Cool Nordström Interview

[Ermz]

That was part of my criticism of the music industry in the 'Attack Attack new album' thread, yet oddly not many seemed to agree.

It seems the consensus is that the industry is in a bad place, which isn't self-sustainable, with inappropriate financial distribution, yet there's no point addressing it because 'that's the way of things'. Gotta say that when this collapse finally ends, it will be interesting to see what will be left in the debris.

 

[Pedro Teixeira]

soooooo true!
(though you might wanna replace that name with some other random generic name to avoid confusion with boardmembers

I didn't get it, am I missing something?
#

 

[Soundlurker]

What's worse is that almost every mix project is being provided all DI with just a MIDI file for drums

Would you prefer mixing a recording of a cheap drum kit in a rehearsal space with minimal or no acoustic treatment. And since it's a rehearsal space, the drums heads and cymbals are battered 4-10 hours a day and seldom replaced. I won't even mention the quality of the mics when what they are supposed to record sounds like utter crap in real life. As for the guitars, you'll have to settle for a solid state Randall combo, all gain and treble, no mids.

I'll take the DI and Midi, thank you. There have always been recordings with questionable quality, long before the DFH+POD era. At least now you can actually end up with a high-quality product despite the appalling source.

 

[Metaltastic]

I didn't get it, am I missing something?
#

I think he meant the "random joe" part, but I also don't think he realized that that's a very common expression, so you're good I'd say

 

[Pedro Teixeira]

aaah!! loool, yeah, I did mean joe by "random joe", random people.. lol, sorry if it was misinterpreted. There edited. haha

 

[Lasse Lammert]

sorry for editing your thread...confused it with the "quote" button"

 

[TheWinterSnow]

That was part of my criticism of the music industry in the 'Attack Attack new album' thread, yet oddly not many seemed to agree.

It seems the consensus is that the industry is in a bad place, which isn't self-sustainable, with inappropriate financial distribution, yet there's no point addressing it because 'that's the way of things'. Gotta say that when this collapse finally ends, it will be interesting to see what will be left in the debris.

And that is where Gareth's argument made sense. That simply bullshit to think "thats the way of things" and where I can stand at highly disagreeing with what Joey said. Yes its about money like he did mention only in the sense of making a living. However there comes to a point where a label has monopolized the money flowing through the industry for the point of wealth, power and fame, and when in excess, it will kill the working man in the industry. Joey will realize it when he finds himself out of a job when the whole industry collapses or when it gets to a point where hes out of work when bands can no longer pay for his services.

Attack Attack is one of those bands that was crap that a label saw as a good marketing for money and now have taken a priority to the hardworking bands that are also on that label, that will be less money that those bands will get and could force them to call it quits while AA is making bank and fame by pulling shit out their ass.

Yeah people may want bands like AA like Joey said, but as Nordstrom said it, I think is only the Americans that want it as most Europeans are creating a revolution against pop culture. We need the general public to stop giving these talentless assholes the money, the labels are investing money into these bands if we don;t support those bands then all of the sudden those labels that are killing metal and many other genres will be gone.

If it continues this way, you can expect metal to be extinct in the very distant future and we will all be stuck listening to Kayne West or silence, either one will result in suicide.

 

[CatharsisStudios]

@ at all this oh blah pod + impulse+ drum machine insults

what happend to the whole it doesn't matter what you use its the end product, and what your clients like.
also, maelstrom sounds like a fucking douche bag.

great read though

 

[Lasse Lammert]

Would you prefer mixing a recording of a cheap drum kit in a rehearsal space with minimal or no acoustic treatment. And since it's a rehearsal space, the drums heads and cymbals are battered 4-10 hours a day and seldom replaced. I won't even mention the quality of the mics when what they are supposed to record sounds like utter crap in real life. As for the guitars, you'll have to settle for a solid state Randall combo, all gain and treble, no mids.

