I somewhat agree, even if I'm the only one. Deliverence IMHO is their weakest album. It simply doesn't have the same effect on me as any of the others. I think it's so different for a reason though-namely that they didn't want blackwater park part 2. Mike said he wants the next one to be heavy bordering on black metal, so if that gives any indication I think it may follow the MAYH vein a bit more. He also said it might be a concept, and since MAYH and SL are my favorites from the Opeth catalogue, that's a very good sign. I'm really not worried.
When you know Opeth is lost to us...
- Thread starter GreatPhoenix
- Start date
I somewhat agree, even if I'm the only one. Deliverence IMHO is their weakest album. It simply doesn't have the same effect on me as any of the others. I think it's so different for a reason though-namely that they didn't want blackwater park part 2. Mike said he wants the next one to be heavy bordering on black metal, so if that gives any indication I think it may follow the MAYH vein a bit more. He also said it might be a concept, and since MAYH and SL are my favorites from the Opeth catalogue, that's a very good sign. I'm really not worried.
Blink 182 are sellouts, Linkin park are sell outs...well actually they're more a manufactured boyband so they couldn't sell out to begin with. It's laughable that some people are lumping Opeth in with bands that purposely change their music to appeal to popular culture and the masses.
There songs are still over ten minutes long and as good as they have ever been. As much as I love Morningrise and Still life etc, I don't want 10 copies of it. Opeth have done something different in every release, and you can bet that the next album will blow our minds with even more unexpected twists and turns. I don't understand people who say that D1+D2 are Opeth selling out and that they're shit, I think they're great albums and just shows the balls that an extreme metal band can do something like that. Would Christina Aguilera start doing death vocals? no because her fans would not appreciate that and she would lose money.
The fact that Opeth has achieved more financial success and recognition as a result of the last 2 albums is nothing to do with them selling out. Good music is good music, why should people be expected to get less money the better it is? It's this mindset that causes doctors working on cures for aids to be earning 1000 times less than a football player or a stripper..or lawyer. Opeth deserve every success they get, everyone who has seen them live knows that they are genuine people with the same love of music as there fans.
I don't like seeing people accuse Opeth of selling out because I know they read the forums sometimes, and it must be a harsh thing for your fans to say shit like that.
Don't let the bastards get you down Opeth.
There songs are still over ten minutes long and as good as they have ever been. As much as I love Morningrise and Still life etc, I don't want 10 copies of it. Opeth have done something different in every release, and you can bet that the next album will blow our minds with even more unexpected twists and turns. I don't understand people who say that D1+D2 are Opeth selling out and that they're shit, I think they're great albums and just shows the balls that an extreme metal band can do something like that. Would Christina Aguilera start doing death vocals? no because her fans would not appreciate that and she would lose money.
The fact that Opeth has achieved more financial success and recognition as a result of the last 2 albums is nothing to do with them selling out. Good music is good music, why should people be expected to get less money the better it is? It's this mindset that causes doctors working on cures for aids to be earning 1000 times less than a football player or a stripper..or lawyer. Opeth deserve every success they get, everyone who has seen them live knows that they are genuine people with the same love of music as there fans.
I don't like seeing people accuse Opeth of selling out because I know they read the forums sometimes, and it must be a harsh thing for your fans to say shit like that.
Don't let the bastards get you down Opeth.
TheFourthHorseman
In The Twilight World
Rejvk don't stick to the term selling out so much. No one here has mentioned that they've somehow sold out, which is a stupid fucking term to begin with. Reading your post is boring cause you're going on about selling out all the time. If you don't want Opeth to read about selling out, don't fucking mention it then.
As I said before, whether their songs are "as good as they have ever been" is debatable, but I certainly understand people who have fears that the next album won't be too diverse after Deliverance.
I just hope Mikael means [concerning the next album] brutal in the sense of My Arms-style riffs and beautiful in the sense of something like Still Life. It's not like I want them to go back and just combine those albums for the next one [and include a bit of Morningrise
], but those are pretty much the only thing I can refer to. But like I said before, just something different from Deliverance will satisfy me. Doesn't mean I'll like the album though, but I hope for that too. I have high hopes at least.
