Moderating

[Alongside Death]

You need some help in moding this place?

 

[Killbot]

if by chaotic you mean awesome, then yes

 

[Unfaithfully Metalhead]

This is the biggest arse licking thread of all time.

 

[Unfaithfully Metalhead]

I really don't think I'm as much of an asshole and elitist as certain people peg me as, like Unfaithfully_Metalhead and Faith No More. I never explicitly assert that my opinion is right. I just argue strongly for my point of view. I use strong and persuasive language. That's not overtly proclaiming "I am right, and anyone who disagrees is wrong and stupid." The fact that I tend to only address issues about which I know a fair amount also has a lot to do with this. For example, if I were to enter into a debate about the proper care and maintenance of a horse stable, I would look like Blue Jay in a spelling bee. So in order to avoid this, the only times that I assert my viewpoint are either when I feel very strongly about my opinion on something or I know that something else that somebody said is demonstratively incorrect...or I find something to be so astoundingly stupid that I feel it deserves to be addressed.

I say this because it annoys me. I've never looked at myself as even remotely elitist (in the generally accepted sense in terms of this board), and have generally condemned those who have exhibited tendencies of elitism, so when I get the term flung at me, it's a bit startling, because I don't think it accurately depicts me at all, and most likely stems from some misunderstanding. I can definitely be an asshole at times, but it's usually meant in good nature. My main priorities here are to discover new music and to help others do the same.

You not thinking that your elitist and/or a asshole is very much your own opinion. Others may agree with you and yet others will not say because it's not the status quo. You definetly assert that your opinions are always right and others see that other then myself. It shows when you say this person or that person is "wrong" during your debates with that person and I don't mean with just me. To me elitism accurately describes you whether you see it or not and whether others admit it or not due to them perhaps not wanting to be ridiculed by calling you that. But this is how I see you:

elitism (n.) The belief that certain persons or members of certain classes or groups deserve favored treatment by virtue of their perceived superiority,as in intellect, social status, or financial resources.

Anyways as for your assholeness. We'll you were not like that 3 years ago and most here now will not know how you posted back then. Back then you were very helpful and never attacked or put people down because differences in opinion.It's only when you started college and your intellect became more profound that you started to bring the assholeness out. The way you act in GMD forum you do not do in OS forum and it shows (good example is your most recent post to me in OS that was respectful and kind when posting even though you didn't name bands like you used to lol). Perhaps because of the age differences in the two forums. The posts in OS are much more mature in that there are no flaming, trolls, sides over other sides etc. Anyways being a asshole is never in good nature. For your amusement perhaps but don't expect the person you direct it to, to see it as "good natured". Wish these people have seen you back 3 years ago when you were this:

My main priorities here are to discover new music and to help others do the same.

And not the Doden (hell, i wonder if they know why we call you Doden) of today who sees himself superior to everyone in music knowledge and knowledge in general who feels the need to prove it to others on this board & not respect what others' own opinions are on a topic whether right or wrong. Do not have to agree with them but can respect that others do not have to agree with you as well without being a asshole.

Much like you I am here to learn about new music and help others learn about other bands they have not heard without having to get into a flaming war over differences of opinions.

 

[skeptik]

I don't understand why you felt the urge to respond to that post.

I don't care what you perceive me as. The only person who has said as of now that they perceive me as 'elitist' is you. Everybody else that responded to that same post has said the opposite, rather that their initial perception of me was that I was elitist, but as they learned more about me they saw otherwise. Maybe you just don't know me as well as you think that you do.

As far as calling people "wrong" in debates, I call people "wrong" when they are "wrong." Making factually incorrect statements exemplifies something that is wrong, and when somebody says something that is factually incorrect, I tell them that they're factually incorrect, and at times as debates wear on and it becomes increasingly more apparent that my partner in debate is not as well educated in the topic at hand as I am, I lose my composure and let loose a derogatory statement. Everybody is a victim of this. I DO NOT tell people that their opinions are wrong. I defy you to find an example of this that is no obviously in jest. I'm about as respectful of others' opinions here as everyone else. However, the dynamic of the board itself lends one to be less than completely formal and respectful, so faulting one for a possible slip in their perpetual respectful nature is not exactly very groundbreaking.

 

[Unfaithfully Metalhead]

I don't understand why you felt the urge to respond to that post.

We'll you posted it in a public forum and since you had the urge to mention my name on it I had the urge to respond to it. That is my right you know. And since I never really called you elitist in this public forum before but you had the urge to say I think of you that way, well I thought best that I acknowledge that I do even though you never seen me say it to post about it in the first place.

