IN FLAMES new album being released by the end of 2016

[DE4life]

All it means is that you don't like a segment of the PM genre though. It's a sizable segment but not as big as most people think. There are tons of PM bands out there with totally different vocals, but as soon as certain people see it labelled "power metal" they instantly call it shit and make fun of the vocals, without having even listened to it, because they've trained their narrow minds to believe all PM sounds like fucking Dragonforce.

Salty.

 

[eochaid]

I thought that they were all forks from helloween

Sorry but almost them all sound the same to me. Maybe there are bands in which the singer has a very distinctively voice and it's not important to reach a high tone, but I'm still to find that band.

 

[DE4life]

Go and listen to Jorn Lande or Piet Sielck and compare to Fabio Lione or Chris Bay. If they sound the same to you it just means your ears aren't working properly

 

[eochaid]

Even if they do not have the same voices to me their style is the same. They all heard Dio, Rob Halford or Michael Kiske and they all try to sound like any of those singers.

 

[DE4life]

People who dislike extreme metal say the same about screaming, though. They'd say Anders and Mikael sound the same even though we know they don't. It's just giving in to preconceptions.

 

[DE4life]

Ps. Here's an example of a PM band with vocals all in low register. Doesn't sound like Halford, Dio or Kiske.

 

[eochaid]

People who dislike extreme metal say the same about screaming, though. They'd say Anders and Mikael sound the same even though we know they don't. It's just giving in to preconceptions.

Even if they were to have the same growl, if their styles are different then they're not the same.

But yes, there are a lot of vocalists in extreme metal doing the same thing once and once again.

 

[eochaid]

Ps. Here's an example of a PM band with vocals all in low register. Doesn't sound like Halford, Dio or Kiske.

Agreed, he resembles more manowar...

No, just joking. I think that you understand my point. The main representatives of pm, they all sound almost the same, with different voices, but they follow the same patterns. It's like listening to modern melodeath bands. They just keep on repeating the same thing that others did before.

To me, all pm sounds like bands imitating what others did before.

 

[DE4life]

To me, all pm sounds like bands imitating what others did before.

I don't think you've listened to enough of the genre to make such a statement. As with any genre, if you dig beneath the surface you'll find plenty of bands experimenting and doing some really cool stuff. But if you never look beyond the most visible bands - Helloween, Gamma Ray, Rhapsody of Fire, etc, then of course you'll assume it all sounds the same. Even though I just showed an example of one band which has a totally different vocal style, and there are plenty more.

Another thing you've got to remember is that it's basically impossible at this point to reinvent the wheel as far as Power Metal goes. Once you start experimenting experimenting too far you're doing prog metal or maybe even straying into hard rock or just melodic metal. "Imitating what others did before" is a fucking broad spectrum when you consider how many PM bands there were in the 90s alone. Being original is tough, and will often sound like shit. There's a reason the better PM bands were successful, after all, so why wouldn't you follow that formula?

I understand if people don't like stereotypical PM vocals, it's fine. I get it. Sometimes they're too much for me, too. It's just annoying when I see stupid generalisations about ALL power metal as if there are no bands who tried or are trying anything different within that genre. It's just not true.

 

[DE4life]

Oh, and not aimed at you eochaid, but people who get erect over Anders' singing and then say they can't stand PM vocals is just mind-blowing to me. You like this dude who can't even hold a fucking note, but hate singers who actually have talent? Just...yeah. Okay.

 

[A88]

PM i general has:
- funny vocals
- boring one-dimensional drumming
- idiotic lyrics
- average guitarwork with too much emphasis on pointless soloing
- boring songwriting

Not saying every band is like this, but that is your average pm as I know it.

Yes, I like a band here and there, yes some vocalists sing in lower register, yes it's awesome Kiske can still pull off those high notes from late '80s, but it's just not my type of music.

Actually I think pm works the best in slow emotional songs. That way, drumming is boring by default, singer should sound gay, solos should be cheesy, and the band doesn't try to be evil and angry (ending up being funny).

 

[DE4life]

PM i general has:
- funny vocals

"Funny" can also be described as guys actually singing (or trying to sing) legit, though, rather than the usual grunting, screaming, growling or Anders that you get with most modern metal. Some of it sounds genuinely ridiculous, but most of it sounds fine. I would say there is a small portion of bands in the 'ridiculous' vocal bracket, and then a large chunk in the normal singing bracket, even if it's a little high pitched, it's still perfectly normal singing. I mean, it ain't Come Clarity or Delight and Angers, but it's okay.

- boring one-dimensional drumming

This criticism can be leveled at 95% of metal bands across all genres, and 95% of drumming across the musical world. I mean, how many bands do you know where people are like "well, the music is mostly average, but dat drumming bro". There are a few bands where the drumming is great, but I don't know of any band where the rest of the instruments are average but the drumming puts it over the top. Same with bass. Vocals and guitars are where most bands gain followers. Drumming is just a functional aspect of most bands, as long as it doesn't suck or sound like shit (eg. STYE) then it's fine.

