In Defense of Nevermore...

[Greykiller]

Perfectly worded. I think people too often tend to confuse their own personal tastes and quality. There's lots of quality stuff out there that simply does not appeal to me, for one reason or another. That's cool. Different strokes for different folks.

Zod

...and you can take my words any way you want to...but when I say weak I mean weak. Look for power. Look for range. Look for emotion. Look for heart.

If you want to call it opinion, that is fine. To paraphrase a line about porn:
"I may not know a lot about the technical aspects of singing, but I know a good voice when I hear it."

 

[lady_space]

Keep in mind, I was referring to the show where Nevermore headlined and Opeth were right before them, at the Masquerade.

Gotcha! I was thinking of the show at the Roxy back in October or whenever... thanks for clearing that up.

Shaye

 

[General Zod]

...and you can take my words any way you want to...but when I say weak I mean weak.

OK.

Look for power.

Check.

Look for range.

Check.

Look for emotion.

Check.

Look for heart.

Check.

If you want to call it opinion, that is fine. To paraphrase a line about porn: "I may not know a lot about the technical aspects of singing, but I know a good voice when I hear it."

For starters, I have no idea how that relates to porn. Regardless, there's a whole lot of people who would disagree with you. A whole lot of people who have spent a ton more time listening to him sing on disc, as well as live. However, if because you think he's a weak singer, based on a few listens, then he must be. After all, you know a good voice when you hear it. Clearly you are right, we're all wrong. Congrats on your opinion being fact, it must be nice.

Zod

 

[SavaVIDude]

Just because he sings like a guy and doesnt subject his testicles to the same punishment most PM or Prog singers do, doesnt mean his voice is weak.

That's a funny description, Dude!! Tobias Sammet call it the "eunich" voice!! My wife, who loves metal (Godsmack, Metallica, Pantera - RIP Darrell), can't STAND those voices!! It's like fingernails on a blackboard for her. Women's hearing in the upper frequencies is better than men, and I think she's real sensitive to it.

On the voice discussion, in a metal band, I just don't like a "Bryan Adams, Rod Stewart" sandpaper voice (although I like those artists doing their own shit) in a metal context. It's a contridiction to me to have these heavy-as-shit phat layered guitars and this thin rusty sounding voice. The best example I can think of is Megadeth. I love them, have seen them 5 or 6 times, own several CDs, but Dave's voice is soooooo non-metal for me. It's almost like when I was 18, having hot heavy foreplay (which usually lasted a minute or two!!) and I came before I got it out of my pants!! LOL

Also, when a metal band has a singer with a "Dave Mustaine" voice, like Warren, bad sound is multiplied - mushey guitars and NO voice!!

The other thing is I saw Nevermore several times when they opened for Savatage (RIP) on the Poets and Madmen tour. Warren was so full of himself, after their set, he sent a roadie over to hit on my wife for him!! :Smug: Now that happens A LOT, because she is a certified babe, but either he thought that would impress her (bad assumption) or he was scared of me!! Anyway, my Nevermore experiences will nevermore occur, since my wife won't be with me at PP!! When I told her Nevermore was playing at PP, she suggested sending one of his roadies over to tell him my wife said HI!!!!!!!!!!!!! LOL.

Peace,
Cheis

 

[DT Jesus]

... except for all the prog rock weenies, who are going to run, screaming and holding their sensitive ears...

Why would prog rock fans attend PPUSA in the first place?

 

[DT Jesus]

I don't know if it's a mark of how much I love Warrell's voice or how long I've been listening to him (prolly both), but it had honestly never occurred to me that other people might actually *dislike* his singing

Sometimes I really like what Dane does, other times his style just sounds incredibly forced and pretentious. On my personal overall likeability scale, I'd say he's exactly average.

 

[General Zod]

Why would prog rock fans attend PPUSA in the first place?

I'd say that many of the "Prog" bands that have played ProgPower were as Rock as they were Metal; Townsend, Threshold, Freak Kitchen, Stride and even PoS. None of those bands are pure Prog Metal. TAnd don't get me wrong... I'm not saying that as a criticism, just as an observation.

Zod

 

[Greykiller]

OK.
Check.
Check.
Check.
Check.
For starters, I have no idea how that relates to porn. Regardless, there's a whole lot of people who would disagree with you. A whole lot of people who have spent a ton more time listening to him sing on disc, as well as live. However, if because you think he's a weak singer, based on a few listens, then he must be. After all, you know a good voice when you hear it. Clearly you are right, we're all wrong. Congrats on your opinion being fact, it must be nice.

Zod

Hey we agree to disagree. After reading your post, three things come to mind:
1) I am just stating my opinion. Did not want to convey it as fact. Just like I would not take what you say about it as fact either.

2) I have heard 90% of their discography, and my OPINION has not changed (so I can no longer be labeled ignorant about the group).