I'll take the DI and Midi, thank you. There have always been recordings with questionable quality, long before the DFH+POD era. At least now you can actually end up with a high-quality product despite the appalling source.

these are points I just don't understand...
if a band doesn't have the money to record properly don't record....if you can't mic/record a drumkit and an Amp don't call yourself an engineer...
it's really simple....

to me it sometimes seems like "yeah, but I can't cause I don't have the [insert things like "room", "Amp" etc]" is an excuse...no it's not!
If I don't have a car and no mechanics I can't be a formula1 pilot...as easy as that.

it's not that everyone HAS to be an engineer and every shitty band HAS to record a top-notch album...
"Ican't, I don't have,..." are no excuses for me, if you "can't, don't have..." don't call yourself an engineer, and for fucks sake don't create a myspace page pretending you're running a studio.

it's like I'm saying I'm a pilot....but I don't have a licence nor an airplane...but my excuse is "yeah I can't afford one...so I'm just using a flight simulator...but it's almost as good as the real deal"....
shitty excuse...fact is I'm not a pilot and I should not offer cheap flights in my simulator as the real deal!


if anyone mentiones Joey or AA in this thread I'm gonna delete it...4 threads about that topic in the sneap forum are enough...and those are annoying the fuck out of me anyway..thought about merging them into one already!

 

[TheWinterSnow]

@ at all this oh blah pod + impulse+ drum machine insults

what happend to the whole it doesn't matter what you use its the end product, and what your clients like.
also, maelstrom sounds like a fucking douche bag.

great read though

they are fine when it comes to a major recording studio using them for the final result, however bands using them to cheep out of going to a real studio to save money and thus during a pandemic of said situation puts recording studios and non-major labels in risk of not being able to make ends meet, and these labels provide jobs for many hard working average Joes, including the musicians who are trying to make a living.

 

[Force666]

And that is where Gareth's argument made sense. That simply bullshit to think "thats the way of things" and where I can stand at highly disagreeing with what Joey said. Yes its about money like he did mention only in the sense of making a living. However there comes to a point where a label has monopolized the money flowing through the industry for the point of wealth, power and fame, and when in excess, it will kill the working man in the industry. Joey will realize it when he finds himself out of a job when the whole industry collapses or when it gets to a point where hes out of work when bands can no longer pay for his services.

Attack Attack is one of those bands that was crap that a label saw as a good marketing for money and now have taken a priority to the hardworking bands that are also on that label, that will be less money that those bands will get and could force them to call it quits while AA is making bank and fame by pulling shit out their ass.

Yeah people may want bands like AA like Joey said, but as Nordstrom said it, I think is only the Americans that want it as most Europeans are creating a revolution against pop culture. We need the general public to stop giving these talentless assholes the money, the labels are investing money into these bands if we don;t support those bands then all of the sudden those labels that are killing metal and many other genres will be gone.

If it continues this way, you can expect metal to be extinct in the very distant future and we will all be stuck listening to Kayne West or silence, either one will result in suicide.

Dude, that's just plain ridiculous. The "industry" has ALWAYS been this way. It's just people's jealousy that more people like Attack Attack than your "insert random metal genre here" band. That's just the way it is. Everyone loves "Underground Metal" that goes against the grain. Yet you're going to bitch about it being "underground" and that major labels aren't dumping huge amounts of money into these/your bands?

That was James' argument agains Ermz. This is nothing new. It's always been this way. You're acting like Cannibal Corpse and Death were making millions of dollars back in the 90s but now the industry has collapsed. That's just not the way it is. We all (mostly) play in Extreme Underground Metal bands.

If you're doing it for the "art" then just enjoy yourself and be happy with what you have. If you're doing it for the "business" then just accept how it is and do what you have to do, to get what YOU want out of it.

That's how it's always been, and how it will always be.

 

[Cryo114]

And that is where Gareth's argument made sense. That simply bullshit to think "thats the way of things"

His argument did make sense. But it's also the case that that is the way things are. The only thing you can really do about it is stop making music like that and stop buying music like that.

If it continues this way, you can expect metal to be extinct in the very distant future and we will all be stuck listening to Kayne West or silence, either one will result in suicide.

It's all cyclical anyway. I'm not worried about metal turning to shit. If it does and that leads to it dying out then it'll just grow again, from a joy of the music, right back to a product for the masses again. Joey enjoys what he does (I hope) and for that reason alone he should keep on going the way he's going. If you don't like it, don't buy it. I know that sounds simplistic, but thats because it is. You can limit how much this fucks with you by dealing with it and loving the music you love.

