what Obama has in store for service members wounded in battle

[J-Man]

Glad to see that you finally got around to reading the news from NINE MONTHS AGO

However, I will admit, that was a nice job pretending that you thought this was some breaking news story from today

Let me clear up something, I admit I hadn't heard of the plan Obama had for having sifting the responsibility of paying for wounded soldiers healthcare to the private sector, until my son-in-law send me a message about it, and to be honest i feel bad about not being up on the news.

When you refer to "the asshole", are you referring to President Obama, the "asshole" who was AGAINST sending soldiers to Iraq in the first place???

You know...IRAQ...the country that had ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO WITH 9-11???

When i referred to asshole yes i was referring to obama, but i also feel that the asshole bush and cheney in the same category, if not for bush and his grudge to finish what his father couldn't do, we would not be in this mess and we wouldn't have all those casulties
The other stories you have brought up I have voiced my opinions on time and time again, maybe not all of them on here but in other forums and in editorial colums in the paper here and I even sent one to the Army times, as far as the story on the body armour goes that is one that is very near and dear to my heart especially with a son-in-law over there now, and my son going in May(orders changed). We went out and priced torso body armour for both of them, and to get the best there is and the one that all the troops want it was $4500 per unit. We bought one and were going to buy another, but now we will just wait till Josh gets back and then give his to Anthony.

So you are saying that the military should get primo healthcare and we should get dogshit? This is pretty much the same argument Jon Stewart made with that dumbass Bill Kristol. You are admitting that a socialized healthcare system (the one the military has) = better than a private one.

I love our troops and have a profound respect for what they do, but I'm also a human being. I don't want you getting better healthcare than just because you are fighting. Why should my cancer-stricken family member get denied care due to pre-existing bullshit conditon clauses just because we're not surrendering our lives to Uncle Sam? Fuck that noise. If that's how it's going to be, I'm moving to Sweden.

Never said that. All I said that it was a slap in the face to the military for them to have to carry a private insurance that may not cover them for pre-exsisting conditons i.e. wounds substained in battle, and yes maybe i am saying that the military healthcare system is better, i know in some aspects it is, and it some aspects it sucks big time. I am not saying that the wounded military should be given exemptions for pre-exsisting conditions, i said they would probably be refused for pre-exsisting conditions, and the pre-exsisting conditions clause in any health care insurance sucks big time not just for the military but for anyone, and that should be addressed in any health care reform bill.

As with everything Obama does, the right loses their mind. The fact of the matter is, the insurance companies are making money hand over fist because they are free and clear of actually paying for the medical expenses of anyone who actually needs medical attention... the elderly, the sick and the wounded. Obama was looking for a way to shift some of this financial burden back into the private sector. He wasn't trying to hurt the American soldier, because he's a secret Muslim, born in Kenya, here to destroy the American way of life. He floated an idea, the American people spoke, and democracy worked as it should. I know this is a strange concept for those on the Right, who were use the "the Decider's" word being final.

Ironically, the same people complaining about this move (pundits, not UM posters) are the same people telling us the government is incapable of providing healthcare. Funny... isn't it? Apparently our government is only capable of providing healthcare to those who actually need it it; the wounded and the elderly.

As usual Gregg your insight into this is uplifting and spot on thanks.

So to sum up, I quoted a 9 month old story, that i should have been on top of from the beginning, sorry. I called obama and Asshole, when it should have been extended to the two bigger assholes that got us in this mess bush and his side kick cheney. I lost all respect for both of these men after we invaded IRAQ, and I am glad they are gone
Yes I want Healthcare reform, but not at the expense of a wounded soldier or a family who has a family member with serious pre-exsisting medical condition. Will there ever be a healthcare plan that is fair and equitable to everyone, i hope so but as long as we have political parties there will always be a chance that we won't get what is needed.

To sum things up further Yes I am a vetern and I have lived thru The Vietnam war, Desert Storm and all those skrimishes in between, i was wounded in Grenada, i have lived since 1970 with the Military Healthcare system, I like it, and have had no problems to speak of, except maybe long waits, and in one case a misdiagnosis(broken kneecap, and told it was bruised). All my children were born in a military hospital and reseived excellent care. Now as a veteran i do pay for this healthcare, we are under what is called Tricare, yes it is cheap, and yes it does cover almost all the medical bills, but not all so i have to have a supplement to pick up the rest.

I am proud to be a veteran, and would not have done it different, and I am proud of all the service members serving now and in the past and future.

