre-internet, but they didnt believe it , because - not online

 

[Internally Deformed]

Diminished maybe, but it is still a strong influence in a lot of doom metal (which is probably a more appropriate, non-era-dependant label for Sabbath). My point was that blues-influenced riffs arent particularly a non-metal style of play, like this guy is leading us to believe. Even in some earlier death metal you hear a lot of blues-inspired pentatonic riffing. It may not be as pervasive in the style today, but objectively you cannot exclude a band from being metal just because it is blues influenced.

Dw, I don't disagree with this. It's just that I can see what he means when he says there's something mechanical in metal riffing that wasn't there in Sabbath or Hard Rock - which I think reflects the side of metal that isn't just heavy blues. That mechanical aspect tends to be what I enjoy about metal the most, incidentally.

 

[rusty water]

Well his music sucks dick at least

I like `number of the beast` and `piece of mind` of the albums he was on. I agree that the other albums of his with maiden both sucked AND blowed.

Ironically here, I like the albums that Dianno did with maiden and it is also a paradox that to me Maiden were more Metal with the first two albums than they were with Dickinson, they went the other way!

 

[Elric of Melniboné]

They werent using the term `heavy metal` where I am until the early 80`s. And I reiterate once again, the interviews were pre-internet.

1. Rolling Stone is the most popular magazine ever and was sold in Europe in the 1970s. Articles and reviews that appeared in it would be common knowledge in America and Europe. The reviewers went to the UK to interview musicians and attend concerts.

2. Creem magazine was (shockingly) also available in the United Kingdom. Lester Bangs in particular is considered to be the most influential journalist to cover metal music and punk music in the United Kingdom.

3. Regardless of where the term originated, your professed lack of knowledge of its existence isn't valid evidence that it wasn't used in the 1970s.

 

[MrTagoMago]

Rusty do you think that Grindcore is a sub genre of metal?

 

[Elric of Melniboné]

Weird how I can find articles, interviews and magazine entries from the 1970s to support my views but interviews with famous musicians that @rusty water claims exist to support his views are nowhere to be found. The internet didn't exist when the reviews I cite were written either.

 

[rusty water]

1. Rolling Stone is the most popular magazine ever and was sold in Europe in the 1970s. Articles and reviews that appeared in it would be common knowledge in America and Europe. The reviewers went to the UK to interview musicians and attend concerts.

2. Creem magazine was (shockingly) also available in the United Kingdom. Lester Bangs in particular is considered to be the most influential journalist to cover metal music and punk music in the United Kingdom.

3. Regardless of where the term originated, your professed lack of knowledge of its existence isn't valid evidence that it wasn't used in the 1970s.

They certainly werent using it extensively as I didnt come across it until `heavy metal` started in the early 80`s and with all the New Wave of British Heavy Metal.

 

[rusty water]

Rusty do you think that Grindcore is a sub genre of metal?

I have only heard of Grindcore, and have no real knowledge of it, so cant form an opinion dude.

 

[MrTagoMago]

I have only heard of Grindcore, and have no real knowledge of it, so cant form an opinion dude.

You keep bringing up Napalm Death though.

 

[Elric of Melniboné]

They certainly werent using it extensively as I didnt come across it until `heavy metal` started in the early 80`s and with all the New Wave of British Heavy Metal.

Again, your professed personal experiences are not evidence that everyone else had the same experiences as you.

 

[rusty water]

Weird how I can find articles, interviews and magazine entries from the 1970s to support my views but interviews with famous musicians that @rusty water claims exist to support his views are nowhere to be found. The internet didn't exist when the reviews I cite were written either.

See if you can find the interview with Blackmore where he said that ` when Graham Bonnet left the band I was looking for a singer rather than someone who just shouted at the top of their voice` go find that one, apparently people couldnt find it online. That was in sounds magazine.