The no digital camera rule.....

[Greykiller]

Thanks for the note. What do you think of the additional digital camera fee to pay for someone checking the cameras along with some metal detectors? Say $5 each day? A seperate line (slower) for the checking? The money would also go towards offical agents standing *inside* the venue specifcially to catch bootleggers (in addition to the regular spies).
Glenn H.

I would be willing to wait in that line and pay the extra 5 bucks. My camera can take 1 minute videos but will not do an entire show, and last year I took over 250 shots over three days. Thinking of trying to do that with film is mind boggling. So, if my choices are, haul a tiny camera, pay extra 5 bucks, or haul a huge SLR, get right in, and end up paying an extra 100-150 for film and processing...I will pay the money and wait a while.

 

[SwordLord]

Wow ... I'm a real johnny-come-lately to this thread ...


This is really disheartening news on a number of levels, first on the public posting by someone who is a treasured Prog-Power attendee, the resulting consequences and of course the ban itself.

As a fellow business-owner and concert promoter, I think I empathize with Glenn far more than the average concert-goer. Does that make me better than you? No. But I guess I have a tendency to see things differently because of my situation.

At my recent Halloween metal festival which I held in Minnesota, I had a guy fly in all the way from Italy to see PRONG. The individual approached me and asked if he could video record the show. After discussing it with Tommy Victor, I gave him clearance.

I know that I would have been SUPER MEGA PISSED OFF if I had discovered a video of my concert that I paid good money to put together, floating around on the net.

While I enjoy taking pictures too, the ban DISAPPOINTS me, but it will NOT stop me from attending the festival or from standing behind Glenn when he needs the support. Holy shit, this is a festival that we will never get anyone else to do. If I have to leave my camera in the hotel room or pay a little more to bring it in, fine. It seems a small price to pay for being able to be six feet from Stratovarius on their first ever US appearance.

What has happened with Bryant is really tragic. I think if this had been handled a little bit more diplomatically, this whole thing could have been avoided.

In regards to ALL negative postings -- whether they be against the festival, the festival policies, a poster on the forum or just another lame "Oh that band SUCKS" thread/post (which I'm so sick of BTW!!!), I think that a good deal of these should be happening OFF THE FORUM -- in either private mail, email or what have you. Airing dirty laundry in public doesn't really do anybody any good and all it does is create bad feelings where there shouldn't be any.

So there's my two cents for ya ...

Glenn, may the wind always be at your back!

Nathan "The SwordLord" Block

 

[dargormudshark]

That may be true for music fans in general. However, I've noticed among the Metal community just the opposite. They tend to download an album and if they like it, they buy the album

I know tons of metal fans who download and don't buy cds anymore. I also know metal fans who download, and only buy SOME of the cds they like.

I'm not arguing for or against MP3s... I'm just bringing some perspective, so that you don't think metal fans are all perfect angels.

this might seem cliche but, IF YOU DON'T BUT THE CD EVENTUALLY (I can't understand if you are low on money for a while) YOU ARE A POSEUR!!!!!

 

[dargormudshark]

I understand that there are honest guys like you would keep the video to themselves. So, if you feel strongly about your right to videotape, then your challenge is this:

How do you convince a band, label, or agent that you are an honest guy and won't sell your video of the concert, and how do you convince them that all of your friends that you trade with won't sell the video, either after the show or one, five, or ten years from now?

By looking into their soul with x-ray eyes. If they are aren't honest, you kill them...or send them to Ozzfest where they belong

 

[skeptik]

Don't forget that Glenn gets his money from selling tickets, not buying bands to play. He loses money when people get pissed off that they can't bring their cameras and decide not to go. Double-edged sword, eh? And what a bastard that sword is.[/pun]

 

[jaimek]

He loses money when people get pissed off that they can't bring their cameras and decide not to go.

Ha. Clearly you haven't noticed that the show typically sells out in 4-6 days... if five people don't go because they can't bring their digital cameras, then five others will go instead.

 

[skeptik]

It's just as likely as a well-paid band dropping off of a bill for something silly, thus it's just as valid as Glenn's little trifle.

 

[Tess]

Ha. Clearly you haven't noticed that the show typically sells out in 4-6 days... if five people don't go because they can't bring their digital cameras, then five others will go instead.

Amen, sister!

I know plenty of people who are dying to go to ProgPower but don't have the money before tickets sell out since it sells out so quickly. With a little more time they'd buy a ticket .....

I still don't understand why someone would not attend because they can't bring their digital camera. Don't you people go for the MUSIC?

 

[skeptik]

I still don't understand why someone would not attend because they can't bring their digital camera.

I still don't understand why someone would not play for money because they can't stop someone else from bringing their digital camera.

 

[Barking Pumpkin]

Probably because they're used to getting their way.

 

[Sumeet]

I still don't understand why someone would not play for money because they can't stop someone else from bringing their digital camera.

I can't understand it either. Of course, I'm not a musician, and perhaps if I was, it's possible that my perspective might differ. However, regardless of whether I understand it or you understand it, that's how it is... and Glenn has to deal with that reality. We can't ignore that fact just because it may not seem logical.

