Thoth-Amon
Hypochondriac
- Apr 4, 2006
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Controversial opinions on metal
- Thread starter The Ozzman
- Start date
HamburgerBoy
Active Member
- Sep 16, 2007
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scape the semen out of your ears bro
Not going to happen. Gildenlow's penis basically has a second home in there.
no country for old wainds
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unfocused ramble @ db:
you constantly criticise people for not explaining their opinions but all i can remember from you recently is 'it has no flow', 'i dont like the guitar tone', 'i dont like the vocals', 'it isn't interesting rhythmically' etc none of which are particularly deep comments either.
my point isn't to criticise you for that, because i believe it's p difficult at times to explain why you like one band more than another, even for someone like me who constantly tries to put this kind of thing into words. but you imply that if you can't explain a preference then you shouldn't state (or even have) that preference, and whilst im always encouraging people to think about this stuff i don't agree. i can often intuitively recognise differences between, say, two bands without being able to put those differences into a coherent paragraph. just because i can't articulate it doesn't mean it's not there - on the contrary, i'm certain it's there. hell, you've struggled as far as i can tell to articulate why you think the chasm are wanky. i'm sure it's often the same for everyone here.
i appreciate that what you're essentially doing is encouraging people to make sure it is there, make sure they're not dismissing anything for bogus reasons (like hype, bandwagon-hopping etc), but i'm finding it exceptionally patronising at this point 'cause it's like you consider yourself a prophet trying to enlighten a bunch of brainless morons. plenty of us aren't stupid and don't simply adopt the opinions of others, unconsciously or otherwise - i like to think that's been proven in the past even if it isn't proven in every instance.
i mean i'm sure we're all influenced by hype and whatnot to some extents but do you really believe we're totally brainwashed in the way you've been suggesting? i say 'we', i'm sure you're accusing some more than others, but still, i feel like i've always been pretty good at recognising this 'cause i feel p strongly about it, as in my teenage years i was a total sheep. nowadays i'm careful about giving everything a fair chance and i get pissy with people who don't do the same. but some of your comparisons and allegations are maddening to me, they seem designed solely to provoke and to avidly defend yourself rather than being representative of what you actually think when you're being rational. most of your recent posts are so drenched in bitter sarcasm and the like, and even when you alleviate the seriousness by saying it's all in jest, i get the impression you're getting really wound up about this. i just don't think you're accomplishing anything with such kneejerk defensiveness and you're distorting your own arguments in the process ... which goes back to my original point - the situation isn't as dire as you think it is. i promise. chillax or something :|
id happily read any essay you write btw, i prob agree with you on your criticisms of various metal bands/opinions more than just about anyone else here. that fucking intestine baalism rubbish eh?
you constantly criticise people for not explaining their opinions but all i can remember from you recently is 'it has no flow', 'i dont like the guitar tone', 'i dont like the vocals', 'it isn't interesting rhythmically' etc none of which are particularly deep comments either.
my point isn't to criticise you for that, because i believe it's p difficult at times to explain why you like one band more than another, even for someone like me who constantly tries to put this kind of thing into words. but you imply that if you can't explain a preference then you shouldn't state (or even have) that preference, and whilst im always encouraging people to think about this stuff i don't agree. i can often intuitively recognise differences between, say, two bands without being able to put those differences into a coherent paragraph. just because i can't articulate it doesn't mean it's not there - on the contrary, i'm certain it's there. hell, you've struggled as far as i can tell to articulate why you think the chasm are wanky. i'm sure it's often the same for everyone here.
i appreciate that what you're essentially doing is encouraging people to make sure it is there, make sure they're not dismissing anything for bogus reasons (like hype, bandwagon-hopping etc), but i'm finding it exceptionally patronising at this point 'cause it's like you consider yourself a prophet trying to enlighten a bunch of brainless morons. plenty of us aren't stupid and don't simply adopt the opinions of others, unconsciously or otherwise - i like to think that's been proven in the past even if it isn't proven in every instance.