 

[General Zod]

So to sum up, I quoted a 9 month old story, that i should have been on top of from the beginning, sorry. I called obama and Asshole, when it should have been extended to the two bigger assholes that got us in this mess bush and his side kick cheney. I lost all respect for both of these men after we invaded IRAQ, and I am glad they are gone

That stuff happens. Stories get buried in the noise and then an e-mail circulates and they seem like new news.

Yes I want Healthcare reform, but not at the expense of a wounded soldier or a family who has a family member with serious pre-exsisting medical condition. Will there ever be a healthcare plan that is fair and equitable to everyone, i hope so but as long as we have political parties there will always be a chance that we won't get what is needed.

I want a robust public option, but I doubt we'll get one.

I am proud to be a veteran, and would not have done it different, and I am proud of all the service members serving now and in the past and future.

Well said.

Zod

 

[StewiesSexyParties]

Wow, god forbid some people get some perks that other people don't. I love it. It's like when I worked for the school district and had to listen to people bitch about the benefits the teachers got but they didn't. Here's an idea for these people: Anyone who is really that envious of the healthcare soldiers get, how about joining the army? Don't like that cops and government employees get nice insurance benefits? Then be a police officer. If you want the benefits of a high stress public sector job, then FUCKING GET ONE. Instead of sitting on your ass begrudging everyone else on earth because they have something that you don't, go work for it or get bent. Sadly society has a "I want this and I want that but I don't want to do any of that other shit you normally have to do to get it" mentality.

I'm a hateful motherfucker and I'm the first to admit it, but even I don't have enough spare hate in me to storm around crying about shit like "other people have higher salaries than me" and other horseshit I have no business bitching about because I'd rather better my situation through hard work instead of moping around and pretending I deserve everything that everyone else has.

 

[StewiesSexyParties]

On another note, when in the flying fuck is Bush going to stop being the measuring stick for Obama? Way to set high standards for Mr. Messiah.

 

[Stingray11214]

Wow, god forbid some people get some perks that other people don't. I love it. It's like when I worked for the school district and had to listen to people bitch about the benefits the teachers got but they didn't. Here's an idea for these people: Anyone who is really that envious of the healthcare soldiers get, how about joining the army? Don't like that cops and government employees get nice insurance benefits? Then be a police officer. If you want the benefits of a high stress public sector job, then FUCKING GET ONE. Instead of sitting on your ass begrudging everyone else on earth because they have something that you don't, go work for it or get bent. Sadly society has a "I want this and I want that but I don't want to do any of that other shit you normally have to do to get it" mentality.

I'm a hateful motherfucker and I'm the first to admit it, but even I don't have enough spare hate in me to storm around crying about shit like "other people have higher salaries than me" and other horseshit I have no business bitching about because I'd rather better my situation through hard work instead of moping around and pretending I deserve everything that everyone else has.

Well said, good sir!

 

[James]

So to sum up, I quoted a 9 month old story, that i should have been on top of from the beginning, sorry. I called obama an Asshole, when it should have been extended to the two bigger assholes that got us in this mess bush and his side kick cheney. I lost all respect for both of these men after we invaded IRAQ, and I am glad they are gone
Yes I want Healthcare reform, but not at the expense of a wounded soldier or a family who has a family member with serious pre-exsisting medical condition. Will there ever be a healthcare plan that is fair and equitable to everyone, i hope so but as long as we have political parties there will always be a chance that we won't get what is needed.

To sum things up further Yes I am a vetern and I have lived thru The Vietnam war, Desert Storm and all those skrimishes in between, i was wounded in Grenada, i have lived since 1970 with the Military Healthcare system, I like it, and have had no problems to speak of, except maybe long waits, and in one case a misdiagnosis(broken kneecap, and told it was bruised). All my children were born in a military hospital and reseived excellent care. Now as a veteran i do pay for this healthcare, we are under what is called Tricare, yes it is cheap, and yes it does cover almost all the medical bills, but not all so i have to have a supplement to pick up the rest.

I am proud to be a veteran, and would not have done it different, and I am proud of all the service members serving now and in the past and future.

I would like to apologize for insinuating the posting of the story was anything other than an honest mistake; I sincerely mean that. To be perfectly honest, it wasn't even the story itself that bothered me, because it is an actual news item, so it's still worthy of discussion. Where I took issue was when you followed it up with the claim "especially when they want to give illegal immigrants FREE Healthcare" (because I've never actually seen anything to support such a claim). As soon as I saw this, I assumed you were starting one of these 'liberals care more about illegal immigrants than they do our military' type of threads. After the last several years of hearing liberals referred to as unpatriotic, America-hating traitors, I obviously wasn't in the mood for yet another thread of that ilk. I honestly don't care if someone hates Obama or thinks he's an asshole; my only concern is when liberals in general are portrayed as having anything but the utmost respect for the men and women who serve this country (past, present, and future). But, again, I don't actually know you, so I shouldn't have automatically assumed that was the intent of your post, and I'm sorry I was so quick to jump to that conclusion.

