Controversial opinions on metal

[Talos of Atmora]

I've brought up that stuff to other punk fans I've met before and they said that it "tarnishes the spirit of the music". That's why I defined it the way I did.

 

[EspaDa]

Would it be controversial here to say I think Remain in light is the greatest album of the 80s?

It's a great album, Fear of Music is a masterpiece too. But there's still an album called Fresh Fruit for Rotting Vegetables.

 

[Satanstoenail]

I'm listening to South of Heaven again right now and Araya's vocals sound epic. I know what you mean by the sound of the album being more restrained, but I don't see that as a drawback - it lends clarity.

Finally someone here with a good opinion about South of Heaven. I've been waiting some time.

 

[MrTagoMago]

It's a great album, Fear of Music is a masterpiece too. But there's still an album called Fresh Fruit for Rotting Vegetables.

I don't like that album nearly as much tbh.

 

[MrTagoMago]

Would you guys count Seven Churches as a death metal album?

 

[Phylactery]

Death/thrash to be specific, but if you want to give it one label I think it would be more appropriate to call it death metal and not thrash metal.

 

[MrTagoMago]

I knew it was a hybrid of death metal and thrash metal but from what I recall there has been debate over whether or not it should be seen as a real death metal album kinda like how Venom is often considered the first black metal band but there music is really more nwobhm than real black metal.

 

[Talos of Atmora]

I knew it was a hybrid of death metal and thrash metal but from what I recall there has been debate over whether or not it should be seen as a real death metal album kinda like how Venom is often considered the first black metal band but there music is really more nwobhm than real black metal.

On the subject of Venom, I really do think they lean more towards NWOBHM than black metal. If any band laid the foundation for black metal, it was Celtic Frost.

 

[MrTagoMago]

On the subject of Venom, I really do think they lean more towards NWOBHM than black metal. If any band laid the foundation for black metal, it was Celtic Frost.

I think most nowadays agree on Venom but Why Celtics Frost instead of Bathory?

 

[Phylactery]

kinda like how Venom is often considered the first black metal band but there music is really more nwobhm than real black metal.

You might regret opening this can of worms, it could start a multipage debate on the matter.

Iirc I've seen interviews and magazine extracts from the early 80s that refer to Venom as a black metal band. I'm not a fan of the idea of retroactively changing the genre of a band because 10 years later the Norwegians came along (among others of course) and changed the definition of the genre. That doesn't make sense to me.

Due to this, I personally like the idea of "first wave black metal" and "second wave black metal".

 

[Talos of Atmora]

I think most nowadays agree on Venom but Why Celtics Frost instead of Bathory?

Hmm...I suppose that with albums like The Return, Bathory would have been the beginning of black metal as we know it. The reason I said Celtic Frost was due to how much they influenced bands like Darkthrone but that could be contested against.

Phylactery, I like the idea as well. Scandinavian bands really redefined the genre in the '90's compared to their '80's counterparts.

 

[Elric of Melniboné]

Hellhammer sounds plenty like black metal to me. I can't see anyone not hearing that, even if you think Venom isn't truly a black metal band. I think they're a black metal band though in case anyone wonders.

 

[no country for old wainds]

Would it be controversial here to say I think Remain in light is the greatest album of the 80s?

to me yeah, the B-side is barely even good IMO (i don't even like 'once in a lifetime' particularly, my fav on that side is probably 'listening wind' and even that's only an 7.5 or 8/10 at best). A-side is one of the greatest sides ever though.

 

[Phylactery]

Hellhammer/Celtic Frost cover all the extreme metal sub genres imo and it's pretty much impossible to classify them.

 

[Internally Deformed]

Hellhammer/Celtic Frost cover all the extreme metal sub genres imo and it's pretty much impossible to classify them.

Yeah agreed. Celtic Frost is as close to grindcore as it is to black metal, which sounds retarded but is also true.

 

[MrTagoMago]

You might regret opening this can of worms, it could start a multipage debate on the matter.

Iirc I've seen interviews and magazine extracts from the early 80s that refer to Venom as a black metal band. I'm not a fan of the idea of retroactively changing the genre of a band because 10 years later the Norwegians came along (among others of course) and changed the definition of the genre. That doesn't make sense to me.

Due to this, I personally like the idea of "first wave black metal" and "second wave black metal".

I do agree there tends to be a difference between first wave black metal and second wave black metal (I don't really like second wave but I love a lot of the first wave black metal). That said with Venom they sound like a more sinister and raw NWOBHM band with Moorhead and hardcore punk influence. Mercy full fate is often referee to as black metal but I think that's to do with imagery and style because musically they aren't black metal in any way imo.

Hmm...I suppose that with albums like The Return, Bathory would have been the beginning of black metal as we know it. The reason I said Celtic Frost was due to how much they influenced bands like Darkthrone but that could be contested against.

Phylactery, I like the idea as well. Scandinavian bands really redefined the genre in the '90's compared to their '80's counterparts.

I mentioned Bathory because he released his first album before Celtic Frosts first ep and while the Bathory Debut may not be pure black metal it sounds more like the standard black metal than Celtic Frost does imo.

 

[Talos of Atmora]

I do agree there tends to be a difference between first wave black metal and second wave black metal (I don't really like second wave but I love a lot of the first wave black metal). That said with Venom they sound like a more sinister and raw NWOBHM band with Moorhead and hardcore punk influence. Mercy full fate is often referee to as black metal but I think that's to do with imagery and style because musically they aren't black metal in any way imo.



I mentioned Bathory because he released his first album before Celtic Frosts first ep and while the Bathory Debut may not be pure black metal it sounds more like the standard black metal than Celtic Frost does imo.

Yeah, I can see that.

 

[Internally Deformed]

Moorhead... Mercy full fate

You drunk?

Moorhead is an awesome band name btw.

 

[MrTagoMago]

You drunk?

Moorhead is an awesome band name btw.

I use a tablet and it's been giving me hell with its bizarre autocorrections and fucking up everything I type.

 

[MrTagoMago]

Hellhammer/Celtic Frost cover all the extreme metal sub genres imo and it's pretty much impossible to classify them.

Yeah I thought of bringing this up since I've never really known what to call Celtic frost.