IN FLAMES new album being released by the end of 2016

[DE4life]

Sometimes Anders' cleans hit the mark. Leeches, Crawl Through Knives, he did well on most of SOAPF.

His failures come when he does songs where even ProTools can't save him. Songs like Come Clarity (I like the instrumental, but sorry, vocals aren't good), TCP, Through Oblivion...

Also, it's really obvious when he's not making a full effort. ASOP and SC are both good examples of that, where it sounds like he's either tired or doesn't really give a shit. In the case of ASOP it drags the entire album down, and in SC's case just makes a bad album even worse.

If Anders used his cleans in moderation and stuck to things he can do (with ProTools help) then it would be fine. It's when he goes overboard that things turn sour.

 

[Jester Slave]

Then they have extremely bad taste in music, or they may be deaf. Conundrum solved.

Seeing as you seem to be sticking up for TCP - objectively explain to me why it's a good song. I'll even allow an unlimited post length and promise to read all of it, as long as it sticks on topic.

I don't understand why taste in anything should be explainable? A girl walks down the road, we both see her. I rate her 9/10 you rate her 4/10. Is there an answer there?

Sure, there are basic guidelines. Said girl should have proper hygiene, and said song should not be out of tune, etc., but other than that, there is not much to say. I can sing odes about how the way her face is structured is just a piece of art, when all you see is just random ass ugly face.

First and foremost, the length should be negligible. Does it matter if Bottled is 1, 3 or 8 minutes long? In live, sure, but you would just skip it either way. Also, TCP has a good reason to be that long as it is meant to be a drawn out ballad. Ever watched Tarantino's Inglorieous Basterds? If not, watch the bar scene. Drawing out stuff is a tool of art. It doesn't necessarily make anything better by itself, just don't say things like why is it so long.

It has a beginning, a middle and an end, you don't see repetition because there's always something new. You gave shit for SC's scheme of making songs, but it's not like IF did rocket-science before that with making songs. Aside from TCP, Jester's Door and Your Bedtime Story, they hardly left their comfort zone. Even if you don't like any of these songs, you should at least be happy that they dare to experiment with strong structures even if just rarely.

The songs on the record are supposedly about trying and/or struggling to find a sense of purpose. TCP fits right in, tells its story and I don't know about you, but to me it's very stimulating in a creative way. I don't think any minute of it is meaningless. Sure, saying every single second is a work of art would be stupid, but I am not claiming it to be the Mona Lisa of music, just saying it's good.

Anders voice is fine on this track. Some lines on Sober And Irrelevant or Sleepless Again are unbearable, I give you that but the worst on TCP are his crying yells. "Yaaaaaaaaaaaaarghhhhhhhhhhh"

The lyrics are not better or worse than your average ever since R2R and onwards.

It translated well even better live. You saw people yawning and going to the bathroom, but what I've seen were people getting really into it and enjoying the journey. I'm not saying any of us are lying, I'm saying you can't just outline decide it's shit live. I would not open with it either, but that's a different question.

 

[DE4life]

So, no, you can't tell me objectively why it's a good song. Just like everybody else. Thanks. And you still made that into an essay. Impressive.

 

[Jester Slave]

How is Anders relevant? He is not. He has never been recognized as a real singer by anyone. Jesper and Bjorn have been recognized as skilled and influential.musicians. when has that happened to anders? Who gives anything about him as a single singer? If you think that this is a skilled singer:



Then there is something wrong with you.

I tell you again, you seem to be too emotionally involved. Attacking the person instead of the argument is not a goof policy. Allow me to.explain with an example.

If you say that TT is the best song ever I can argue with you why is not or I can say that you're wrong because you're an arrogant cunt. Of course the first one is the right way to make an argument, the second just proves that I lack arguments.

Anders' voice is a trademark for In Flames and you do not know how much influence he did or did not have in the (d)evolution if In Flames. Once again, you are saying the guy is and was not important for In Flames and your only argument is that he is not a good singer.

So, no, you can't tell me objectively why it's a good song. Just like everybody else. Thanks. And you still made that into an essay. Impressive.

Lmao. How the fuck do you even make a song objectively good? Everything you said about TCP was subjective.

Mozart, Beatles, Pink Floyd, Ramones, Dr.Dre, Michael Jackson are considered objectively good.

Come on, tell me why you think any song is objectively good? You like the lyrics? Sorry, that's subjective, I don't. You like the guitar solo? I like the other one better, it's even harder. Harder is objective, but is harder being objectively better objective? No, it's subjective. You like the vocals? Subjective, I say he could have gone harder/softer. Etc.

There is no such thing as rating art objectively. I was about to say there are at least some rules, but there aren't. Entire genres were born by some rebellious acts breaking the so called barrier which was considered objectively good. Turned out it was only subjectively good.