i mean i'm sure we're all influenced by hype and whatnot to some extents but do you really believe we're totally brainwashed in the way you've been suggesting? i say 'we', i'm sure you're accusing some more than others, but still, i feel like i've always been pretty good at recognising this 'cause i feel p strongly about it, as in my teenage years i was a total sheep. nowadays i'm careful about giving everything a fair chance and i get pissy with people who don't do the same. but some of your comparisons and allegations are maddening to me, they seem designed solely to provoke and to avidly defend yourself rather than being representative of what you actually think when you're being rational. most of your recent posts are so drenched in bitter sarcasm and the like, and even when you alleviate the seriousness by saying it's all in jest, i get the impression you're getting really wound up about this. i just don't think you're accomplishing anything with such kneejerk defensiveness and you're distorting your own arguments in the process ... which goes back to my original point - the situation isn't as dire as you think it is. i promise. chillax or something :|
id happily read any essay you write btw, i prob agree with you on your criticisms of various metal bands/opinions more than just about anyone else here. that fucking intestine baalism rubbish eh?
no country for old wainds
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for the record, about your comment on MOP only being good when you turn it up loud - i almost always listen to my music at ear-splitting volume. there's that issue solved 
i actually have more problems with flow on AJFA, although i love the way that album sounds more than any other metallica (yeah yeah no bass don't fucking care). that's summed up by the title track, where i love all the bits with vocals but find it meandering for much of the rest. on the other hand i'm kind of more forgiving of the way the whole thing's kind of wild and rambling, these days. makes it feel very raw and rough and kind of labyrinthine, which i like. always found songs like harvester of sorrow and to live is to die rather uninteresting/awkward though...
MOP in comparison feels rather more glossy, there's less layers to it i guess and the sound isn't so brooding and deadened, but the songwriting talent still shines through. i agree about disposable heroes that it needs some editing, in fact i'm not massively fond of the second half when all's said and done although it's still a class apart from many contemporaries... but the power of the first half at least is not to be denied.
i think RTL is still my favourite.
i actually have more problems with flow on AJFA, although i love the way that album sounds more than any other metallica (yeah yeah no bass don't fucking care). that's summed up by the title track, where i love all the bits with vocals but find it meandering for much of the rest. on the other hand i'm kind of more forgiving of the way the whole thing's kind of wild and rambling, these days. makes it feel very raw and rough and kind of labyrinthine, which i like. always found songs like harvester of sorrow and to live is to die rather uninteresting/awkward though...
MOP in comparison feels rather more glossy, there's less layers to it i guess and the sound isn't so brooding and deadened, but the songwriting talent still shines through. i agree about disposable heroes that it needs some editing, in fact i'm not massively fond of the second half when all's said and done although it's still a class apart from many contemporaries... but the power of the first half at least is not to be denied.
i think RTL is still my favourite.
skeptik
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- Feb 7, 2003
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Master of Puppets always struck me, especially upon some retrospect of it that I underwent a couple years ago, as the product of a cohesive unit just totally and utterly within its stride. This results in a somehwat clinical proceeding, but is nonetheless precise and deadly all the same. They knew exactly what they were doing and how they were going to do it. It's almost thrash by numbers, yet I mean that entirely non-pejoratively. It's not my favorite Metallica album (I go back and forth between the first two, for very different reasons), but to call it "bad" is just ludicrous and most likely the result of a pretty superfluous understanding of the album.
Also, Slayer, especially up through Reign in Blood, is so obviously the best thrash metal band ever that it's amusing to even debate the fact. Oh, and by the way, Velocibrad, I do know a fair amount of thrash metal bands. I know, it's weird. Yet Hell Awaits is superior to [abandoning italics here to avoid monotony] Bonded by Blood, Darkness Descends, Swallowed in Black, Last Warrior/Ostatni Whateverthefuck, The Force, History of a Time to Come, Campo de Exterminio, Abominable Anno Domini, Spectrum of Death (Slayer with Iron Maiden's mascot), Doomsday for the Deceiver, Terror Squad, Infernal Overkill, Persecution Mania, Pleasure to Kill, Golem, Fragments of Insanity, A Tribute to Insanity, Finished with the Dogs, Taking Over, Killing Is My Business...and Business Is Good!, Forward to Termination, Strappado, Evil Invaders, War and Pain, Kill for Pleasure, Power and Pain, None Shall Defy, Bloody Vengeance, The Unholy One, Possessed by Fire, Merciless Slaughter, Tales of Terror, Hymn to Abramelin, Into the Abyss, Behind the Realms of Madness, Above the Ashes, Metal Deadness, Breaking the Silence, Mind Wars, Energetic Disassembly, Satan's Gift, Recognize No Authority, Mayhemic Destruction, R.I.P., Vengeance of Hell, Mekong Delta, Immortal Force, Heresy, Serpent Temptation, Recipients of Death, The Kindred, Total Armageddon, Schizophrenia, World Circus, Suffering Hour, Final Genocide, Hobbs' Angel of Death, Rather Death than False of Faith, etc.