I don't understand how one can find Wreath emotional though. The riffing is pretty boring, there's too much double bass and the lyrics are obscure as hell. Nightmares aren't too emotional either. Just goes to show it's all about opinions I guess.
Maybe what some people fail to see is that the people who like the old stuff a lot don't all think that the new stuff sucks, it's just that at least to me the heaviness of Deliverance doesn't have the same addictiveness as the heavy-as-fuck riffs on April Ethereal or When for example. Granted, Master's Apprentices has some of that, but even that [the best song on the album] is not nearly as good as the old stuff [riff-wise, in this case].
I guess that's about it.
As I said before, whether their songs are "as good as they have ever been" is debatable, but I certainly understand people who have fears that the next album won't be too diverse after Deliverance.
I just hope Mikael means [concerning the next album] brutal in the sense of My Arms-style riffs and beautiful in the sense of something like Still Life. It's not like I want them to go back and just combine those albums for the next one [and include a bit of Morningrise
], but those are pretty much the only thing I can refer to. But like I said before, just something different from Deliverance will satisfy me. Doesn't mean I'll like the album though, but I hope for that too. I have high hopes at least.I don't understand how one can find Wreath emotional though. The riffing is pretty boring, there's too much double bass and the lyrics are obscure as hell. Nightmares aren't too emotional either. Just goes to show it's all about opinions I guess.
Maybe what some people fail to see is that the people who like the old stuff a lot don't all think that the new stuff sucks, it's just that at least to me the heaviness of Deliverance doesn't have the same addictiveness as the heavy-as-fuck riffs on April Ethereal or When for example. Granted, Master's Apprentices has some of that, but even that [the best song on the album] is not nearly as good as the old stuff [riff-wise, in this case].
I guess that's about it.
Sorry for boring you. I know that this particular topic wasn't implicitly about Opeth selling out, but I see it quite often crop up on the boards and have not said anything in any other posts about it so I took the opportunity to express my view, if that was boring then I apologise. I too am interested in what will become of the next album. I hope "beautiful" is more in the vein of the Morningrise than Still life which is often quoted as the "Beautiful album" Though they all hold a sense of beauty in one way or another which is the greatness of Opeth.
It's all about opinion sure some of the riffs may not be of the same degree as those featured in My arms Your Hearse, but it's apples and oranges. Though in your opinion Deliverance doesn't have the same "addictive heaviness" as MAYH riffery, I personally find riffs like the end of Deliverance to be addictively heavier than April Ethereal, It doesn't mean I like one song more than the other. One of my favourite Opeth songs, A fair Judgement would not have been suitable in any other album other than Deliverance and for this I think Deliverance is a good album. Just as TBYF was very "Morningrise" I love how diverse Opeth are.
I am not accusing anyone of not liking the new album I was just taking the opportunity to respond to the one or two "fans" that slag off the new album. Everyone has their own opinon and there's nothing wrong with not liking the album. But you cannot deny that there havn't been a few who have accused them of selling out (as there is bound to be, no matter what band). I was voicing my opinon to those few. Please understand this
It's all about opinion sure some of the riffs may not be of the same degree as those featured in My arms Your Hearse, but it's apples and oranges. Though in your opinion Deliverance doesn't have the same "addictive heaviness" as MAYH riffery, I personally find riffs like the end of Deliverance to be addictively heavier than April Ethereal, It doesn't mean I like one song more than the other. One of my favourite Opeth songs, A fair Judgement would not have been suitable in any other album other than Deliverance and for this I think Deliverance is a good album. Just as TBYF was very "Morningrise" I love how diverse Opeth are.