 

[AeonicSlumber]

Wow, god forbid some people get some perks that other people don't. I love it. It's like when I worked for the school district and had to listen to people bitch about the benefits the teachers got but they didn't. Here's an idea for these people: Anyone who is really that envious of the healthcare soldiers get, how about joining the army? Don't like that cops and government employees get nice insurance benefits? Then be a police officer. If you want the benefits of a high stress public sector job, then FUCKING GET ONE. Instead of sitting on your ass begrudging everyone else on earth because they have something that you don't, go work for it or get bent. Sadly society has a "I want this and I want that but I don't want to do any of that other shit you normally have to do to get it" mentality.

I'm a hateful motherfucker and I'm the first to admit it, but even I don't have enough spare hate in me to storm around crying about shit like "other people have higher salaries than me" and other horseshit I have no business bitching about because I'd rather better my situation through hard work instead of moping around and pretending I deserve everything that everyone else has.

Yeah, because it's a fucking "perk" that someone gets to live and someone else gets to die because one aspect of America's healthcare is run by corrupt money hungry cocksuckers that make more money seeing some poor citizen be forced to sell his car for an operation and another aspect of America's healthcare is run just the way it should be. The difference is that you have to join the military to get that? No, healthcare is a RIGHT, not a privilege. It makes me sick to my stomach that people even disagree with this.

Your argument has nothing to do with this. Extra pay and more benefits for working harder is one thing, living and dying and basic human rights is another. It's not even an issue of "hey we get great healthcare and the soldiers get god-tier healtchare." It's "hey we get DOGSHIT, and they get great healthcare."

so you want the same medical benefits as me but you aren't doing any of the work?

As I have said, I have nothing but respect for the military, and I applaud the stuff they have to go through day after day. My dad is a Vietnam veteran. but the fact of the matter is that one thing doesn't have to do with another. Just because you are defending your country doesn't mean that the people you are supposed to be defending in the first place have to die or be sent into poverty because of the greed of corporate health insurance. Nor does it mean that your "work" is more important than someone else's. A libertarian would probably be highly offended if you told him that the private sector isn't as important as the military! I'd say both are equally important for their own reasons, but that's another thread.

And for the record, I put work in quotation marks not to say that the military doesn't do work, but simply to use the same wording as you did.

 

[AeonicSlumber]

There's about 1/5 the people in Sweden as there are here too. Someone brought that up to me the other day. 1/5 may seem trivial, but when you're playing with population numbers, the cost scale is insane. It's easier and cheaper to take care of 60,000,000 people than 300,000,000. Not that we shouldn't find a way to make sure no one goes without health coverage (lol so many negatives), it's just not as easy as saying "WELL EUROPEAN COUNTRIES DO IT" as I thought.

That may be true, but it won't stop me from moving there in a few years if things don't get better. Personally, my health insurance will run out in a few years and if things don't change I'm outta here. I have more than enough friends over in Sweden, so it's no problem for me!

 

[johan68]

To be fair, J-Man has long ago admitted in another thread that the government can do health care right, and that VA medi bene's are great.



The military is completely voluntary, is a federally operated 'business' and is responsible for it's 'employees'. One of the reasons someone takes a job is for the benefits. Lifetime free health care is a benefit of joining the military, which is one of the only jobs you literally put your life on the line for the country (in before LOL BULLSHIT FAKE WARS AND STUFF).

Your argument is irrational. "I CANT HAVE WHAT YOU HAVE SO YOU SHOULDNT HAVE IT EITHER, EVEN THOUGH YOU'RE DOING WHATS REQUIRED TO HAVE IT AND I REFUSE TO."

There's about 1/5 the people in Sweden as there are here too. Someone brought that up to me the other day. 1/5 may seem trivial, but when you're playing with population numbers, the cost scale is insane. It's easier and cheaper to take care of 60,000,000 people than 300,000,000. Not that we shouldn't find a way to make sure no one goes without health coverage (lol so many negatives), it's just not as easy as saying "WELL EUROPEAN COUNTRIES DO IT" as I thought.

There are only about 9 million people in Sweden (just for the record)....

However, remember that there are only 9 million people to pay taxes as well....

Every country should be able to take care of their citizens.