Also, Slayer, especially up through Reign in Blood, is so obviously the best thrash metal band ever that it's amusing to even debate the fact. Oh, and by the way, Velocibrad, I do know a fair amount of thrash metal bands. I know, it's weird. Yet Hell Awaits is superior to [abandoning italics here to avoid monotony] Bonded by Blood, Darkness Descends, Swallowed in Black, Last Warrior/Ostatni Whateverthefuck, The Force, History of a Time to Come, Campo de Exterminio, Abominable Anno Domini, Spectrum of Death (Slayer with Iron Maiden's mascot), Doomsday for the Deceiver, Terror Squad, Infernal Overkill, Persecution Mania, Pleasure to Kill, Golem, Fragments of Insanity, A Tribute to Insanity, Finished with the Dogs, Taking Over, Killing Is My Business...and Business Is Good!, Forward to Termination, Strappado, Evil Invaders, War and Pain, Kill for Pleasure, Power and Pain, None Shall Defy, Bloody Vengeance, The Unholy One, Possessed by Fire, Merciless Slaughter, Tales of Terror, Hymn to Abramelin, Into the Abyss, Behind the Realms of Madness, Above the Ashes, Metal Deadness, Breaking the Silence, Mind Wars, Energetic Disassembly, Satan's Gift, Recognize No Authority, Mayhemic Destruction, R.I.P., Vengeance of Hell, Mekong Delta, Immortal Force, Heresy, Serpent Temptation, Recipients of Death, The Kindred, Total Armageddon, Schizophrenia, World Circus, Suffering Hour, Final Genocide, Hobbs' Angel of Death, Rather Death than False of Faith, etc.
VelociBrad
Spawn of Possession
If you've listened to all those albums and still think Reign in Blood is better than them, all I have to say to you is: you are an idiot, and a typical Slayer moron.
metal_wrath
I dip my forefinger...
Krow
Garbage Connoisseur
Can no one read?
Pretty sure he said Hell Awaits beats all those albums, not Reign in Blood.
Pretty sure he said Hell Awaits beats all those albums, not Reign in Blood.
Saparmurat_Niyazov
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Thoth-Amon
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Its not a question of whether or not Reign in Blood is better than some or all of those albums... or whether you personally like it more than those albums... the fact of the matter is that RIB is a killer thrash album and only a complete poseur would call it a piece of shit.
HamburgerBoy
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VelociBrad
Spawn of Possession
You sure you don't have to wake up for high school in the morning?
oh and Spectrum of Death (Slayer with Iron Maiden's mascot)? seriously? this pretty much invalidates any opinion you might have that is any good (not that there was one in the first place). Go back to yelling FUCKIN SLAAAAYYYYERR at every concert bro.
DarkBliss
...And okra for all
Re: Metallica:I actually like AJFA more than the rest simply because it has no bass( I don't really like overstated bass). It's totally the most fluent and rhythmically arresting of all Metallica records, in my opinion.
Basicallly, the songs on MOP that I don't really like are the ones in which Hetfield's vocals don't match the rhythm section precisely: Disposable Heroes and Leper Messiah. The rest, I'd say is great.
And overall, I for some reason started to dislike overuse of emphasized breakdowns in metal(they distract from the flow).As well as very obscure bass-heavy production.
By the way, I've noticed that I like albums that you can easily sing along to.(In Pains notwithstanding, but still the vocals on that album are more intelligible than other death metal I've heard).
Also, Tom, it feels a bit creepy when you address my ignorance regarding well-received albums and bands that I don't like(and you do) just because [insert some reason here that I posted]. We all prioritize stuff according to how often we listen to it, and what not.
Don't feel obliged to fall in line after me, as if I'm indeed some beacon of undisputed reason(which I'm not; just a very opinionated person). It seems kinda stalkerish actually.:
Disagreement is always healthy.