Saying SC being bad because the songs follow the same structure for example is an argument, though it should not hold up when rating individual songs. Anyway, you not liking TCP because *drumroll* you don't like TCP is not an objective way of proving the song is bad, lol.

 

[DE4life]

Of course you can be objective about music. You just don't want to be because it suits you to be subjective.

Here's an objective point - Anders' singing in TCP is bad. That's not me saying so as an opinion, but based on how good singing is generally appreciated, the way Anders sings/wails in that song is pretty bad.

Now, subjectively, some people might enjoy it despite it being bad. OK. That doesn't make it good singing, though. It just means there are people who enjoy bad singing.

http://www.themaneater.com/stories/2014/2/24/objectivity-vs-subjectivity-music/

Here's an article that explains it a little better.

 

[eochaid]

Anders' voice is a trademark for In Flames and you do not know how much influence he did or did not have in the (d)evolution if In Flames. Once again, you are saying the guy is and was not important for In Flames and your only argument is that he is not a good sinher.

I never said anything about his influence in the band, i just talked about his influence as a singer, and he has no influence at all.

And of course that he is not a good singer. Anyone saying the opposite simply doesn't want to see the truth. I understand that you have some strong feelings regarding his voice or his influence into the band, but you should not be blinded by it. Anyone can see how his singing and his melodies have been strongly influenced by the producers that he worked with. The change between clayman and r2r is not casual and it's not because he suddenly improved his voice, it's just production work.

 

[eochaid]

Of course you can be objective about music. You just don't want to be because it suits you to be subjective.

Here's an objective point - Anders' singing in TCP is bad. That's not me saying so as an opinion, but based on how good singing is generally appreciated, the way Anders sings/wails in that song is pretty bad.

Now, subjectively, some people might enjoy it despite it being bad. OK. That doesn't make it good singing, though. It just means there are people who enjoy bad singing.

http://www.themaneater.com/stories/2014/2/24/objectivity-vs-subjectivity-music/

Here's an article that explains it a little better.

Singing quality cannot be measured by what we hear on an album. Repeating the takes once and once again until they're OK is not real singing. A singer should be valued by his real.skills, and his real skills.can only be proved live. The same if we talk about guitar players, bass players or drummers or any other kind of.musician.

 

[Jester313]

I like TCP. DE, I still don't think you've objectively proven it's a bad song. Maybe the vocals. Maybe you can prove that technically they are bad. I'm not a pro so I'm not going to say one way or another. I will say that they are "good" in the sense that they convey a certain emotion that is meant for the song. To me at least. And a lot of that emotion comes from the length of the song. i don't think that it is drawn out. I think the fact that it is so long adds to the emotional level of the song. I like that they actually let a song breathe instead of being done with it in 3 minutes. I'm not saying it's a masterpiece or anything, it's definitely not Lay of the Autumn by Insomnium, but I enjoy it and I think it works.

 

[DE4life]

Put it this way, how many non-IF fans do you think would like TCP? For me it's a very Cult of In Flames type song, where fans of the band basically hypnotise themselves into liking it, just because it's In Flames. I've got no time for that.

 

[only4theweak187]

Damns, insufferable cunts on facebook being insufferable cunts. More news at 11.

See, only4theweak quoting two fucking facebook posts from The Truth video which means nothing, and you standing by this moron (Jesper) is what I mean when I am talking about you guys going overboard. Just ridiculous

Even a guy who plainly said he liked Siren Charms but said The Truth sucks getting 50+ likes is an "insufferable cunt? What about the haters who just write "in flames are dead" or something? What do you call them? And what about it being a top comment and the tons of other people saying it sucks? Are they all wrong assholes?

Oh yeah, anyone who doesn't like something is an asshole, and only comments where people say they like it should be allowed hahaha waaaat.

It didn't have to mean "anything" stupid, it was someone's opinion to share on a discussion board.

More proof that you just can't stand seeing people disagreeing with what YOU like. Instead of just understanding people are free to express what they want. Getting so bothered by that simple fact is childish.

I'd say 1000 words of way too much energy invested into every single thing you write here is overboard but that's just my opinion : )

 

[Jester313]

Put it this way, how many non-IF fans do you think would like TCP? For me it's a very Cult of In Flames type song, where fans of the band basically hypnotise themselves into liking it, just because it's In Flames. I've got no time for that.

That very well might be the case. But you can pretty much say that about any artist/write/director. There's always going to be cult fans that trick themselves into liking something.

 

[Jester313]

There's so much useless bickering on here.

 

[Cobra8472]

Even in the TJR-Clayman era, there was Bjorn also, so saying IF was carried by Jesper is just retarded. Jesper had the vision for this band and he was undeniably talented, that's all. It was far from a one man band. And from R2R onwards Anders stepped up big time; it made some people abandon the band, but on the other hand, it attracted more, newer blood to the band - for better or worse, everyone can decide themselves.

You're full of crap.

Björn was pretty much completely uninvolved in the guitar songwriting process until Colony, and probably not properly so until Clayman/R2R. ALL of Whoracle was written by Jesper, and TJR was Jesper and some Glenn.

Fun fact: Jesper had writers block when writing Whoracle, and then had a flood of inspiration and wrote most of the album in the span of a week.

You can tell who wrote what song, usually, by their differing styles.
Björn really likes the chugs.

 

[only4theweak187]

There's so much useless bickering on here.

Thank Slave for that. No ones opinion is allowed if it disagrees with something he likes, you're gonna be told all about why you're wrong.

Literally every other person here can even have a really good debate with others and still remain cool.

Slave's narcissism is what throws a monkey wrench into the entire forum. Everyone else can stay cool about any topic like adults.

He just can't let little things go that don't matter and absolutely can't stand to see someone dislike something he enjoys.

2 things:

-Everyone here understands people have different views and tastes.

- Everyone here understands free speech.

Slave doesn't.

 

[DE4life]

That very well might be the case. But you can pretty much say that about any artist/write/director. There's always going to be cult fans that trick themselves into liking something.

I get that, but for me, TCP is in a different category. It's the only song from the IF discography where I would say it is both objectively and subjectively bad for me. I dislike both Through Oblivion and The Truth, but I wouldn't call them objectively bad songs. I just subjectively dislike them. TCP as a piece of music is just hugely flawed.

Going back to subjectivity though, Slave mentioned song length earlier, and pretty much misinterpreted what I meant. I wasn't saying the length of the song was the reason it sucks. I really like both Destiny by Stratovarius and The Piper Never Dies by Edguy, and these songs are both 10 minutes long. I enjoy The Seven Angels by Avantasia and that's 14 minutes long. I have no issue with a longer song if it's done right.

For me, TCP is artificially inflated to be a lengthily song. I don't think it is naturally long. The intro could easily be cut down by at least 2 minutes. The length of the song mostly comes from uninteresting riffs/vocals being repeated over and over with no necessary structural basis. The only part of TCP I am OK with is the ending, but I'm not sitting through 7 minutes of crap for the payoff in the final minute. It just isn't worth it.

When TCP is in the set, it basically acts as an 8 minute breather for the band. I can't help but think this was part of the reason it goes on for so long.

 

[DE4life]

You're full of crap.

Björn was pretty much completely uninvolved in the guitar songwriting process until Colony, and probably not properly so until Clayman/R2R. ALL of Whoracle was written by Jesper, and TJR was Jesper and some Glenn.

Fun fact: Jesper had writers block when writing Whoracle, and then had a flood of inspiration and wrote most of the album in the span of a week.

You can tell who wrote what song, usually, by their differing styles.
Björn really likes the chugs.

Bjorn's style seems mostly rooted in 70's rock, maybe some 80's too. Anders is a huge fan of pop music from the 80's. With those two as the main songwriting influences these days, it's no wonder we get albums like SC. If Anders could sing it wouldn't be so bad, the fact he can't makes things very hit and miss. If both are inspired enough you can get a decent album like SOAPF (imo anyway), but they aren't you get albums like SC. I have no idea what Battles will sound like but I'm expecting closer to SC than SOAPF.

 

[Jester313]

I get that, but for me, TCP is in a different category. It's the only song from the IF discography where I would say it is both objectively and subjectively bad for me. I dislike both Through Oblivion and The Truth, but I wouldn't call them objectively bad songs. I just subjectively dislike them. TCP as a piece of music is just hugely flawed.

Going back to subjectivity though, Slave mentioned song length earlier, and pretty much misinterpreted what I meant. I wasn't saying the length of the song was the reason it sucks. I really like both Destiny by Stratovarius and The Piper Never Dies by Edguy, and these songs are both 10 minutes long. I enjoy The Seven Angels by Avantasia and that's 14 minutes long. I have no issue with a longer song if it's done right.

For me, TCP is artificially inflated to be a lengthily song. I don't think it is naturally long. The intro could easily be cut down by at least 2 minutes. The length of the song mostly comes from uninteresting riffs/vocals being repeated over and over with no necessary structural basis. The only part of TCP I am OK with is the ending, but I'm not sitting through 7 minutes of crap for the payoff in the final minute. It just isn't worth it.

When TCP is in the set, it basically acts as an 8 minute breather for the band. I can't help but think this was part of the reason it goes on for so long.

Respect.

 

[eochaid]

If both are inspired enough you can get a decent album like SOAPF (imo anyway), but they aren't you get albums like SC. I have no idea what Battles will sound like but I'm expecting closer to SC than SOAPF.

If we talk about Bjorn's work, SC and the two new songs are mainly variations or repetitions of riffs and structures that they have done before.

 

[AtotheK]

 

[HonChuck]

Hm so new video is gonna be dropped the 19th with skydiving. I'll check it out.