 

[Jaymz]

if anyone mentiones Joey or AA in this thread I'm gonna delete it...4 threads about that topic in the sneap forum are enough...and those are annoying the fuck out of me anyway..thought about merging them into one already!

 

[Lasse Lammert]

use one of the 4 Joey/AA/Gareth threads please, I can't fucking stand it anymore!


this was about a Nordström Interview and it's ok to discuss the topic he mentioned....but for fucks sake, can we please have a thread that's not derailing into another AA/Joey thread?
fucking hell!!!


Edit: I see posts have been edited..thanks

 

[TheWinterSnow]

Dude, that's just plain ridiculous. The "industry" has ALWAYS been this way. It's just people's jealousy that more people like Attack Attack than your "insert random metal genre here" band. That's just the way it is. Everyone loves "Underground Metal" that goes against the grain. Yet you're going to bitch about it being "underground" and that major labels aren't dumping huge amounts of money into these/your bands?

That was James' argument agains Ermz. This is nothing new. It's always been this way. You're acting like Cannibal Corpse and Death were making millions of dollars back in the 90s but now the industry has collapsed. That's just not the way it is. We all (mostly) play in Extreme Underground Metal bands.

If you're doing it for the "art" then just enjoy yourself and be happy with what you have. If you're doing it for the "business" then just accept how it is and do what you have to do, to get what YOU want out of it.

That's how it's always been, and how it will always be.

you kind of missed the point but ok, rather than making a huge explanation ok it, keeping it simple, once metal bands and producers who were making a comfortable living are struggling to make ends meet. Yes you can blame the economy but its more from bands cheaping out because the labels aren't backing them like they used to. And that may be because of all the music downloading, digital recording tools, "free plugins", the labels aren't making the revenue that they used to and with pop culture seeming to get narrow each and every year the money that used to be there is slowly disappearing.

 

[CatharsisStudios]

and these labels provide jobs for many hard working average Joes, including the musicians who are trying to make a living.

i don't usually think of label having alot of average joes, like GM or microsoft or other places would. but i get your point ish.

 

[DaWolf]

these are points I just don't understand...
if a band doesn't have the money to record properly don't record....if you can't mic/record a drumkit and an Amp don't call yourself an engineer...
it's really simple....

to me it sometimes seems like "yeah, but I can't cause I don't have the [insert things like "room", "Amp" etc]" is an excuse...no it's not!
If I don't have a car and no mechanics I can't be a formula1 pilot...as easy as that.

it's not that everyone HAS to be an engineer and every shitty band HAS to record a top-notch album...
"Ican't, I don't have,..." are no excuses for me, if you "can't, don't have..." don't call yourself an engineer, and for fucks sake don't create a myspace page pretending you're running a studio.

it's like I'm saying I'm a pilot....but I don't have a licence nor an airplane...but my excuse is "yeah I can't afford one...so I'm just using a flight simulator...but it's almost as good as the real deal"....
shitty excuse...fact is I'm not a pilot and I should not offer cheap flights in my simulator as the real deal!


if anyone mentiones Joey or AA in this thread I'm gonna delete it...4 threads about that topic in the sneap forum are enough...and those are annoying the fuck out of me anyway..thought about merging them into one already!

So what is an unsigned band supposed to do in these times ?
Bands want to play gigs, and to get gigs you`ll have to show a decent recording.
With the economy going downhill , I had to sacrifice around € 60000 in the last five years to keep my job. Now I even lost the job itself. And I don`t intend to stop doing music after 20 years because of that, hell no. Maybe the time will come if it doesn`t get better,but not yet.
I get your point from the engineers side, but I have to look at my side.
So we`ll have to record our stuff ourself, sorry...

 

[Force666]

you kind of missed the point but ok, rather than making a huge explanation ok it, keeping it simple, once metal bands and producers who were making a comfortable living are struggling to make ends meet. Yes you can blame the economy but its more from bands cheaping out because the labels aren't backing them like they used to. And that may be because of all the music downloading, digital recording tools, "free plugins", the labels aren't making the revenue that they used to and with pop culture seeming to get narrow each and every year the money that used to be there is slowly disappearing.