- idiotic lyrics

Well, again, this is metal we're talking about. The genre isn't known for amazing lyrics as with any genre of metal and music in general, there are some PM bands with really good lyrics. There are a lot of PM bands with stupid lyrics. Same with melodeath, thrash, death, and so on. There aren't any PM bands with lyrics as bad as "I feel like shit, but at least I feel something" though.

- average guitarwork with too much emphasis on pointless soloing

As a critique of Dragonforce, yeah, sure, but this doesn't really apply to many other PM bands. Most are pretty light on the solos and guitar work tends to be nice and melodic. Much better than most metal genres.

- boring songwriting

If you mean formulaic then yeah, sure, but point me to a non-prog metal band that isn't formulaic and that doesn't suck. As long as the music is good then it doesn't necessary matter if the song structures are kept to a certain standard.

Actually I think pm works the best in slow emotional songs. That way, drumming is boring by default, singer should sound gay, solos should be cheesy, and the band doesn't try to be evil and angry (ending up being funny).

PM is best for fast, melodic, energetic songs. That's basically the point of the genre the ballads are OK but none of my favourite PM songs are ballads. There aren't many PM bands trying to be evil and angry, anyway, most of them aren't taking themselves very seriously. They're just having a good time and enjoying what they do. I know in large sections of the metal community such attitudes are frowned upon as it isn't trve, kvlt, etc, but hey... sometimes you've got to a smile and pretend the world isn't totally fucked up.

 

[DE4life]

As an aside:

- funny vocals
- boring one-dimensional drumming
- idiotic lyrics
- average guitarwork with too much emphasis on pointless soloing
- boring songwriting

This is basically a perfect description of Siren Charms

 

[eochaid]

As an aside:



This is basically a perfect description of Siren Charms

And battles

 

[krofius]

All it means is that you don't like a segment of the PM genre though. It's a sizable segment but not as big as most people think. There are tons of PM bands out there with totally different vocals, but as soon as certain people see it labelled "power metal" they instantly call it shit and make fun of the vocals, without having even listened to it, because they've trained their narrow minds to believe all PM sounds like fucking Dragonforce.

Salty.

Well I'm obviously talking about PM in general not PM with thrash influences or PM mixed with trance music. I would say it's mostly the speed and structure of the songs to that bothers me. High pitched singing and over the top fast shreddy solos. Many bands crossover with different genres and elements. I'm not talking about those bands I'm just talking about the definition of what PM is not ALL the different sounding bands tha are all counted under the same genre.

 

[DE4life]

I would say it's mostly the speed and structure of the songs to that bothers me. High pitched singing and over the top fast shreddy solos.

This isn't a general definition of PM, though, as you seem to think. It wipes out a significant portion of bands in the genre who don't do fast, shreddy solos (basically, majority of bands who aren't called Dragonforce), and great, established bands like Rage, Falconer, Sabaton, Iron Saviour, Altaria, Edge of Thorns, Symphony X and others who don't have high pitched vocals.

For what it's worth I can totally understand if people don't like vocals in stuff like Helloween, Edguy, Rhapsody of Fire, Freedom Call, Power Quest, etc. It's an acquired taste for sure. I'm a fan, but I get why people wouldn't be.

But there's so much more to the genre than just these bands with high pitched vox and solos. People are, imo, missing out on a lot of amazing bands and music just because they can't get past the stigma of it being labelled Power Metal. And that's sad.

 

[eochaid]

When listening to bands I don't care about labels. It's just about if their music makes me feel something. It's just that, when talking about pm bands, until now, it only happened with unisonic and a couple of helloween albums. I tried rage and other bands but I couldn't get into them.

But I agree in some things with other posts. There is a path to make pm, some common rules that almost everyone applies. Then there are bands that do it their own way as in any other style.

 

[DE4life]

Link between PM and Melodeath is pretty strong, though, which is why I find it funny so many melodeath fans consider themselves too "trve" to listen to PM. Not saying that's the case for anyone here, but I see it a lot elsewhere. I know Jesper has admitted being influenced by PM bands, especially Iron Maiden. He was drummer for a little while with HammerFall, and helped write a number of their songs afterwards.

Main difference between PM and old school IF melodeath style is production and vocals. Melodeath guitarwork is very similar to a lot of PM bands, as is overall song structures. They aren't so far apart. Obviously when I say Melodeath I mean 1996-2000 era In Flames style, not stuff like R2R and STYE, which I don't even class as MDM to begin with.

 

[eochaid]

I almost agree but... Iron Maiden pm?

 

[DE4life]

I almost agree but... Iron Maiden pm?

Maiden are a strange one in that most people don't consider them PM - but a lot of their songs have all the hallmarks of the PM genre. At the very least they're a big influence, a heavier prototype of what would become popular in that genre. Vocals (especially with Bruce), guitar melodies/solos and lyrics on a lot of songs are all very much at home in the PM genre.

I'd classify Maiden ultimately as heavy/traditional metal, but they had a big hand in influencing & creating a lot of early PM bands like Helloween, Gamma Ray, etc.