Dream Theater

[waif]

Well, for one thing it's really boring. And for another, did I mention it was really boring? And also, it sucks. And it's boring. And it's more than a little pretentious, but we won't even get into that...

 

[Matt]

I couldn't find my post in here fsr. Anyways, DT rule.

 

[King Richard]

Why does everyone hate Octavarium? It'd be nice if someone could explain what's so bad about that album... I think it's quite awesome.

Yeah, it gets alot of hate for sure. Personally, I like it alot. Though I'm usually pretty biased when it comes to my favorite bands. They'd have to write a really horrible fucking album for me to talk shit about it.

 

[Vegard Pompey]

Right, I believe you got your point across.

Even though there's a lot of "gay" stuff on Octavarium... I think the soft parts are much better than on any other DT album. Even I Walk Beside You is quite good despite being so poppy.

 

[King Richard]

whoa...the board locked up on me

 

[Woolie Wool]

Why does everyone hate Octavarium? It'd be nice if someone could explain what's so bad about that album... I think it's quite awesome.

It's full of poppy songwriting, excessive allusions to other, inferior bands, one of the worst DT ballads ever ("The Answer Lies Within"), a mallcore hangover from Train of Thought ("These Walls") tuned all the way down to fucking A, and a very bland opener ("The Root of All Evil"). The last two tracks are all time classics, but there is some dull stuff to slog through before you get to those.

 

[ShredHeadJHJ]

Not only are there more solos in Train of Thought but they are also the worst solos Dream Theater have ever recorded. Usually, even in their most self-indulgent moments, Dream Theater's music is intricately planned and flawlessly executed--these guys know their shit and know what they're doing. With Train of Thought, I think they weren't really on top of things all the time, because they wrote the whole fucking album in two weeks. Why would you spend only two weeks writing an album?

I totally agree with this, however I think the reason they wrote it in two weeks was to get as "raw" & "metal" of a sound as they could muster up.

Oh yes! Judge a band by their two worst albums, a grand idea! Buy Images And Words.

I totally agree with this. I actually like their first three albums the best, by far. "Awake" is about as close to a perfect 100% album as you can get.

 

[zabu of nΩd]

Listening to Images and Words now. I would say it's good about 1/3 of the time. The other 2/3 of the time it's merely decent. They have the same problem a lot of prog bands do - having really hit-and-miss songwriting that they attempt to cover up by making it sound really complex. Unfortunately, tons of random shit do not a great album make.

This band sounds extremely like Rush, btw.

 

[Woolie Wool]

I would say they're a lot better than Rush, because (a) they purged a lot of the more overt pop sensibilities from Rush, (b) the singer is not Geddy Lee (the guy plays a mean bass, but his voice is awful), and (c) the synthesizers are far, far better.

Also, a prog band needs a lot MORE songwriting skill than a regular heavy metal band, because the material is more complex, there are no more hard and fast rules, and you often have to tie a lot of very disparate elements together. These guys even managed to beat a killer song, "The Mirror", out of groove metal, the hideous bastard stepchild of metal genres.

Also, if you get lost during the solos, it's your fault, not theirs. Follow the drum and bass grooves if you get confused.

If you think this is random shit, I wonder what you'd make of fusion jazz. Some of it is so complicated and dense that you have to pay undivided attention to it constantly or you get lost. I am not kidding.

 

[zabu of nΩd]

My main complaint is that the quality of their melodies is really inconsistent. Some of them move me, but a lot of them just meander on and on without really raising any hairs or moving toward any emotional peaks.

Also, they have a lot of rather weak, ballad-like moments. I'm not a big fan of soft, piano-led sections, or sappy/preachy vocals. And I don't think most metal fans are either.

All that aside, some of their songs definitely rip. I think my favorite on the album is "Metropolis Pt. 1".

Oh, and I don't see what's so bad about any of those things you point out against Rush. Pop sensibilities and silly vocalists are things you just have to have some patience for. They're from the seventies, after all. And I'm not really sure what the problem is with the synths (but I don't listen to much Rush, so I'm not going to try guessing).

 

[Woolie Wool]

The synths on Rush albums just sound really awful to my ears. I've never liked analog synths as much as digital, but Rush's are particularly irritating.

Also, listen to "Learning to Live" a few times. It's not that easy to get into, but it has some incredible emotions and atmosphere. The keyboard solo before the fade-out gives me the chills every time.

 

[Black Friday]

If you think this is random shit, I wonder what you'd make of fusion jazz. Some of it is so complicated and dense that you have to pay undivided attention to it constantly or you get lost. I am not kidding.

Going off-topic: My dad recently got a fusion album. I liked it. Recommend me some more.

 

[The_Lunar_Strain]

Not very awesome.

just kill yourself now

 

[V.V.V.V.V.]

Now, now, folks...

 

[zabu of nΩd]

Going off-topic: My dad recently got a fusion album. I liked it. Recommend me some more.

STEELY DAN

Actually, I'm not sure if they really count as "fusion", but they're a really jazzy rock band, and they're also one of the greatest rock bands EVER, so you should like them alright. Check out the album Countdown to Ecstasy.

[/off-topic plug for Steely Dan]


edit: If you're looking for some instrumental jazz-fusion, check out Soft Machine. They're a killer psychedelia (late '60s) / fusion (early '70s) band.

 

[S<issors]

dt rule, fuck the haters, etc. glad I could contribute to this discussion

 

[Vegard Pompey]

STEELY DAN

Actually, I'm not sure if they really count as "fusion", but they're a really jazzy rock band, and they're also one of the greatest rock bands EVER, so you should like them alright. Check out the album Countdown to Ecstasy.

Hell yes. Great fucking music.

dt rule, fuck the haters, etc. glad I could contribute to this discussion

Nice contribution.

I've been going through DT's discography in chronological order lately. I'm finally starting to like When Dream And Day Unite, it just bored me at first. I still don't like the vocals though.
I'm also beginning to understand why Images and Words is such a classic. I don't remember it being this good, but I guess I had a problem with soft music at the time I started listening to DT.

 

[Bothering]

Dream theater is pretty boring to me these days. They lack a lot of the emotion they once had in their music and are constantly regurgitating the same riffs and rhythms. Images and words and Awake are the only albums I can stand to listen to now...on the rare occasion I want to listen to Dream theater. I'm not saying they suck or anything (they used to be my favorite band a long time ago), they just don't affect me the way the used to and their last 3 or 4 albums have been simply disapointing to me.

 

[Woolie Wool]

Going off-topic: My dad recently got a fusion album. I liked it. Recommend me some more.

Pat Metheny. Some of that shit is insane. Also try Return to Forever's Where Have I Known You Before, which features Al Di Meola, who invented shredding.

(Steely Dan is not "fusion" in the same sense as Pat Metheny or even Liquid Tension Experiment)

 

[sixxswine]

I'm a casual fan...
Great musicians, but there's too much self-indulgence...
they'd be the perfect band if they were capable of keeping their
tunes within the 4-5 minute mark.
A little bit of the progressive wanking goes a long way...
That said, since I don't own all their stuff I bought their best of compilation. That's all I need from them...