3) People who have heard a lot more by the group, and have a lot more groups to compare them to will have a different OPINION. No need to get personal man--if you have strong opinions about someone that is cool--but I am not attacking you or your taste in music. In fact it is because of people like you that I will not reject them out of hand. I will be in the stands when they play. I will give them a listen. If I listened to a band and thought it sucked, and people like you also said it sucked, I would not waste my time trying to find a seat to watch them come September.

 

[General Zod]

Hey we agree to disagree.

No problem.

1) I am just stating my opinion. Did not want to convey it as fact.

That was kind of the way it read. Perhaps I misunderstood. Either way, no harm, no foul.

2) I have heard 90% of their discography, and my OPINION has not changed (so I can no longer be labeled ignorant about the group).

I thought you said you only heard the last three? I'm surprised that you've heard the title track to "Dreaming Neon Black" and could say he sings with no heart or emotion. But hey, different strokes...

I will be in the stands when they play. I will give them a listen.

Cool. Having seem them on their last few tours, I think they're currently at the top of their game. Warrell and Jim are sober. Loomis and Smyth work very well together. And Williams is the best drummer in Metal (in my opinion, of course).

Zod

 

[Pellaz]

....Warrell and Jim are sober.

There are quite a few apocryphal stories about Warrell's drinking and his voice being 'off' at shows. I don't know if there's that much truth or correlation to them, but if there is....Glenn, hide the liquor backstage!

 

[Harvester]

There are quite a few apocryphal stories about Warrell's drinking and his voice being 'off' at shows.

I believe those stories to be true. I am 100% at ease knowing he is now sober.

Glenn H.

 

[scooterSST]

I'll say this to the Warrel Dane naysayers:

Warrel sings exactly how he means to -- at least on disc, if not 100% of the time live -- he's spot-on, as far as the notes and style he intends to sing. Whether or not you enjoy the singing is your own issue, not his.

Amen...

Nevermore is going to destroy Earthlink...:hotjump:

the nay sayers have three choices

1) Don't come to Prog Power

2) go back to the hotel during Nevermore's set and get the beer cold for the rest of us

3)Open up and try to enjoy the set, you might hear something you've not heard before


Nevermore on Friday and Evergrey on Saturday.... I'm so there

 

[aztattooedsean]

yeah in the past he was a wee bit off but he sounds dead on now that he is sober!

 

[scooterSST]

yeah in the past he was a wee bit off but he sounds dead on now that he is sober!

I've seen him hammered (him, not me :Spin: ) and he was on, vocally. He almost took out a drum kit... however

 

[eaeolian]

I believe those stories to be true. I am 100% at ease knowing he is now sober.

Glenn H.

I *know* those stories are true - I've seen it. When I saw him here w/Opeth, he sounded the best he had since the "Politics" tour. I have no fear that it will be a good show.

 

[TheWhisper]

...and you can take my words any way you want to...but when I say weak I mean weak. Look for power. Look for range. Look for emotion. Look for heart.

If you want to call it opinion, that is fine. To paraphrase a line about porn:
"I may not know a lot about the technical aspects of singing, but I know a good voice when I hear it."

Perhaps that should read...'I know a voice I like when I hear it'. I think his voice fits the music Nevermore makes and I damn sure think he sings with heart, soul, intensity, power, emotion. It's all subjective man, personal tastes vary, and that's a good thing. I like his voice, you don't, so who's right? We both are.

 

[Pellaz]

I believe those stories to be true. I am 100% at ease knowing he is now sober.

And if you're 100% at ease and know he's sober, I'm totally convinced. It will rule.

 

[TheWhisper]

There are quite a few apocryphal stories about Warrell's drinking and his voice being 'off' at shows. I don't know if there's that much truth or correlation to them, but if there is....Glenn, hide the liquor backstage!

Dude, seriously, I hate when I have to open another window just to look up the meaning of a word...dumb it down a little.

 

[metamorphosis]

You know something's wrong when a headliner has to be "defended" and people need to be convinced not to leave when they come on. lol

Maybe next year we can get Morbid Angel (they are technical after all), In Flames and....EVERGREY!

 

[lady_space]

You know something's wrong when a headliner has to be "defended" and people need to be convinced not to leave when they come on. lol

Then I guess something's been wrong with virtually every one... there's always someone who's not going to like a headliner and say "WTF?"... and honestly, I don't think anyone's really trying to convince people not to miss NM's set for NM's sake as much as the convincee's sakes... some of us genuinely think they will be missing out on a totally killer show.

Maybe next year we can get Morbid Angel (they are technical after all), In Flames and....EVERGREY!

And maybe you can just shoot me first instead. It'd be more fun for me that way, especially since Evergrey almost 100% definitely WON'T be there.

Shaye