I am not accusing anyone of not liking the new album I was just taking the opportunity to respond to the one or two "fans" that slag off the new album. Everyone has their own opinon and there's nothing wrong with not liking the album. But you cannot deny that there havn't been a few who have accused them of selling out (as there is bound to be, no matter what band). I was voicing my opinon to those few. Please understand this
The Poona of Peshwa
Blood Glutton
trendend
New Metal Member
I think one of the problems is that there are so many different types of Opeth fans, it's impossible to come to a consensus. There are those (like myself) who have been with the band since Orchid, and still would love to hear the old stuff over the newer stuff. But, they have yet to make an album that disappoints or bores me, I just prefer the "rawness" (not the black metal meaning of the word) of the first 2 albums. Then there are those fans who came in later, say around MAYH or Still Life, who heard them when they started to get heavier, and stopped repeating certain riffs over and over for 5 minutes Even after that, you have the fans that entered during the "Steven Wilson" era, where they became a much more polished-sounding band, and had more "structure" to their songs. I'm not saying any of these are any better or worse, but it causes there to be such differing opinions, you're always going to have people argue or bitch about something Opeth does. In the 15+ years I've been into metal, I can count on one hand the bands that I listen to that have yet to disappoint with a new release. In fact, the only one that comes to mind right now is Testament. Bottom line, as has been mentioned before, Opeth is going to do what Opeth wants to do, and I think that is by far their strongest quality. They don't have the potential to sell out, death metal bands will never reach the financial heights of the Metallicas and the Linkin Parks, etc. And I'm fairly confident Opeth has no desire to do so. Until they release an album the equivalent of say "Load", "Swansong", or "Risk", Opeth will continue to be one of my top 5 favorite bands, period!
Even after that, you have the fans that entered during the "Steven Wilson" era, where they became a much more polished-sounding band, and had more "structure" to their songs. I'm not saying any of these are any better or worse, but it causes there to be such differing opinions, you're always going to have people argue or bitch about something Opeth does. In the 15+ years I've been into metal, I can count on one hand the bands that I listen to that have yet to disappoint with a new release. In fact, the only one that comes to mind right now is Testament. Bottom line, as has been mentioned before, Opeth is going to do what Opeth wants to do, and I think that is by far their strongest quality. They don't have the potential to sell out, death metal bands will never reach the financial heights of the Metallicas and the Linkin Parks, etc. And I'm fairly confident Opeth has no desire to do so. Until they release an album the equivalent of say "Load", "Swansong", or "Risk", Opeth will continue to be one of my top 5 favorite bands, period!
ggggggu
New Metal Member
Blackwater Park is Opeth's best album by far and the second best is probably Deliverance. Damnation was experimental and certainly not their worst album.
Blackwater Park is so much more sophisticated than their previous albums, which says a lot.
Blackwater Park is so much more sophisticated than their previous albums, which says a lot.
- Nov 23, 2002
- 10,935
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As is spelling retarded with two Ts. I wasn't worrying about it, I was just speculating.Mr. Niel said:
MountainDweller
Under The Dark Moon
I don't think they'll ever sell out as Opeth. Maybe they'll do some more commercial side-projects in the future, but I think Opeth will likely always remain true to form.
I'm personally ready for a regular Opeth album (Deliverance and Damnation being experimental and all). I hope they bring in some of the elements of the older albums, along with the elements of the new. I think that's what made "Still Life" to probably be Opeth at their peak (so far). The earlier albums had a very jazzy and even classical kind of sound mixed in with the heavy parts, "MAYH" lost some aspects of that and became very heavy and introduced some new things (such as the concept album). "Still Life" brought all the aspects of the first three albums into one and made it a masterpiece. It was heavy, but had the jazzy and almost classical aspects thrown back in, AND it was a very well written concept album. To me, "Blackwater Park" threw out almost everything of the first four albums and created a sound that distanced Opeth from their earlier sounds (other than the switching the heavy/acoustic guitar and distorted/clean vocals). The lyrics also seemed to degrade a little from the previous two efforts. "Blackwater Park" is probably the Opeth album I listen to the least. Then came along the experiemental albums.
I hope they take their time in making the next album, instead of rushing it like they did the last two. It'd also be cool if Mike would let Peter and Martin M. in on some of the guitar/bass writing that way it can be a full-band effort in the writing process. I'd love to hear what a total collaboration would bring. I also hope they bring in some of the earlier aspects again and mix them in with the newer aspects they've brought in after "Still Life". And even though Mike probably won't do another concept (although I'd welcome it greatly because I feel that's when the lyrics are at their best), I hope he focuses more on writing individual stories througout each song...mini-concepts if you will. Perhaps a song that almost has "movements" as "Black Rose Immortal" does, with each part telling a different part of the story.
