you guys are all crazy...
I have HD1 accel on a mac pro quad-core.
1. Current mac pros are outdated?? what?? My Mac is almost 3 years old and it will last me another 3 years. And maybe another 3 if I upgrade it. Sure, the new mac pro's have twice the power, but my OLDER mac pro is still twice the power I need!
2. Some arguments are that current processors are far for powerful than HD cards, people saying you can't run as many plugs on the TDM card as on your CPU. This is true but it doesn't matter. These days you wouldn't buy PTHD for the plug-in processing, you buy it for the stable audio engine which is independent of your CPU. It will work the same every day regardless of what your processor is doing. In my biggest mix sessions, my CPU usage meter has never gone above 45% and is usually much lower. Just use RTAS plugs and let the TDM cards handle the rest. (although using TDM plugins and sends / busses with no latency while tracking is great)
3. Yes, it would seem that this deal is an indication that Digi is releasing something new soon. That may be true, but keep in mind that these rumors have been popping up every year on Gearslutz and similar forums for a while now. Truth is even if they do release something new, any HD system you buy now will be supported and sufficient for years to come. Think about it... I know everyone here is all about Logic and native DAWs and the newest machines, but in reality the pro world runs on PTHD. It IS the standard and it will be a slow transition to anything new. Hell, lots of big studios are still using old G5s with PCI cards and it works just fine... do you think they're going to jump in right away and spend a bunch of money on the mythical new Digi product?? no way. Anyone doing this professionally day in, day out needs a stable system and they're too busy to care about what's "new" if their current setup is working. Digi knows that, which is why they haven't updated the HD line in a while. It still works fine, it's the people who can't afford it that complain.
It's easy to let a few haters on internet forums influence your purchases. But really, aside from the price I can't think of a single negative thing about PT HD. And for someone like you Joey - that cost isn't unreasonable, and HD2 on a new mac pro will give you at least 5 years of rock solid recording where you can focus on the music instead of worry about your system.
1. If you bought your Mac Pro three years ago, then I'm guessing that it's PPC. New apps are currently already being made supporting Intel Mac's only. So sure you can use what you have till it breaks but, new apps are not going to support it at all. Again, new Mac Pros are likely due out in First Quarter 2010. It's already the end of November. This is not a good time to buy.
2. You cannot guarantee that any DAW always performs the same. There are still errors in Pro Tools just like every other software on the planet. Maybe you are just saying that it's a bit more reliable? If so, I could give you the edge to that argument.
3. How do you know any HD system will be supported for years? Avid stock is not doing well, and are conserving resources wherever possible. Avid/Digidesign are pretty much known for their secrecy, so how could you possibly have this information? Also yes $8k for seven year old PCI cards is unreasonable. Also five years from today of rock solid performance...I really doubt that especially if Avid's current hardware is abandoned any time soon. Also I have owned well over 40 computers at least 10 of these have been Mac's in the past four years. Not a single computer has lasted and been reliable five years straight.
These are all my opinions and look/read those crazy long digidesign forum posts and you will see many that have the same exact sentiments. I'm all about getting my absolute money's worth. I do not believe that neither buying a Mac Pro that will be updated quite soon nor purchasing extremely old PCI cards is the best usage of money right now.
Also in response to
"i would still be in a brand new world FOR ME. i've done great work with crippling situations. having a non crippling situation would increase my work, life, and decrease my stress level ten fold."
What if this brand new world is made obsolete by likely NAMM product announcements? Why not just wait two months? From reading about your frustrations I understand your concerns, so if you really want to spend the money, then do it. I would just personally wait two more months to see what happens.
its pretty hard to dismiss pt when i watch a 60 second video on youtube of someone taking a song and changing the tempo of the whole thing in two steps, and it actually sounds fucking decent.