I don't care what you perceive me as. The only person who has said as of now that they perceive me as 'elitist' is you.

You don't care how I perceive you yet you mention my name and that it annoys and bothers you that "others" perceive you as such. And since you mentioned mine and Faith's name I would have to say you perceive us two as leading the pack that annoys and bothers you because we think of you as a elitist. So I would say you do care then, if you didn't you would not have posted that post in the first place. To me it came out of the blue when you did.

Everybody else that responded to that same post has said the opposite, rather that their initial perception of me was that I was elitist, but as they learned more about me they saw otherwise. Maybe you just don't know me as well as you think that you do.

I seen the Doden of three years ago and the Doden of today in this public forum. Most of these people haven't so I have a different unique perception of two sides of you that they don't. Some do though who have been around that long but not many anymore since old time regs from those days moved on and very few remain.

As far as calling people "wrong" in debates, I call people "wrong" when they are "wrong." Making factually incorrect statements exemplifies something that is wrong, and when somebody says something that is factually incorrect, I tell them that they're factually incorrect,

The problem with that is you take everything you read in your books to be "fact" and not biased or inaccurate at all. I used to think like that myself till people from other countries opened my eyes to how biased & not always 100% accurate the media, books etc. are in this world. Of course I know you will disagree but that is the nature of the beast so to speak. People do not always see eye to eye.

and at times as debates wear on and it becomes increasingly more apparent that my partner in debate is not as well educated in the topic at hand as I am,

This is where your perceived superiority in your intellect comes to play that makes you out to be a elitist. Again imo don't always take what you read in your "books" as carved in stone when it comes to history, politics, philosophy etc. Read your books and gain world experience with travels to see of yourself to make a final judgement on such topics before you call your self well educated in such subject matters and others aren't.

I lose my composure and let loose a derogatory statement. Everybody is a victim of this.

Then you have no self control. I've never recalled myself doing that to you beforehand. I do lose it but only after it's been done to me. But for the most part I try not to.

I DO NOT tell people that their opinions are wrong. I defy you to find an example of this that is no obviously in jest. I'm about as respectful of others' opinions here as everyone else.

You have and for me to prove it would be fruitless because you would never admit it and it would take a long long time to find such a example considering how many posts you have altogether & frankly i have better things to do then prove such a silly matter. I merely wanted to address your post since you had to name me in it.

However, the dynamic of the board itself lends one to be less than completely formal and respectful, so faulting one for a possible slip in their perpetual respectful nature is not exactly very groundbreaking.

I would say this Forum in particular and not the Board/Site itself. You have to admit such things do not happen in the OS forum. The average age over there is much older that they are past such High School BS. In 3 years I have never seen you be a asshole in that Forum nor throw your perceived intellect around there. Must be a reason. My guess is because you know people there don't really care about such things like they seem to here. Everyone there just enjoys the chat about music without attacking each other & respect each others opinions whether they are right or wrong because in the end this site does not make the world turn around and does not affect someones private life other then the music they listen to.

Btw did you reply to Lady Valerie when she called you on it? About being a asshole, your supposed humor, elitism etc? Last time I checked that thread you didn't... have not really checked since...

 

[Ender Rises]

That post was way too fucking long.

 

[Ender Rises]

You have and for me to prove it would be fruitless because you would never admit it and it would take a long long time to find such a example considering how many posts you have altogether & frankly i have better things to do then prove such a silly matter. I merely wanted to address your post since you had to name me in it.

Actually no he hasn't. When ideas are stupid he challenges them. When someone has their facts messed up he challenges them. He likes to argue. But he doesn't ever say that someone is out-and-out wrong.

 

[Unfaithfully Metalhead]

That post was way too fucking long.

Yeah I know it is. Just a habit of mine that I like to separate quotes and respond to them indiviually.

 

[Unfaithfully Metalhead]

Actually no he hasn't. When ideas are stupid he challenges them. When someone has their facts messed up he challenges them. He likes to argue. But he doesn't ever say that someone is out-and-out wrong.

I do the same in terms of challenging someone's opinion. What I don't agree with is that everyone must agree with his opinions or facts like they are carved in stone. But anyways I have seen him do it even if he doesn't really notice he does. But to find it is like going through a needle in a haystack considering he has 15,000 + posts. Not worth the time. This debate is already stupid as it is. Just wanted to acknowledget to him that I do think he is a elitist & a asshole alot more nowadays then three years ago though I never said it before. I just thought it was out of the blue for him to post that post and to mention my name and not expect me to respond. Kind of expected don't ya think? Just like he responds to my posts when I mention his name or quote him. <shrugs> but whatever. Drink a beer and stop taking life so serious much less this board/forum.

