Mikaels interview kind of inspiret me to ask. Who's christian?

[Reelo]

Of course, Hajji is the pilgrim that visited Mecca and Haci is the Turkish phonetic of it

I worked in Saudi-Arabia for 2 years in 2006, but unfortunately, being a non-muslim, I wasn't allowed to visit Mekka.
But my wife is muslim, and while I'm still reluctant to embrace religion (any religion really) I'd say if I did, I'd be one. I find Islam to be a lot more logical and "streamlined" than Christianity...

 

[hexwind]

I worked in Saudi-Arabia for 2 years in 2006, but unfortunately, being a non-muslim, I wasn't allowed to visit Mekka.
But my wife is muslim, and while I'm still reluctant to embrace religion (any religion really) I'd say if I did, I'd be one. I find Islam to be a lot more logical and "streamlined" than Christianity...

I know it's not my business bro, but I wonder how your wife married a non-muslim , it's forbidden as far as I know isn't it? oh well, you love each other ! so it's okay

 

[Reelo]

I know it's not my business bro, but I wonder how your wife married a non-muslim , it's forbidden as far as I know isn't it? oh well, you love each other ! so it's okay

According to religious principles, it is, yes. But it's not that uncommon in France, for example. Considering the fact that my wife hadn't had contact with her father (who is a tyrannical patriarch, as far as I can tell) even 5 years before we got married, her parents just don't know about us. Sad, but true. Her brothers on the other hand, know and like me, and didn't object to our marriage.

Besides, being born christian, I am considered "Ahl al-kitab" and that still makes me better than a pagan who worships many gods... There are some muslim scholars who argue that Christians and Jews, being monotheistic, are different from "those who associate others with God"...

 

[SeViMeTaL]

the holy books are too outdated to be honest, they make people conservative! We can't follow rules created thousands of years ago. For example, just a few weeks ago they made it legal to sexually abuse women in Afghanistan, which they based on religious believes (that's what CNN told me, seems fucked up though, as I studied media criticism, so I can't state wether it's true or not).
We need a new Holy book people! starts writing! let's make it illegal to show your upper lip, so everyone have to hide it.... by wearing a mustache!

i'm a muslim and i believe the holy books just advise you about being a better person.And of course you don't have to follow all the rules.that's all about how you think and behave.if you use your mind,you can always find the true way.they might have been created thousands of years ago but all the people and the world is same but the events.//religions are special for people.everyone can believe what they want and nobody can't interfere it.What religion we choose,we're all people so it's okay

 

[Nasty-Fire]

@NASTY-FIRE :
I can't personally identify "Soul", but about Fate, if i understand well its meaning in English, it's the script of your life, just like a movie scenario and everything is related to each other which makes everyone one's script networked and i would call this "Life", not the time span i spend alive tho. I would like to know what you think about it Nasty Fire.

Here's what I recently thought about it. If "fate" is, overally, all your life like if it was written on a piece of paper, then why is the word used? The word itself, in our world (it may work in stories), has absolutely no meaning. You can pretend that all your life is predicted at your birth, but what happens happens, and in the end it doesn't change anything if it was fate or not. Can anyone make it brighter for me to understand the concept, because I actually find it so stupid and filled with non-sense that I cannot conceive that I'm using the right definition.

If someone say "it was my fate to become successful", what does it mean? Right now, I see it has "I was meant to become successful", but does anyone believe this?

 

[Reelo]

If someone say "it was my fate to become successful", what does it mean? Right now, I see it has "I was meant to become successful", but does anyone believe this?

The real question is, if such were your fate, and you'd think "Hey, it's my fate to become successful, I don't have to do anything." And then, as a consequence of being a lazy bastard you DON'T become famous, did you alter your fate, or didn't you, and it was your fate to NOT become successful after all, you just thought wrong about it...?

 

[i aint play this]

I remember how I used to walk up and down the streets of the city of New Orleans.
Bound by drugs, bound by alcohol, commiting the different acts of sin, living beneath my privelage,
doing things that were contrary to God as well as the law.
But after all the things that I did and after all the sins that I commited, one day I heard about Jesus.

 

[{-sapob-}]

If there were less christians, I would be a christian.

 

[Ninfix]

If there were less christians, I would be a christian.

Do you mean that there are many christians? If that's the case, I doubt we have the same oppinion on what makes a real christian. That's got nothing to do with the religion crap people talks about today...

 

[{-sapob-}]

Do you mean that there are many christians? If that's the case, I doubt we have the same oppinion on what makes a real christian. That's got nothing to do with the religion crap people talks about today...

No and yes,
What I really meant was,
christians make christianity look bad.

 

[Nasty-Fire]

The real question is, if such were your fate, and you'd think "Hey, it's my fate to become successful, I don't have to do anything." And then, as a consequence of being a lazy bastard you DON'T become famous, did you alter your fate, or didn't you, and it was your fate to NOT become successful after all, you just thought wrong about it...?

Well actually, people believe fate only when something good happen to them; I guess it's a way to feel special, but it's ridiculous in the end. You only know your fate at the moment it happens; therefore, fate doesn't really exist; it's a most-likely biased and subjective anticipation of the future (future is predictable).

 

[spocks_brow]

I grew up in a non-religious household. In my baby book under religion, my mom wrote "We don't want you to believe in something that we can't prove; we just want you to believe in the love we have for you". Sappy, but it makes me proud of the clear minds my parents had.

God has always been a touchy topic with me. I went through years of my life being a full blown atheist, shunning everyone who believed in religion. Over the years, I learned to accept people's beliefs, and was open to hear their interpretation of God. Everyone is the same, but with slightly different views that depend on the person ("smoking weed isn't a sin", "i'm only a kid"). Christianity annoys me, because you're guilt tripped from the start. You go into any church and you see Jesus hanging on the cross. All of a sudden you're respectful of it, and don't want to piss off the son of God, just incase. If you do something that's considered a sin, all you have to do is confess, and all is right. I think Christianity has a lot of positive sides, but nobody follows them. I always hear (good) preachers talking about how we should all love each other, yet the most religious families are the most dangerous. God is just a man-made word used for power (as shown through history). I will say that I'm almost positive there has never been a single human to experience the true nature of "God". No one knows who or what God is.
The breaking of my athiest shell happened after reading a bunch of NDEs. It's just the way that every story involves their body floating above them really caught my attention. Although it could obviously all be made up, there's way too many sources that deal with a white light that only can be described as "Love" to be passed on.
I don't have a firm belief on God, but I do believe that something could have put us here, and there's always something waiting for us on the other side. It's just something you can't understand until you experience it. Even the most messed up religions involve a heaven that relates to "eternal happiness". If there's a judging system on acceptance to heaven, I'm assuming that you will only get "eternal happiness" if you give happiness to the world. I think if you're gay and you come up with a clean water system that helps saves thousands of starving children, you'll go to heaven. If you're the pope and rape little boys, you're going to hell. It doesn't matter who you are, because we're all the same; it's what you do.

Enough of my rambling, I'll leave with the one quote I fully agree with:
"The meaning of life is to give life meaning"

 

[Lateralus14]

Where do you draw the line though? Is there anything at all in the bible christians agree with? If so how could a scientist agree with that if it can't be proven?

And the "god exists outside time and space" argument doesn't work.

Um isn't that obvious? You draw the line at the ones that were written as religious myths. Aka, Creation myth + Revelation + some very small instances. Plus, we don't necessarily disagree with those even; myths can still resemble truth. For example, many people believe that the 6 "days" of creation are actually symbolic for the multiple evolutionary periods. Bam. There you go. Religion and Science just agreed if you aren't so stupid that you take every fucking word of everything literally.

Also, at your comment "Christians claim there is a God; it's up to them to prove it" or whatever that was...well how about this: "Atheists claim there is no God; it's up to them to prove it." Please, go ahead, you do seem to have all the answers after all.

 

[mexicola]

Here's what I recently thought about it. If "fate" is, overally, all your life like if it was written on a piece of paper, then why is the word used? The word itself, in our world (it may work in stories), has absolutely no meaning. You can pretend that all your life is predicted at your birth, but what happens happens, and in the end it doesn't change anything if it was fate or not. Can anyone make it brighter for me to understand the concept, because I actually find it so stupid and filled with non-sense that I cannot conceive that I'm using the right definition.

If someone say "it was my fate to become successful", what does it mean? Right now, I see it has "I was meant to become successful", but does anyone believe this?

How can fate be? It's a far out concept that has no root in reality to me.
Everything that happens is a result of everything that goes on around us but it wasn't pre-determined. That's just silly.

 

[mexicola]

Um isn't that obvious? You draw the line at the ones that were written as religious myths. Aka, Creation myth + Revelation + some very small instances. Plus, we don't necessarily disagree with those even; myths can still resemble truth. For example, many people believe that the 6 "days" of creation are actually symbolic for the multiple evolutionary periods. Bam. There you go. Religion and Science just agreed if you aren't so stupid that you take every fucking word of everything literally.

Also, at your comment "Christians claim there is a God; it's up to them to prove it" or whatever that was...well how about this: "Atheists claim there is no God; it's up to them to prove it." Please, go ahead, you do seem to have all the answers after all.

I didn't say atheists can prove there is no god. But if you read my reasoning earlier in thread you understand my thinking.

Still, I claim there is no god just as many people could easily say that the Norse gods don't exist.

 

[Lateralus14]

You claiming there is no god = cool with me

You claiming that it is idiotic to claim there is a god = completely idiotic

There's too many posts to interpret so I honestly have no idea what I'm reading from you, so...ya whatever.

 

[mexicola]

You claiming there is no god = cool with me

You claiming that it is idiotic to claim there is a god = completely idiotic

There's too many posts to interpret so I honestly have no idea what I'm reading from you, so...ya whatever.

Whatever

 

[Nasty-Fire]

You claiming there is no god = cool with me

You claiming that it is idiotic to claim there is a god = completely idiotic

There's too many posts to interpret so I honestly have no idea what I'm reading from you, so...ya whatever.

Umm sorry but now you are contradicting yourself. If he is idiot for claiming that those who claims there is a God are idiots, then you are idiot for claiming him an idiot because he claimed the opposite and you claim that he is idiot for doing so. Summary : you are acting like him on the quoted statements.

It's idiot to claim that there is a God as well as the opposite, that's what I mean't.

@spocks_brow : For a certain part of your reply, I agreed. It's just the end that bothered me, since you pretend that there is a notion of "good" and "bad" that everyone can fully agree on and that those lead them to "Hell" or "Heaven". The other thing that bothered me, and I know it's a contreversial subject in Christianism (maybe it's why you mentionned it) is that you talked about gays like if it was a negative point on the balance. For the rest, it's just about humans utopia, and it has been this way through all the History. We dream of eternal happiness, but it's only because it's what most of us seek, and if you think that your simple death can bring it to you, I think you must believe in Santa Claus. Yes, it's hard to imagine the afterlife, even unconceivable. But actually, were all part of the nature, and we will all forever exist since nothing disappear. The only thing that fucks up everything is that little spark of life, the single dot in space that proves that "you are yourself and no one else" and is the actual source of universe for each of us. It leads us to believe that it will go somewhere, but just imagine that our actual existence just doesn't exist, and try to consider death as the equivalence of life. When you will die, no matter if there's an afterlife or not, you will never know about it, and life will keep going. But it's all about probabilities; you could, at any time, just wake up and life was all a "dream". Consciousness is a paradox, it gives the feeling to everyone that they are something, but facts are that everything in the world, and even the most unconscious things, are like this. They react to what the world does to them at diverse degrees. I personally like to see death as a continuation of life in a diverse form. Being alive is not more important than being dead, after all. Sort of reconcilliation with the universe, with the world; everything is energy (Einstein and the relativity). The complexity of the world cannot be solved, but I think it can be comprehended, that you can understand that in the end, there's nothing to understand, which is again paradoxal.

Anyway, enough thoughts! It's damn late here and I guess it's why I'm saying so many philosophical stuff. I'll leave it there for now.

 

[Deathamphetamine1313]

Christian Opeth fan right here!

 

[Vega Skater]

I'm a devout Catholic.

I hear people telling me quite often that the beliefs are outdated. I'd like to know what is so different about the human condition now to thousands of years ago.

There is simply a lot more temptation to sin in the modern world. As a result, people would rather give in to the temptation and add an 'outdated' label to make themselves feel better rather than have some self-control.