I understood your point. I just don't agree. Bands like Arch Enemy, Dimmu Borgir etc are making MORE money now than extreme metal bands were before. This is MY point that I think you're missing. Metal is NOT pop culture, never has been, never wil be. That was the whole point of it's invention to begin with. I'm sure when Fredrik recorded Slaughter of the Soul he wasn't charging 1000$ a day like he is now. Just because your average "Record Producer" can't make a thousand bucks a day, "like the old days" don't really mean shit. They might have to just live like the rest of the world and make 200-300 a day, like a Carpenter or any other specialized trade. OH NOES.

My point of this, is that the Music/recording industry might not be able to rake in the "rockstar" profits that they used to. But, if you ask me, that's good.

 

[::XeS::]

Would you prefer mixing a recording of a cheap drum kit in a rehearsal space with minimal or no acoustic treatment. And since it's a rehearsal space, the drums heads and cymbals are battered 4-10 hours a day and seldom replaced. I won't even mention the quality of the mics when what they are supposed to record sounds like utter crap in real life. As for the guitars, you'll have to settle for a solid state Randall combo, all gain and treble, no mids.

I'll take the DI and Midi, thank you. There have always been recordings with questionable quality, long before the DFH+POD era. At least now you can actually end up with a high-quality product despite the appalling source.

Definitelly Yes, I would prefer to record a shitty drumkit with no acoustic treatment (what I actually do) instead of using DFHS.
And if you have no mics you can't have a studio. If you have only a Randall combo you can't offer reamping service or guitar recordings.
I didn't start a studio service when I have nothing but I save money until I have enough to buy all I need to start. I bought all my mics, interfaces, preamps, stands, etc...
Actually I don't have a studio yet but I can offer services and I'm working.
There is a guy in my city. He charge 350€/song and he uses cracked cubase, cracked plugins, shitty e-drums, amplitube, he has only 1 mic for vocals....many local bands worked with him but now all his clients are migrating to me, because I charge the same and I offer the "real thing" and it sounds better.
I think it's a crime to charge 350€/song working only in a bedroom with no equipment and no investments for 3 activity years. With all the money he earned I have bought an HD2 system without doubt.
I could it too, charge 350€ with cracked Sonar, cracked waves plugins, a firepod etc.... but it's not professional at all. I prefered to show an image of my service a little more professional than a bedroom studio. And last but not least you learn to work with mics, acoustic, etc....with dfhs/pod you learn nothing.

 

[nwright]

they are fine when it comes to a major recording studio using them for the final result, however bands using them to cheep out of going to a real studio to save money and thus during a pandemic of said situation puts recording studios and non-major labels in risk of not being able to make ends meet, and these labels provide jobs for many hard working average Joes, including the musicians who are trying to make a living.

While I can agree with your sentiment, I truly don't see how using impulses, DFH, POD's and the like are OK for "major recording studios" to use, but not bands trying to save some dough. If anything, it should 100% be the other way around! If I go to a "major recording studio" and they plop me down in front of a POD, a drum sequencer and some impulses, I'd walk!

The "problem" is that many bands can go the DIY route and produce results that are VERY competitive with the tried and true "real" studios these days. I think many of the smaller project studios, even guys on here (without naming names) have made a "name" for themselves because they are the intermediary between a "major recording studio" and the average bedroom/garage band wanting to have a viable product. They produce results that are on par with the big boys, but more than likely at a much smaller price point.

I ride the line on where I stand because I have aspirations of being an AE (even if part time or freelance), but I am also too aware of the realities of being in a metal band (since I'm in one). For us as a band, it's REAL hard to say we are going to plop down 1,2, 3K on a recording when we can get pretty decent to good results on our own, and I actually work in/with a studio! So bands like mine are killing my business aspirations. I'm shooting my own self in the foot.

Sorry to say, but my mind and heart (as a musician in a band) say that IF IF IF I can get results that rival big studios on a broke band budget, then I will do it every single time.

My only caveat or desire would be that I could get the competitive results using my amps, our drummers drums, etc. and play it "for real". For bands and methods that seem to raise the most ire on here, my beef with it/them is that in general the methods, sounds, and bands are just templated one to another...But you can apply that too the myriad of pop tarts and country artists in the world today...The only difference is those "artists" must not know much about computers! :Smug: