Crimson - Too Repetitive?

Static

Static

Manically depressed robot
May 5, 2002
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If it wasn't for Green Carnation's Light of Day, Day of Darkness, Crimson would be my favourite one song concept album.
Its biggest (and only fault) is that after the acoustic section of Crimson around mid-27 minutes the rest of the song just seems to be riffs repeated from before 28 mins or so. It feels like they ran out of ideas after that point and cut and pasted previous riffs with new lyrics to fill the last 12 mins.

Thats what will always make Crimson, for me, great but not amazing. Anyone agree with this?
(than again the album was written and performed in a very short amount of time)
 
Originally posted by MacMoney
I like Crimson way better than Light of Day, Day of Darkness. IMO LoDDoD has more repetition than Crimson.
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That is probably true, I just seem to prefer LODDOD, possibly musically. I did not mean in any way I dislike Crimson, I listen to it constantly, I'm just critical of the details and the one thing I can fault it for is its repetition. I still think it gets too repetitious in its last 12 mins much like the way I am being repetitious now in saying its repetitious, again
 
I don't think the repetition on Crimson is due to running out of ideas more than it is trying to bring back the original feel of the song; bringing back themes from earlier.
 
Originally posted by Static

Its biggest (and only fault) is that after the acoustic section of Crimson around mid-27 minutes the rest of the song just seems to be riffs repeated from before 28 mins or so. It feels like they ran out of ideas after that point and cut and pasted previous riffs with new lyrics to fill the last 12 mins.
Click to expand...

Hmmm, I disagree with you. That may have been the actual case, but I guess only Dan or the EOS guys would know. However, just listen to it and follow the story with the music. (The ones who didn't follow...), when he repeats that clean riff, it suits this section so unbelievably well. It's such an emotional piece, and at this point, it brings back memories from earlier in the song, recalling to the previous section. And if you were following the lyrics along, it kinda brings you back to that point in the story, kinda helping you keep the the rest of the story in mind.

And then the message from the dead king, when the riff comes in after that, how can you feel that it was cut and pasted?? If anything I think they cut and pated it into the front of the song....Seriously, it's such an intense and driving riff that I don't think any piece of music could better represent the men forging on to destroy the queen. The music may repeat, but the sections are amazing and create the pace of the story.

By the way, don't you find LODDOD repetitive as well? Their repeated sections sound way more forced than on Crimson IMO. And they have that one theme melody that keeps jumping back in in a lot of the riffs. Kind of a cool thing I have to admit, but I consider it more repetitive feeling than Crimson.
 
im gonna keep it simple , crimson shits on LODDOD......, the story is amazing....Does anyone know how they came about writing it....
 
Once again I'll tell you I do think LODDOD is as repetitive if not more than Crimson. I agree with you somewhat that Crimson repeats sections in the sake of continuity but I think themes are repeated too often. I just think some of the riffs sound amazing the first two times or so, but some are repeated up to four times and it feels later on that the song does not have more to offer.

I have followed the entire story to the music before and I agree that the variation of previous lyrics adds greatly to its story. Yet, riffs should have been added that flow from previous parts into new parts. This would make the re-used riffs have a new purpose in the song, the end of Crimson feels an anti climax, there is no build-up or new ending riff, which would have made the song and story feel more complete.

There are some new parts like that trippy voice bit, but variations on previous riffs would create a sense of moving forwards, not a deja vu feeling or having already been there.

I'm not trying to put down or insult Crimson, I'm just a nitpicker and its the only thing that for me detracts from the song. Repeating riffs in sake of continuity is good and well I just think it gets to the point where it is kinda annoying.
 
Well, i´m gonna give my opnion on this :) And please do notice it´s only an opinion ;)


There are some new parts like that trippy voice bit, but variations on previous riffs would create a sense of moving forwards, not a deja vu feeling or having already been there.
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That bit got me thinking.. well, according to the story, i think that is exactly what you're supposed to feel, i.e. the deja vu. I always understood it that the story is telling us about how it all repeats itself, life repeats itself, goes in a circle (well, i´d rather say a spiral on that one) because people seldomly learn.

And i always thought that the end of the song made you wanna listen to the whole thing again coz it goes in a circle (again, a spiral would be more appropriate).

Ahh, i don´t remember what i was thinking anymore..
 
That is quite a good interpretation of it, I didn't really think about it in that way. They could possibly be creating a sense of deja vu in sake of the story. My argument was that it possibly forsakes it sense of moving forwards, I'm not really sure which interpretation is 'correct' though and I'm not quite sure of how to come to a conclusion on which one is 'right', ah well. I guess you could read it in either way although most hardcore Swano fans would be inclined to disagree with me. :rolleyes:
 
Static: in music, as with every other artform, you interpret it for yourself. Even if the artist himself/herself had something completely different in mind when creating whatever it is you're interpreting, it´s finally comes down to it that it is you that are enjoying the piece of art.
Your life experience and your view on life has a great effect on how you interpret it.
I wouldn´t say your view on Crimson is wrong just because i have another view. You´re entitled to your opinion and hey, it just goes to show what a creative mind you´ve got if your view is different from other Swanö fans, can´t it? ;)

Anywho, ever noticed how artitsts tend to say when asked about something in their creation "People should interpret that for themselves"? I think it´s a good thing when people do that. Although, sometimes i just reaally wanna know what the fuck something means in a lyric or book or whatever just to understand what the whole thing is about ;)
 
I'm stuck studying for university exams and have nothing to do to fill the spare time lately but post on these forums.

So sue me.

Gleemonex: The whole thing your talking about is subjectivity, how every person sees something in a unique way, I'm just of the opinion that if something bugs me I should let it open for discussion. All in all, Crimson is a fucking masterpiece and I couldn't write anything like it.

I do find it sometimes incredible how differently people see things, especially when someone starts talking about a band like Slipknot and an argument ensues about whether they are a piece of shit or hardcore metal, just to go completely off the topic.
 
ah well, i like going off topic, it can develop into a swell discussion :)

yeah, i´ve often wondered about how it works. when ppl find bands like system of a down, westlife, etc to be so good. Maybe i havn´t looked at it correctly, maybe i should think of it like food. It can´t be explained why ppl like some food and dislike other (or can it? lol). Well, maybe that´s something completely different though, due to it concerning the body and the taste.. erm, "taste bud"? But there must be something causing it. Maybe it is simply because you get used to all music (yeah, ever noticed how annoying it is when you´ve suddenly got a crappy song on your mind, all the time?). ah, i don´t know, i´m babbling, i´m bored lol
 
I'm just trying to get my 20 posts so that I can have an avatar of my choice, but I must say that I like the fact that Crimson is repetetive. It allows me to tune it out consciously and enjoy it on the subconscious. Never really tried to follow it. I just allowed it to be.

"Always tell her she is beatiful, especially if she is not."
-Lazarus Long
 
Yeah you are babbling a little but its all good. The fact is I like System of a Down, quite a bit actually, but I can understand why some people hate them. They do have rather limited musical abilities and when I compare them to Opeth and Edge of Sanity they really look like pieces of shit, but for some reason I still really like them. Makes no sense I know.

Linkin Park songs also get stuck in my head all the time and I know all the lyrics from hearing them so often, its goddamn annoying.
 
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