Do you believe?

[Caca Volante]

i found out that ghosts had cut me when i woke up in the morning

 

[deliverance]

....noone is perfect, and we are all wrong. we have all sinned and are unworthy to be in God's presence. only way is the sacrifice Jesus made on the cross. that freed us from our sins. he paid the penalty for every sin you are ever going to commit. that nawing in the back of your mind, that you know is the truth that you wont acknowledge..if you listen to it, and admit that their is a higher power than yourself, and to submit to Him, you will receive LIFE.

"Religion easily has the greatest bullshit story ever told. Think about it, religion has actually convinced people that there's an INVISIBLE MAN...LIVING IN THE SKY...who watches every thing you do, every minute of every day. And the invisible man has a list of ten special things that he does not want you to do. And if you do any of these ten things, he has a special place full of fire and smoke and burning and torture and anguish where he will send to live and suffer and burn and choke and scream and cry for ever and ever 'til the end of time...but he loves you."

i think i remember seeing that on tv. hahaha incredible excerpt.

 

[Hubster]

Someone said that would be the equivelant of a tornado tearing through a junk yard and the final outcome of the chaos is the Taj Mahal.
Seth

That's a nice dry analogy

Well commented, Seth

 

[RookParliament]

I wish I knew how to do that whole quote thing but anyway the argument from irreducible complexity is complete crap. Life is possible because one of the properties of carbon is it has four valence electrons. And if there wasn't enough carbon in the universe we wouldn't be here. And there would be no notion of God.

If through evolution we had never gained the ability to notice patterns, well humanity would probably not exist, but also there would be no notion of God. Where you see divine intention, I see the immense beauty of existing in a universe that is so statistically negligible that it barely bears thinking of. Here I am alive in a universe that doesn't give a shit. This unbelievable web of matter, life and death, competition and cooperation that is all around us is so magnificent it boggles the mind. Of course when you look out at it with just your common sense, divinity; the sublime, must have a hand. But when you study it through the skills of science a God just seems completely unneccesary to me. I mean it has been shown that the mitochondria in the cells of all animals are actually bacteria that in primordial times hitched a ride in our cells because the cell and the bacteria both had something to offer each other in terms of increasing the others survival. This one event ( or rather these mainly basically concurrent events) is a small step towards our modern day world. I feel priveleged to live and I need no God to explain it to me.

Sorry to derail the thread. I shit myself in shame

 

[NeverIsForever]

Ummm...ppl making the assertions have the burden of proof.

I am not attempting to convince you of their existence. Therefore I don't have to prove anything to you, because I don't particularly care whether you agree with me or not. I am saying I PERSONALLY believe in them because I have no reason not to.

 

[borsox13]

Well, I've seen stuff before. My mind could have played tricks on me, and everything else I believe would tend to have me say no. But I have seen some "ghosts" and whatnot, so I'd say yes.

 

[Seth'Peth]

. This unbelievable web of matter, life and death, competition and cooperation that is all around us is so magnificent it boggles the mind. Of course when you look out at it with just your common sense, divinity; the sublime, must have a hand. But when you study it through the skills of science a God just seems completely unneccesary to me.

This is the classic atheist arguement, you answer and contradict yourself all at once with this statement.

The skills of science would mean that the brightest people on earth have figured out that there is no God, or that he is/was unneccesary. You can't honestly think that even the smartest humans have figured out anything so complex as how the universe, earth, humans and ultimate existance came about. Well, of course you could think that, but it's terribly narrow minded and quite bloated with pride to think we, living on this less than sand grain size planet have any knowledge of what's out there...in the physical universe or realms beyond the physical. We can't figure out how to keep ourselves from dying, or how to protect the planet from dying.

All the science and technology you can muster still amounts to a hill of shit in the grand scheme of things.

Seth

 

[Jon Snow]

I am not attempting to convince you of their existence. Therefore I don't have to prove anything to you, because I don't particularly care whether you agree with me or not. I am saying I PERSONALLY believe in them because I have no reason not to.

Did you have a personal experience?

 

[Profanity]

All the science and technology you can muster still amounts to a hill of shit in the grand scheme of things.

Seth

Exactly, something beyond human capabilities/thinking is probably responsible for the universe.

Andrew

 

[Justin S.]

In matters of religion, supernatural phenomena, whatever you care to call things that would transcend the physical (ie observable or measurable) universe, the only acceptable answer is Not Applicable.

Questions pertaining to these topics can not be answered because we exist within and are equiped for a material realm. Its all guesswork.

The debate should never go past this very simple fact.

 

[Profanity]

This thread should now end.

 

[Justin S.]

Continuing in this line of thought, its beyond frustrating seeing how much energy is squandered, completely and totally wasted in such a pointless debate that, by its nature, has no answer that we can detect.

We have very immediate, severe problems in a realm we can control (or at least influence) and yet we watch the ship sink and continue to squabble over fantasy.

 

[Metalloid]

Continuing in this line of thought, its beyond frustrating seeing how much energy is squandered, completely and totally wasted in such a pointless debate that, by its nature, has no answer that we can detect.

We have very immediate, severe problems in a realm we can control (or at least influence) and yet we watch the ship sink and continue to squabble over fantasy.

I rarely (or never) do this, but great post. I completely agree

 

[Ermz]

...continue to squabble over fantasy.

Obviously not an avid DnD follower, eh?

 

[Agarves]

Hi.

This is i think my 11th post here. I come here to read some info about the music of a band called Opeth. And what do i find here? The HEAVIEST topic i have ever read. Makes me realize how little i know... almost... nothing.

Many thanks to absolutely all of You,

Agarves

 

[Seth'Peth]

^ Not a problem, you'll soon find that Opeth fans are the smartest people on the planet. But as I stated, that doesn't mean much.

Seth

 

[NeverIsForever]

Did you have a personal experience?

Incidentally, yes. I'm not sure why I'm about to type all this out, because I don't think anyone is going to believe me, but...here goes nothing.

I was at work one morning about three or four months ago and I heard what sounded like children talking and laughing outside, in back of the building. Since people aren't supposed to be hanging out or playing around back there, I went outside to check. Not only was there no one in the immediate vicinity, there was no one around anywhere. The street was deserted in all directions. (I live in a small town, and it was pretty early, around ten on a Sunday morning, so people weren't really out and about yet.) So I assumed I was just hearing shit and went back inside.

I'd probably just have forgotten the incident, except I kept hearing the kids again all morning long. I was the only person there that did, and maybe I was just imagining things. I'll never know for sure. But put it this way, the voices were real enough to me that I went out of my way to go look for the source, multiple times. In other words, dropping what I was working on and leaving the building to search around outside, even though I looked pretty crazy explaining to my co-workers that I was going to look for people no one else could hear.

And before anyone asks, I wasn't under the influence of anything at the time, either. I've never been drunk or high on anything in my life...

 

[NeverIsForever]

Wow you're right Trey, thanks for opening my eyes on that one. I mean, you were there, so obviously you know best

 

[the_drip]

There is no God. I had a dream last night, and I was talkign to God...and I beat him in a game of 9-ball. I got him on a best of 5. Mr. Infallible was a poor sport and said he'd rain down fire and brimstone. Even though I paid our Tab at the bar.

Ok so there is a god, but he's an asshole. And ghosts are real. Because last week I played chinese checkers with my grandma, and she's been dead for 6 years. She won. I suck at chinese checkers.

 

[the_drip]

Yes that is tempting. But grandma would ruin my shit if I did that. She's a scary dead bitch.