 

[Metalmilitia2000]

Because we all know that more terrible sins of the past forgive less terrible sins of the present.

lol I just pwned your 50 page summary in 17 words.

I'll be the dick here. 18 words. Don't hate me nailz...

 

[Up&Away]

That may be true, but it won't stop me from moving there in a few years if things don't get better. Personally, my health insurance will run out in a few years and if things don't change I'm outta here. I have more than enough friends over in Sweden, so it's no problem for me!

Planes leave everyday...why wait? Get a jump on it if you don't like it here!

 

[J-Man]

I would like to apologize for insinuating the posting of the story was anything other than an honest mistake; I sincerely mean that. To be perfectly honest, it wasn't even the story itself that bothered me, because it is an actual news item, so it's still worthy of discussion. Where I took issue was when you followed it up with the claim "especially when they want to give illegal immigrants FREE Healthcare" (because I've never actually seen anything to support such a claim). As soon as I saw this, I assumed you were starting one of these 'liberals care more about illegal immigrants than they do our military' type of threads. After the last several years of hearing liberals referred to as unpatriotic, America-hating traitors, I obviously wasn't in the mood for yet another thread of that ilk. I honestly don't care if someone hates Obama or thinks he's an asshole; my only concern is when liberals in general are portrayed as having anything but the utmost respect for the men and women who serve this country (past, present, and future). But, again, I don't actually know you, so I shouldn't have automatically assumed that was the intent of your post, and I'm sorry I was so quick to jump to that conclusion.

Hey No Problem, I take no offense in legitimate arguments to my opinion, and yours was one. As to the giving illegals free healtcare, it has been put forth by some in California, and also here in Texas, so it may not have gotten national exposure.

As to Liberal bashing, it was not intended, I respect everyone for their political views whether liberal, conservative or what-not. The thing that irks me are those that don't support the troops, or are unpatriotic(there are those around), and especially bigots, not matter what type of bigotry.
thanks for the apology, even though it was not needed, it just goes to show, that you are a class person, and one who I would love to sit down with and discuss certain issues.

 

[StewiesSexyParties]

Yeah, because it's a fucking "perk" that someone gets to live and someone else gets to die because one aspect of America's healthcare is run by corrupt money hungry cocksuckers that make more money seeing some poor citizen be forced to sell his car for an operation and another aspect of America's healthcare is run just the way it should be. The difference is that you have to join the military to get that? No, healthcare is a RIGHT, not a privilege. It makes me sick to my stomach that people even disagree with this.

Your argument has nothing to do with this. Extra pay and more benefits for working harder is one thing, living and dying and basic human rights is another. It's not even an issue of "hey we get great healthcare and the soldiers get god-tier healtchare." It's "hey we get DOGSHIT, and they get great healthcare."

Left to die? No one gets turned away because of inability to pay.

I want to have a one on one talk with a guy who took a shit ton of extra schooling AFTER college in a builing that he helps pay to keep open, and that should be free because of fat, lazy, cock-sucking societal leeches who think that everything should be served to them on a silver platter at the expense of tax payers? Does this sound impractical to anyone else or is it just me? Fuck that horseshit. I'm not trying to say our current system is perfect, but for fuck's sake, it's mind-boggling that people think the socialistic crap that's being pushed right now is the answer. I'll restate: If the military has such enviable fucking healthcare, join the army. People can cry and stomp about how they deserve the same thing for free all day, but it just isn't practical. Oh well, I guess that leaves only hard work and self-responsibility as the only path left. Guess we're fucked.

 

[Purveyor Of Evil]

If you think healthcare is expensive now, wait until it's free.

 

[Metalmilitia2000]

If you think healthcare is expensive now, wait until it's free.

Nothing is ever truly free.

 

[rms]

As I have said, I have nothing but respect for the military, and I applaud the stuff they have to go through day after day. My dad is a Vietnam veteran. but the fact of the matter is that one thing doesn't have to do with another. Just because you are defending your country doesn't mean that the people you are supposed to be defending in the first place have to die or be sent into poverty because of the greed of corporate health insurance. Nor does it mean that your "work" is more important than someone else's. A libertarian would probably be highly offended if you told him that the private sector isn't as important as the military! I'd say both are equally important for their own reasons, but that's another thread.

And for the record, I put work in quotation marks not to say that the military doesn't do work, but simply to use the same wording as you did.

I dont agree with this everything is equal and has equal contributions bull so there's nothing really else to say

 

[freakchylde]

No, healthcare is a RIGHT, not a privilege. It makes me sick to my stomach that people even disagree with this.