And you know what I've come to realize?
A lot of those cult classics are actually very inaccessible,and maybe that's the reason why they're so praised in the underground: either too convoluted for mainstream metal fans to embrace, or not dynamic enough, or too harshly produced. This is why, for instance, Necromantia will always be less accessible than Dimmu Borgir despite overt aesthetic similarities-the busy buzzy production suffocates the dynamics of the music.And of course it's free of the "taint" of commercialization: processed vocals and industrial segments. It's not because of compositional depth and artistry, or anything like that.
How does one measure compositional depth in reality? Can artistry easily be defined? I don't think so.
Each person and his own set of ears.
Another observation: many people come into metal from rock. So they'll probably be looking for something aesthetically similar to rock in metal. Which is why I've noticed that for instance Stronghold is the most favored of all Summoning output, since it's the definitely one of the most rockish. Minas Morgul is just so obscure and underdeveloped, whereas Dol Guldur is too sluggish and bass-heavy.
Since I've been getting more into rock, I've come to favor the more rockish albums in metal; dissonance doesn't do much for me anymore.
Basicallly, the songs on MOP that I don't really like are the ones in which Hetfield's vocals don't match the rhythm section precisely: Disposable Heroes and Leper Messiah. The rest, I'd say is great.
And overall, I for some reason started to dislike overuse of emphasized breakdowns in metal(they distract from the flow).As well as very obscure bass-heavy production.
By the way, I've noticed that I like albums that you can easily sing along to.(In Pains notwithstanding, but still the vocals on that album are more intelligible than other death metal I've heard).
Also, Tom, it feels a bit creepy when you address my ignorance regarding well-received albums and bands that I don't like(and you do) just because [insert some reason here that I posted]. We all prioritize stuff according to how often we listen to it, and what not.
Don't feel obliged to fall in line after me, as if I'm indeed some beacon of undisputed reason(which I'm not; just a very opinionated person). It seems kinda stalkerish actually.
:Disagreement is always healthy.
And you know what I've come to realize?
A lot of those cult classics are actually very inaccessible,and maybe that's the reason why they're so praised in the underground: either too convoluted for mainstream metal fans to embrace, or not dynamic enough, or too harshly produced. This is why, for instance, Necromantia will always be less accessible than Dimmu Borgir despite overt aesthetic similarities-the busy buzzy production suffocates the dynamics of the music.And of course it's free of the "taint" of commercialization: processed vocals and industrial segments. It's not because of compositional depth and artistry, or anything like that.
How does one measure compositional depth in reality? Can artistry easily be defined? I don't think so.
Each person and his own set of ears.
Another observation: many people come into metal from rock. So they'll probably be looking for something aesthetically similar to rock in metal. Which is why I've noticed that for instance Stronghold is the most favored of all Summoning output, since it's the definitely one of the most rockish. Minas Morgul is just so obscure and underdeveloped, whereas Dol Guldur is too sluggish and bass-heavy.
Since I've been getting more into rock, I've come to favor the more rockish albums in metal; dissonance doesn't do much for me anymore.
Mort Divine
Shrine Maiden of the In-Crowd
skeptik
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Considering you're the one demonstrating dudebro tendencies and irrational hostility on the interwebs, I'm surprised you're not the one screaming FUCKIN SLAAAAAAYYYYERR in real life. Aren't you 28? I hope you're more mature in your normal life than you are here. Assuming that anyone who thinks Slayer has produced the best the genre has to offer is "are an idiot, and a typical Slayer moron" is incredibly juvenile and something I would be more likely to expect from Mort Divine, not a full-fledged adult as your age attests to yet your maturity belies. But then again this is the internet where people don't actually exist and words don't actually carry any meaning. Keep on keepin' on, brotha, and continue to ignore how indelible an influence Slayer had in that band whose logo you boast as your avatar. I look forward to gradually seeing you blossom into an adult on these forums as the years go by and you realize that differences in quality judgments with respect to music has minimal correlation with intelligence.
The Spectrum of Death bit was just a bit of a jab at how people tend to overrate it due to its obscurity. It's an excellent album, but it's really not original or groundbreaking by any stretch of the imagination.
edit: Damnit, now I feel bad about my comment about you, Mort. Thanks man. <3
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