 

[Life Sucks]

Krigoloch
DnB
HAUA

 

[Unfaithfully Metalhead]

Life Sucks

 

[skeptik]

I can't believe I'm wasting even MORE time responding to you. You nauseate me with your blatant attempts to refute everything that I say regardless of subject, and the fact that you're either wrong or misunderstanding what I'm saying all the time doesn't help at all. Perceive this as 'elitist' if you want, but in reality it's just one person not wanting to have another person bothering him all of the damn time about every remotely significant thing he says. I do not think that I am 'better' or 'intellectually superior' to you, and whether or not I am or whether or not I perceive myself as such does not affect my outlook on you, which is what I consider 'elitist,' since merely perceiving that you're smarter than somebody is a basic observation in itself and not necessarily an evaluative judgment. The fact is that I'm just fed up with you because the arguments that you present to me are usually very weak arguments, blatant misunderstandings, or things that are so stupidly obvious (such as "that's your opinion and not the opinion of others") that it's not even worth saying and far less worth addressing.

We'll you posted it in a public forum and since you had the urge to mention my name on it I had the urge to respond to it. That is my right you know. And since I never really called you elitist in this public forum before but you had the urge to say I think of you that way, well I thought best that I acknowledge that I do even though you never seen me say it to post about it in the first place.

I don't even remember what I said in that post and I don't even know if I would stand by what I said there or whether it was inspired mostly by the circumstances of the moment.

You don't care how I perceive you yet you mention my name and that it annoys and bothers you that "others" perceive you as such. And since you mentioned mine and Faith's name I would have to say you perceive us two as leading the pack that annoys and bothers you because we think of you as a elitist. So I would say you do care then, if you didn't you would not have posted that post in the first place. To me it came out of the blue when you did.

You annoy me because your debate skills are lacking and most of your valid points are inane truisms that don't need to be said. Faith No More annoys me because his lifestyle and outlook in general are directly opposed to mine. This doesn't make me any more elitist than anyone else, because everyone finds other people annoying. Everybody has some degree of 'elitism' in that sense, but I'm referring to the more acute sense of one who belittles others in order to aggrandize one's own perceived worth based on their superiority. If this is what you think that I am, then you are sadly mistaken. This is not 'my opinion,' but rather a fact, because it involves intention, and my intention is not to belittle others for my own ego, despite what my message in itself may come off as when ignorant of the intentions behind it.

I seen the Doden of three years ago and the Doden of today in this public forum. Most of these people haven't so I have a different unique perception of two sides of you that they don't. Some do though who have been around that long but not many anymore since old time regs from those days moved on and very few remain.

When I came here, I was sixteen, ignorant of a good deal of Metal music and world affairs, and quite simply a 'noob.' I knew my place. It was not my position to speak out on topics and issues about which the veterans of the message board knew far better than I, and the few times that I did speak out I was pummeled and learned my lesson. Now, I am one of the oldest members of the board and evidently have one of the deepest understandings of the genre as a whole out of the overall populous of the board, and I've greatly indulged in philosophy and world affairs. I actually know things now and am qualified to speak out on things and speak my mind, whereas three and four years ago I was not. This perceived change is merely a natural progression of growing up, with a smidgen of nihilism and cynicism to go along with all of that.

The problem with that is you take everything you read in your books to be "fact" and not biased or inaccurate at all. I used to think like that myself till people from other countries opened my eyes to how biased & not always 100% accurate the media, books etc. are in this world. Of course I know you will disagree but that is the nature of the beast so to speak. People do not always see eye to eye.

THIS is why I'm sick to my stomach responding to you, because you consistently make blanket assumptions about me that spark me to retaliate against you. You constantly proclaim that I wield my opinion and my knowledge like some sort of impenetrable shield that allows me to say anything that I want and still have it be true when the reality is that you don't know a damn thing about my sources of information or about the way that I view said sources. The reality is that, no, I'm not stupid enough to assume at face value that what books and professors and bloggers and news anchors say is the truth, but with the amount of cross researching and confirmation available in the media, there are things which most likely appear to be the reality of the situation, such as my comments on the political climate in Saudi Arabia. If you had done the same research, you would have likely reached the same conclusion, instead of recalling things from menory.

You really need to stop saying "well that's just your opinion," "you take everything that you read in books as fact," and "you always insist that you're right," because not only are all three statements false, they're also highly annoying.

This is where your perceived superiority in your intellect comes to play that makes you out to be a elitist. Again imo don't always take what you read in your "books" as carved in stone when it comes to history, politics, philosophy etc. Read your books and gain world experience with travels to see of yourself to make a final judgement on such topics before you call your self well educated in such subject matters and others aren't.

It is not elitist to observe that you know more about something than somebody else. It is elitist to belittle somebody and deem them inferior for knowing less than you. Merely having more knowledge than somebody and knowing that you have more knowledge than somebody on a given subject is NOT elitist in any meaningful sense. For example, based upon our past conversations, it is clear that I know more about the political climate of Saudi Arabia than you. I do not think that I'm "superior" to you because of this, but simply that I am better informed to speak on issues involving the political climate of Saudi Arabia than you.

Then you have no self control. I've never recalled myself doing that to you beforehand. I do lose it but only after it's been done to me. But for the most part I try not to.

Sure you have. Merely saying that you haven't doesn't make it true. And saying "you have no self control" because I call somebody an idiot on a message board is highly indicative of extreme hyperbole to say the least.

You have and for me to prove it would be fruitless because you would never admit it and it would take a long long time to find such a example considering how many posts you have altogether & frankly i have better things to do then prove such a silly matter. I merely wanted to address your post since you had to name me in it.

Making claims and then providing no evidence for them is useless and a waste of time, so I ask you not to do it in the future.

I would say this Forum in particular and not the Board/Site itself. You have to admit such things do not happen in the OS forum. The average age over there is much older that they are past such High School BS. In 3 years I have never seen you be a asshole in that Forum nor throw your perceived intellect around there. Must be a reason. My guess is because you know people there don't really care about such things like they seem to here. Everyone there just enjoys the chat about music without attacking each other & respect each others opinions whether they are right or wrong because in the end this site does not make the world turn around and does not affect someones private life other then the music they listen to.

By "this forum" I meant the General Metal Discussion Forum, not Ultimate Metal as a collective.

As far as the Old School forum goes, it's a completely different atmosphere with almost no hostility whatsoever. It's nothing like this forum most of the time. I also very, very, very rarely ever even go into the Old School forum any more.

Btw did you reply to Lady Valerie when she called you on it? About being a asshole, your supposed humor, elitism etc? Last time I checked that thread you didn't... have not really checked since...

I don't know what you're talking about.

 

[Unfaithfully Metalhead]

I won't quote you because then this post will be super long like in past convo's with you. I will quote the post you "do not remember" saying. And like I said it came out of the blue. No one mentioned you were a asshole or elitist much less me when you said it:

"I really don't think I'm as much of an asshole and elitist as certain people peg me as, like Unfaithfully_Metalhead and Faith No More. I never explicitly assert that my opinion is right. I just argue strongly for my point of view. I use strong and persuasive language. That's not overtly proclaiming "I am right, and anyone who disagrees is wrong and stupid." The fact that I tend to only address issues about which I know a fair amount also has a lot to do with this. For example, if I were to enter into a debate about the proper care and maintenance of a horse stable, I would look like Blue Jay in a spelling bee. So in order to avoid this, the only times that I assert my viewpoint are either when I feel very strongly about my opinion on something or I know that something else that somebody said is demonstratively incorrect...or I find something to be so astoundingly stupid that I feel it deserves to be addressed.

I say this because it annoys me. I've never looked at myself as even remotely elitist (in the generally accepted sense in terms of this board), and have generally condemned those who have exhibited tendencies of elitism, so when I get the term flung at me, it's a bit startling, because I don't think it accurately depicts me at all, and most likely stems from some misunderstanding. I can definitely be an asshole at times, but it's usually meant in good nature. My main priorities here are to discover new music and to help others do the same."

Sure sounds like you whining and caring what me, Faith and others perceive you as. But anyways if you think you do not belittle people because you perceive them wrong on a topic (and I don't mean just with me) then you must be blind because it always ends up that way in the end with you in a convo. As for providing evidence, like I said I won't waste my time going through your thousands of posts to find a few examples. Anymore then you would go through my past posts. We both have better things to do with our lives and our lives do not hopefully revolve on each other or this site.

And really you are not one of the oldest. You barely got out of your teens while others are in their mid or late 20's and other yet in their 30's. As for cross researching and confirming in other media on topics, it can still be biased that way though I know that somewhere in the middle is the truth. But your like a kid in the dark ages who reads about exotic lands like China, Saudia Arabia etc. and think that is the reality. But I will let you up to it if you say you know better. Perhaps, just perhaps someday something you hold true in another country will turn out to be false if you ever travel and see things for yourself. Like I said perhaps. Does not mean you are not currently right or wrong about your ideas on SA or other countries. But go out in the world when you can in the future. I would like to see your thoughts when you see these faraway places up close. I myself lack in that as well with the exception of Costa Rica and Thailand. I wonder if we debated these two countries if you would say I'm wrong in any facts even though I been to both places enough times to know what I see in person then what is read in a book. But I do converse with people from other countries and get their point of view of what they see or know themselves.

As for OS forum. Yes I know you rarely go there unless it's a discussion on thrash. Would rather hear the Doden of old then the new one. Being 16 and naive then doesn't give you a excuse for being a asshole "sometimes" now. Lack or gaining knowledge and intellect should not be a deciding factor on whether you should be a asshole or not. It is usually the opposite actually. When your 16 is when you are a asshole and as you grow up you grow out of it and become "mature" though not all are like this. But you seem to have done the opposite. Mature at 16 and become more a asshole (not all the time but enough of the time) as you get older not making you mature in my eyes. Mature in intellect no doubt but not in other areas.

Anyways let this argument die because the bottom line is I see you as a elitist and sometimes asshole and you don't on both parts. If you do not want me to respond to your threads and ruffle your panties then I would have to ask that you not mention my name then because if you do then expect me to respond and not say : I do not know why you felt the urge to respond to that post. Especially since my posts nauseate you and you do not "care" what I say which really shows in your posts lol

Anyways as for Lady Valerie. Read post # 57 :

http://www.ultimatemetal.com/forum/general-metal-discussion/318392-what-fuck-3.html

 

[ohiogrinder]

I really hope Hubster does not become a moderator, otherwise, we can kiss free speech goodbye.

 

[Unfaithfully Metalhead]

I really hope Hubster does not become a moderator, otherwise, we can kiss free speech goodbye.

I haven't really paid attention to Hubster so I wouldn't know but I never had a problem with him that I can remember.

 

[skeptik]

"I really don't think I'm as much of an asshole and elitist as certain people peg me as, like Unfaithfully_Metalhead and Faith No More. I never explicitly assert that my opinion is right. I just argue strongly for my point of view. I use strong and persuasive language. That's not overtly proclaiming "I am right, and anyone who disagrees is wrong and stupid." The fact that I tend to only address issues about which I know a fair amount also has a lot to do with this. For example, if I were to enter into a debate about the proper care and maintenance of a horse stable, I would look like Blue Jay in a spelling bee. So in order to avoid this, the only times that I assert my viewpoint are either when I feel very strongly about my opinion on something or I know that something else that somebody said is demonstratively incorrect...or I find something to be so astoundingly stupid that I feel it deserves to be addressed.

I say this because it annoys me. I've never looked at myself as even remotely elitist (in the generally accepted sense in terms of this board), and have generally condemned those who have exhibited tendencies of elitism, so when I get the term flung at me, it's a bit startling, because I don't think it accurately depicts me at all, and most likely stems from some misunderstanding. I can definitely be an asshole at times, but it's usually meant in good nature. My main priorities here are to discover new music and to help others do the same."

I don't see anything wrong with what I've said here, or that really merits the response that you gave to it. I didn't even refer to you in a negative manner.

Sure sounds like you whining and caring what me, Faith and others perceive you as. But anyways if you think you do not belittle people because you perceive them wrong on a topic (and I don't mean just with me) then you must be blind because it always ends up that way in the end with you in a convo. As for providing evidence, like I said I won't waste my time going through your thousands of posts to find a few examples. Anymore then you would go through my past posts. We both have better things to do with our lives and our lives do not hopefully revolve on each other or this site.

"Whining," or expressing myself on something that I'd noticed in the posting habits of certain people in relation to me? You and a few others have stated that you see me expressing my opinions as me asserting what is definitive truth and what is not, and I was responding to that. Again, either find me an example of me unjustly 'belittling' somebody in the context of a debate based on the fact that I appear to feel superior to them or don't make empty accusations. You claim that I belittle people because I think that I am better than them and then you refuse to meet halfway by providing evidence to back up your claim, which is the fundamental element of debate. If you "have better things to do" than to support your argument, then don't waste my time by bringing up the argument at all, because it will inevitably lead to a dead end. I am fairly confident that I very rarely at worst unjustly belittle people in a vitriolic manner, and in the rare occasions that I do, I can assure that 1) it stemmed from me simply not liking that person in general, 2) me growing weary of the argument and the person arguing against me, most likely due to a weak argument, or 3) I simply lost my composure and regret unjustly insulting somebody in the heat of the moment, but merely doing this, something that damn near everyone is guilty of, is certainly no grounds for such an accusation as elitism.

And really you are not one of the oldest. You barely got out of your teens while others are in their mid or late 20's and other yet in their 30's. As for cross researching and confirming in other media on topics, it can still be biased that way though I know that somewhere in the middle is the truth. But your like a kid in the dark ages who reads about exotic lands like China, Saudia Arabia etc. and think that is the reality. But I will let you up to it if you say you know better. Perhaps, just perhaps someday something you hold true in another country will turn out to be false if you ever travel and see things for yourself. Like I said perhaps. Does not mean you are not currently right or wrong about your ideas on SA or other countries. But go out in the world when you can in the future. I would like to see your thoughts when you see these faraway places up close. I myself lack in that as well with the exception of Costa Rica and Thailand. I wonder if we debated these two countries if you would say I'm wrong in any facts even though I been to both places enough times to know what I see in person then what is read in a book. But I do converse with people from other countries and get their point of view of what they see or know themselves.

More unfounded claims about the extent and quality of my learnings. I don't know how many times I have to address this. I never claimed that I have all the answers or that the answers that I do have can't possibly be proven wrong or simply change given time, which is obviously often the case regarding the global political climate. As far as my resources go, I try as much as I can to pull resources from multiple points of view, from all angles and biases, and from that attempt to siphon out what seems to be the closest approximation of what is the objective truth of the matter. Of course if we debated something upon which you are clearly the superior exprert such as Cost Rica I would look like a fool, but then again I wouldn't enter into a debate about Costa Rica because I know very little about it.

You really don't understand me at all if you think that I would try to say that you are wrong on things about which I know very little. And I have a feeling that you genuinely believe that I would do this based upon your multiple previous statements regarding my opinion being stated as fact and "nobody can disagree with Dodens" and other things of that nature. All that I have to say to this is that you do not understand me nearly as well as you think that you do or I'm simply not reflected well through what I say to you if this is the conclusion you reach, because this is not what I mean to do at all. I think that you are confusing strong, confident, and persuasive language with bullish, narrowminded elitism. I apologize if I come off this way to you, but I think you're simply taking it the wrong way or reading too much into a perceived tone that may or may not have been intended.

As for OS forum. Yes I know you rarely go there unless it's a discussion on thrash. Would rather hear the Doden of old then the new one. Being 16 and naive then doesn't give you a excuse for being a asshole "sometimes" now. Lack or gaining knowledge and intellect should not be a deciding factor on whether you should be a asshole or not. It is usually the opposite actually. When your 16 is when you are a asshole and as you grow up you grow out of it and become "mature" though not all are like this. But you seem to have done the opposite. Mature at 16 and become more a asshole (not all the time but enough of the time) as you get older not making you mature in my eyes. Mature in intellect no doubt but not in other areas.

Don't you think it's absurd to attempt to conclude something like that based on a message board exchange? Message boards are the last place somebody should be looking to as a barometer of one's maturity.

Regardless, I'm sorry, but I'm just not the asshole that you think I am. I like arguing, and occasionally picking on people in good humor, but the label of asshole does not accurately depict me, except maybe to you since I quickly grow weary of our exchanges for reasons that I've pointed out enough times that it could be committed to memory. But please note that you are the exception, and not the rule. I will freely admit to being far more of an "asshole" in my responses to you than to others simply because I'm not very fond of you and your incessant and ill-conceived lines of argument, platitudes, truisms, and blatant misunderstandings.

Anyways as for Lady Valerie. Read post # 57 :

http://www.ultimatemetal.com/forum/general-metal-discussion/318392-what-fuck-3.html

[/quote]

I'll take a look.

If you want to continue this further, please take it to PMs.

 

[Ben_t]

Wow, just got a tendonitis from scrolling down this page.

 

[skeptik]

At least you didn't get carpal tunnel. I don't intend to respond again in this thread though because it's really just a waste of time, and I'm going to try to do better in avoiding meaningless arguments like this one in the future.

 

[Ender Rises]

There should be a character limit for posts. This shit is too fucking long.