 

[BlindPanzer]

I'm up for the $5 thing. I usually end up taking lots of pictures during the show. I know Glenn's photographer will always take awesome pictures, but there is a sense of nostalgia going over your own pictures that you don't get by looking at Glenn's photographer's pictures.

 

[Ruthven]

I think you guys are starting to completely lose the point here. The notion of no digital cameras at ProgPower has nothing to do with legality or illegality. It doesn't even have anything to do with what Glenn thinks about bootlegging... he has to get bands for the show, and if they are concerned that they are going to be bootlegged, concerned enough that they would refuse to play the show (as he said many bands are), he has to take such steps as he sees fit in order to make sure the festival continues to be a place where bands want to play...

Sumeet's post perfectly sums up my opinion on this issue. This post hit all of the same points I would have made.

 

[Kenneth R.]

I can't understand it either. Of course, I'm not a musician, and perhaps if I was, it's possible that my perspective might differ. However, regardless of whether I understand it or you understand it, that's how it is... and Glenn has to deal with that reality. We can't ignore that fact just because it may not seem logical.

even as a musician, i still find it illogical to worry about potential bootlegging. it's not like any of these boots are ever going to compare to an "official" release of any kind, and for a band to fear potential publicity, to the point of paranoia and aversion to playing the show, that just strikes me as beyond strange.

 

[80s AL]

I might as well beat on this dead horse too.:hotjump:

Glenn brings quality every year, He does not want to compromise that by having bands he wants to HIRE(make that clear) to shoot him down cause they are not wanting to be bootlegged. People who don't understand why that is a big deal don't understand that music is a BUSINESS!!! A lot of these guys are managing their bands. This is their WORK!!!! Yes it is fun. But it ain't all a big party. It is still a job....do you want your job/mortgage in jeopardy cause of some selfish GRAB-A$$....chew on that for a lil.

I hate it. But I go to see my friends, bands, and gernerally have a good time.I have a family/house/career now, so I don't get out 2,3, or 5 days a week like I used to. So this once a year event means alot to me. I get to see people/friends from out-of-state(s) that I probably wouldn't get to see otherwise.

I get to see bands that I would not get to see otherwise.

The point I am making(if there is one) is that the LOYAL will go, and not let some "banning" of this or "out-law-ing" of that stop them. They will adapt, make sacrifices, and be true to what is important to them.

I love to take pictures too. Capture a "unique" moment that is seen thru your own eyes.

You can go to a party, meet 100 people,99 are gonna be the coolest people you have ever met and there is always gonna be ONE @$$HOLE....always!!!
In this case the number is bigger, and the @$$HOLEs are Bootleggers...

This is Glenn's house, this is Glenn's show. I respect his decision.

Those who want to "buck" the system will find themselves reading the posts here about PPVII rather than attending, I guess. That is fine too. As said before, this will open up some slots for people who will want to attend for the reasons I stated ealier.

I met Bryant this year. VERY cool guy.
But the F--- Y-- was a lil too much. I understand his frustration...

Time to dust off the 35mm and be ready to join my METAL-FRIENDS for a great weekend with a boat-anchor of a Minolta around my neck(maybe).

80's "offmysoapbox" AL

 

[sh0kr0k]

I understand people wanting to take pictures, but "No Cameras" is pretty standard at most shows (unless it's a verrrry small club). No camera phones, no disposable point and shoot, nothing.....That's been the norm for me at various clubs in the many different cities I've attended shows in....

I'm glad you brought this up or I was going to. People, face it - we're lucky to even have film cameras into an event like ProgPower. I can't even take a disposable into many of the local clubs for small shows, and CERTAINLY NOT for any national acts.

There are plenty of phots taken each year that are very professional and extremely high-quality. Perhaps Glenn will have a (extra?) photographer and then share the wonderful pictures with us after the show.

So what if you take a bunch of live pictures? You still get to be there. It's much nicer to enjoy the show with your own eyes instead of through a digital display screen. Besides, now there wont be so many cameras and arms in the air blocking the view

Everyone has valid points on both sides. You're all right and everyone else is wrong.

I'm thankful that we are allowed film cameras to take the pictures of what isn't on stage, like friends and meeting the bands. I'd be awefully sore if that priviledge was taken away, but I can't be upset about losing the opportunity to capture the same thing that 40 other also shot.

 

[Pellaz]

even as a musician, i still find it illogical to worry about potential bootlegging. it's not like any of these boots are ever going to compare to an "official" release of any kind, and for a band to fear potential publicity, to the point of paranoia and aversion to playing the show, that just strikes me as beyond strange.

Note, though, that Glenn posted in the original thread about the camera ban that one video bootlegger was observed showing off his video footage in one of the hotel lobbies....and Glenn said it was frighteningly good footage. I don't know if it was good enough to be sellable, or to compare with an 'official' release, but Glenn did say it.

 

[skeptik]

I can definitely see how Glenn lost money there.

 

[Pellaz]

Uh, it's not about Glenn losing money, it's about Glenn losing the bands he'd like to book due to their concerns over potentially 'quality' videotaping.

--But I'm sure you knew that, having read and comprehended this thread in its entirety already, right?

 

[skeptik]

He would have no bands to book if nobody came to the show. He also wouldn't bother with the show if he lost money.