Ok, now I'm rambling a bit and didn't mean for this to be this long of a post. So, yeah, there's my bit.
I'm personally ready for a regular Opeth album (Deliverance and Damnation being experimental and all). I hope they bring in some of the elements of the older albums, along with the elements of the new. I think that's what made "Still Life" to probably be Opeth at their peak (so far). The earlier albums had a very jazzy and even classical kind of sound mixed in with the heavy parts, "MAYH" lost some aspects of that and became very heavy and introduced some new things (such as the concept album). "Still Life" brought all the aspects of the first three albums into one and made it a masterpiece. It was heavy, but had the jazzy and almost classical aspects thrown back in, AND it was a very well written concept album. To me, "Blackwater Park" threw out almost everything of the first four albums and created a sound that distanced Opeth from their earlier sounds (other than the switching the heavy/acoustic guitar and distorted/clean vocals). The lyrics also seemed to degrade a little from the previous two efforts. "Blackwater Park" is probably the Opeth album I listen to the least. Then came along the experiemental albums.
I hope they take their time in making the next album, instead of rushing it like they did the last two. It'd also be cool if Mike would let Peter and Martin M. in on some of the guitar/bass writing that way it can be a full-band effort in the writing process. I'd love to hear what a total collaboration would bring. I also hope they bring in some of the earlier aspects again and mix them in with the newer aspects they've brought in after "Still Life". And even though Mike probably won't do another concept (although I'd welcome it greatly because I feel that's when the lyrics are at their best), I hope he focuses more on writing individual stories througout each song...mini-concepts if you will.
Perhaps a song that almost has "movements" as "Black Rose Immortal" does, with each part telling a different part of the story.Ok, now I'm rambling a bit and didn't mean for this to be this long of a post. So, yeah, there's my bit.
MountainDweller
Under The Dark Moon
Oh, and I feel Opeth may have become a little bit more distanced from their fans than they were three or four years ago, but that's just because their fan base has grown immensely and they've become more popular. It's harder for them to keep up and be "personal" with half a million fans (or more).
KielbasaSausage
YARRRRG
Protected Witness
Magickal Theatre 33
N1Ne
Person
MountainDweller: Mike actually says in the dvd documentary that he is thinking about a concept for the next album, he also mentions it possibly being "extreme to borderline black metal"..
Bleak Eyes
Irrelevant
My comments may hav been mentioned in her somewhere, I did not read every single post. I think that Opeth will break up before they completely change their sound. Mikael seems like he is getting tired or just becoming older even though he is only going to be 30 in a few months. That is why I think he stopped with Bloodbath. When I saw them a couple of weeks ago, he seemed very annoyed almost. Maybe it is because they have toured for a long time and he has been through a lot of shit in the past couple of years. I do not know, we will find out a lot when the album is completed.
Reign in Acai
Of Elephant and Man
ramses
Member
- Jan 19, 2004
- 1,103
- 0
- 36
If they bring in a producer that has worked with big selling commercial bands, then you start worrying. Example-Dream Theater-Falling into Infinity-Kevin Shirley. Metallica-Bob Rock Yes-90125-Trevor Horn. Rush-Presto-Rupert Hine. I still like these bands, exept for Metallica. ( I have their first four) and if Opeth ever did what these bands did by bringing in a big name commercial producer, it will suck, but I'll just not buy the album. And remember that Mikael's biggest influences are all non commercial prog/metal bands. And as long as the band pleases themselves first, and not critics/fans, or record companies..it'll be ok.
TheFourthHorseman
In The Twilight World
Ah, AllWithin, what's with getting all edgy when someone criticizes Metallica in a different way than most people? Are you perhaps not, after all, in favour of everyone being entitled to one's own opinion, but rather in favour of blatant flaming like the kind you receive(d)?
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