But Health Insurance is not, and as much as the argument is trying to come up with Healthcare reform, it's ultimately insurance reform, which is going to do jack squat to bring the costs of care down.

 

[J-Man]

To have an effective Healthcare reform, i agree with freakchylde, the first thing that has to happen is a Health Insurance reform, and for that to happen there are some other things that have to happen: What about the amount of money it costs for someone to become a Doctor, Hundreds of thousands of dollars, and the cost of Malpractice insurance which is outrageous. Another thing is the cost of prescription drugs, bring the cost down.
Another thing is some people abuse the insurance they have now, They go to a hospital ememrgency room for a cold, or sore throat, and it may cost them or their insurance company in the neighborhood of $2000 for that visit, when they could either go to an urgent care clinic cost $200, or wait to see their Family Doctor the next day, cost $65 to $200. Durning the inital swime flu scare the ER at the hospital my wife works was seeing 150 patients a day with cold and flu like symptoms as compared to 10 before, result, two more Doctors assigned to the ER aand 8 more nurses, 3 more in the lab, and they were on 14 hour shifts, all this to cope with the volume.
I am sure that a comprehensive plan can be worked out that will benefit all the people that don't have healthcare Insurance, but for gosh sake let's work on it and not force a plan down everyone's throat

 

[Pellaz]

[....] Where I took issue was when you followed it up with the claim "especially when they want to give illegal immigrants FREE Healthcare" (because I've never actually seen anything to support such a claim).

Well, yeah, the Obama Administration routinely includes illegals in its totals of uninsured or under-insured Americans. Their stated goal of 100% coverage includes them...and since most of them pay no income taxes at the Federal level, it would effectively be free.

Ironically, I was at my health-insurer's in-house ******** a few weeks ago and they had the TV on CNN in the waiting room. The story that caught everyone's attention: "Over 85% of illegal immigrants in the United States have NO health insurance!" Implying that this was somehow an outrage.

Everyone present -- including some Latinos -- simply watched with mouths agape.

Yeah, because it's a fucking "perk" that someone gets to live and someone else gets to die because one aspect of America's healthcare is run by corrupt money hungry cocksuckers

Of course, you can't be referring to health insurance companies. Their profit margins are right around 2%.....firmly below that of the average supermarket chain, banking and finance, and most other types of businesses, and well below the profit-leading industry. (Railroads, surprisingly enough, at a whopping 12%.)

Don't make the mistake of equating large dollar figures with huge profits. In any large industry, you'll see big numbers. The important factor is profit margin. Health insurers aren't really racking up huge numbers there.

No, healthcare is a RIGHT, not a privilege. It makes me sick to my stomach that people even disagree with this.

Which portion of the United States Constitution confers that right?

Just because you are defending your country doesn't mean that the people you are supposed to be defending in the first place have to die or be sent into poverty because of the greed of corporate health insurance.

Umm, see above.

To have an effective Healthcare reform, i agree with freakchylde, the first thing that has to happen is a Health Insurance reform, and for that to happen there are some other things that have to happen: What about the amount of money it costs for someone to become a Doctor, Hundreds of thousands of dollars, and the cost of Malpractice insurance which is outrageous.

Attempts to include tort reform in ObamaCare --both the House and Senate versions -- have all been defeated. You can expect the cost of malpractice insurance -- which is at least one-quarter of the average MD's overall costs -- to stay incredibly high.

Another thing is some people abuse the insurance they have now, They go to a hospital ememrgency room for a cold, or sore throat, and it may cost them or their insurance company in the neighborhood of $2000 for that visit, when they could either go to an urgent care clinic cost $200, or wait to see their Family Doctor the next day, cost $65 to $200.

No question about it...and this is something that probably wouldn't improve under ObamaCare either.

I took my annual AED/CPR refresher course recently from a Grady Health System EMT -- Grady Hospital is Atlanta's main public hospital, and handles indigent care, etc. He told us that there are actually elderly female residents who will call 911 with some minor complaint, get transported to Grady at public expense, there to meet up with their friends and go shopping or whatnot. In effect, using the ambulance system as a taxi service. Due to abuses like this, and also the high number of indigents and illegals that Grady is required to treat, they recently had a serious financial scare and only barely avoided bankruptcy.

There were some good healthcare improvement ideas in H.R. 3400, including tort reform and the elimination of the state boundary restriction on offering wider group health plans, but of course, it was never allowed out of committee.

 

[Pellaz]

Wow, freaky. The board software automatically replaced a certain 8-letter word that means "place where you obtain medications" with asterisks. I had no idea I was so dangerous.
I have to assume that the Department of Homeland Security is on its way to my house even as I speak!