I would definatley still sugest speaking with an authorised digi dealer in your area. They will be more than happy to take your money. Im sure they will be able to get you the discounted rate. Its still alot of money you will be parting with, they will want your buisness.
maybe you'll be able to find a local dealer to pull some strings. There's gotta be someone out there who will ignore that point to meet their quotas...
first and foremost, thanks for the post. pt and mac is all a brand new world to me. ive been on steinberg for at least 6 years now, and this is all going to be new to me. im even ditching the pc platform and switching to mac.
i need high performance, scary high performance.
let me give you an idea of what one of my days can be like. i was recording a band who was working with a co-writer, and the co-writer couldnt write a melody to the song as is, so he recorded it in a different key, acoustic, and sung over that. when we got it back we loved the song acoustic, so i had to make that happen, in 32 hours. i hopped on my computer and went to work. in the end, the track came out real sweet, but i had to make several compromises to make it happen. first off, i had to switch back and forth from 3gb mode on xp so i could open up some higher end VST's (they need more ram than xp can deliver on standard boot settings)... i have 4 gb in my system, so i have to boot in 3gb mode so i gain an extra gig for program use (the vst). this bugs the shit out of me. you know what this does? this causes me to be lazy, and not want to add a string part or something of that nature to a song just because i have to do all of this shit to make it happen.
another thing i had to do was "hope" that something would work. for instance, i'd get an instrument track sounding great, but before i could go to the next instrument to play an accompany part, i had to bounce the prior. when i got a little further i discovered i need to change the old part. i had to bounce the new instrument, reload the instrument and make an edit to the midi and re run the bounce on the prior instrument. blah blah that goes on forever.
finally, i never got to hear the song fully finished until after i made all the bounces. im used to things being this way so it wasnt bad at all, i planned well. but it would be nice to experiment creatively instead of having to plan all of the time. this is music we're talking about. there's no guitar player that every time he picks up the instrument, plans exactley what his going to play note for note until he puts it down. audio production should not be like this either.
but anyways, i need zero latency. at this point in my career, i can hear the effects of 2 milliseconds off, and i am always struggling by muting and un muting takes for the musicians as they track, so they won't become slowed down by this slight natural delay compensation. is it fucking weird that i can hear a vocalist nailing the take during the tracking, then go back to hear it changed by a millisecond?? in addition to this, i can't rely on vari audio or time warp to be 100% precise. its about 85% precise. if i need to take 4 notes of a solo and time stretch them to quantize them to the grid, i expect that quantization change to STAY (when i've heard it correctly on play back) after i bounce. what happens? it does not stay, it changes. randomly. and i've done my research, its not supposed to. mpex 4 algorithm is bugged, and has been bugged from the start. its not sample accurate. neither is the realtime bounce of time warp. (i use cubase 5, so thats where this is coming from).
its pretty hard to dismiss pt when i watch a 60 second video on youtube of someone taking a song and changing the tempo of the whole thing in two steps, and it actually sounds fucking decent. WTF. i diserve that. with the amount of money im making, and the people im working with, i should be able to have this power, and i dont.
i really want pt to be the end all for me, and with its place in the industry being so firm, im finding it hard to believe there's anything else that's rivaling it when so many professionals turn to PT for the end all solution to executing their job.
i just want to make sure im getting what i need. and through my own personal research, that has turned out to be pt hd 2.
A lot of this sounds like issues with your computer. Even if you don't go for HD, at least get the 8core.
sweet, and thats good to hearman earlier this year I switched to a HD1 system and a duende running on a quad-core dell precision 7400(yeah I know but didn't have the cash for a mac) and I couldn't be happier with it. I hesitated about sinking the cash into something that would eventually be phased out, but I started thinking about how many great albums have been mixed on hd systems and figured how can I go wrong.
for me the best thing about hd is the stability, the past 6-7 months have been the most stress free recording sessions I have ever had. I'm actually able to work and and be creative and not think about the pc at all.
and if you want to save some $ you can probably get a hd2 setup used on ebay for under $5000 with a decent set of plugins. even cheaper if you go with the 96 interface. alot of people don't like them but they are alot better that the 002-003